| Author |
Message |
    
Ft_bstrd
| | Posted on Sunday, September 26, 2010 - 02:13 am: | 
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What's amazing to me is the idea of "well they earned it already".
Really?
So if I commit tax fraud, I should just tell the IRS when they come to seize my property "You can't, I already earned it"?
Your actions have consequences. In order to send a message, the consequence here should be you keep your vested benefits but any promise of future benefits are gone.
Period.
That's the way it happens every where else. What makes these clowns special? |
Whisperstealth
| | Posted on Sunday, September 26, 2010 - 08:11 am: |
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The "vested" benefits are the ones I think they should keep. The future ones should be gone. You didn't make that clear in your first post. |
Iamarchangel
| | Posted on Sunday, September 26, 2010 - 10:22 am: |
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Ft B: that's what would happen here. On a discipline termination, the individual would still have their pension (years x amount). However, they would not get early retirement benefits, they would have to wait until 60. They would not get any buy-out option. Their other benefits would not continue. They would not get separation benefits in most cases.
Because of all these penalties, some individual opt for a cash out of their pension benefits. That leaves them nothing for the future.
So, yes, as a union we fight to protect the worker. However, your point is valid: sometimes other workers are at risk. Understand the union's limitations: only management can exercise discipline and fire. If management follows the process, anybody can be disciplined to termination. All the union does in that case is monitor the process. |
Pwnzor
| | Posted on Sunday, September 26, 2010 - 10:32 am: |
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They need to lose everything. |
Iamarchangel
| | Posted on Sunday, September 26, 2010 - 12:34 pm: |
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Two principles:
If the management has allowed it to continue for a time, (usually 10 years), the worker doesn't take the whole hit. Obviously, management didn't "manage" the situation.
If keeping my job depended on how well I kept the 10 commandments, I would have starved to death years ago. |
Doerman
| | Posted on Sunday, September 26, 2010 - 01:41 pm: |
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Union means: Outsourced HR
Which is fine.
However, like Imarchangel says, it does not relive management from managing day to day and ensure the process of creating a product is safe and efficient. |
Xdigitalx
| | Posted on Sunday, September 26, 2010 - 02:37 pm: |
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I worked at a custom vehicle manufacturer a few years ago. My supervisor (and most of his close friends/coworkers) all went into parking lot to smoke bones and/or drink. Either break time (2x a day) or at lunch time. At least 4x a week I would come back from my lunch and was like I was working with beavus or butthead for the rest of the afternoon. It was funny for the 1st min. After that it just plain sucked.
Everyone "knew" what was going on,... kinda like "don't ask, don't tell" They were with the company since the beginning (20/30+yrs) and were old school, had most of the ideas/concepts in their heads and used pencil/paper to design. These people were extremely talented and valuable to the company. The product was top-notch, and if they were ever fired, the company would fold without a doubt. And the management knew this. It was their own fault for keeping it union-like,...meaning.. one department would only do the job assigned, NEVER EVER helping another department. So... you have a bunch of different departments... only worrying about their own area. It was about 250+ employees. Part of my job was to transfer what was drawn on paper and the procedures to build/install to cad dwgs and have monkey simple instructions for it.
They didn't like the idea of me writing down all their procedures and these guys weren't into teaching anyone else their skills but... "IF" something happened to any of the senior employees... the company would be at risk. (something did to one of them , which is why I was hired in the first place) But Alas.. Beavus and Butthead won,... hopefully they will still be in business in 2-3 years,...maybe get my job back. (got laid off)
Yup...more proof..that there IS a reason they call it DOPE. mmmm THC ice cream anyone?!?!?!
I don't smoke pot or drink or smoke cigs anymore. (except for a DOGFISH 60 min with a juicy bacon cheddar burger from Chili's takeout or a steak or ribs once or twice a month) I stopped smokin weed in my early 20's. (in the mid 80's)
I WILL enjoy a toke now and then but it depends on what she looks like.  |
Ducxl
| | Posted on Sunday, September 26, 2010 - 04:00 pm: |
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They're drinking excessively and need reprimand.
At an old job i was permitted(with a wink and a nod)a beer over thursday lunch after cashing my paycheck.It was an extended lunch
MODERATION.These guys are reckless |
Toona
| | Posted on Sunday, September 26, 2010 - 04:40 pm: |
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This is a simple solution that doesn't involve the unions...or management...
Just call the police.
Case closed. |
Iamarchangel
| | Posted on Sunday, September 26, 2010 - 05:49 pm: |
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It's not that simple. Sorry. |
Ft_bstrd
| | Posted on Sunday, September 26, 2010 - 06:09 pm: |
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I don't mind if they have "A" beer with lunch. My industry is replete with cocktail lunches.
The part that galls me is the getting ripped and high and then operating machinery where others are at risk. |
Ourdee
| | Posted on Sunday, September 26, 2010 - 06:53 pm: |
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Ft', At Chry, if you hit someone in the plant with a vehicle, you loose your plant license for one year. You are only allowed out the gate during lunch and not on paid break time. They randomly search lunch boxes at the gate. The local police do patrol for smokers and drinkers around lunch time. SHH, the smokers don't realize it. At my last plant the plant manager swore up and down that the dope came in in the pizza deliveries. He was ignorant in that, since the pizzas came in because the dope had been smoked. Cause and effect, not effect of the effect. That is why they appeared stoned after the pizza came. He was a brilliant man with the exception of that thought. Being in the union, it was not my place to explain. |
Ourdee
| | Posted on Monday, September 27, 2010 - 06:49 pm: |
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I found this today:
TheScoop
Chrysler Group News
13 Jefferson North employees discharged.
It has been determined that 13 employees engaged in behavior that violated the Company’s Standards of Conduct and these 13 employees were discharged today. Two remaining employees will receive a one month disciplinary layoff without pay.
Is that better? |
Ft_bstrd
| | Posted on Monday, September 27, 2010 - 08:37 pm: |
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Yep. Feel better. |
Ourdee
| | Posted on Monday, September 27, 2010 - 08:48 pm: |
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Me too. |
Bluzm2
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 28, 2010 - 12:04 am: |
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I'm still not buying any Chrysler product again...
Once was enough, just a POS.... |
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