| Author | Message | ||
     Midknyte |
http://www.nbc.com/outsourced/ I really hope they get some backlash... | ||
| Badlionsfan |
People probably said the same thing when M*A*S*H came out. | ||
| Blake |
The M*A*S*H show came out about twenty years after the Korean war; outsourcing is a very sore topic now. | ||
| Koz5150 |
No offense, but I don't see anything wrong with it. The show, or outsourcing. Fact of the matter is American workers believe they should come first, ahead of the company. When you do that you get the situation HD is in. Guys paid $30/hr to push a broom and work a wrench on an assembly line? With a proper mix of out sourcing many American companies can stay competitive on a global scale. Besides, tapping into countries like India makes complete sense when you look at how much smarter their workforce is then ours is. Did you know they (India) have more students graduating school with honors then we have students graduating overall? Time to wake up and realize that you are not matching skills with the guy next door anymore, it's a much smaller world and your boss has a much bigger workforce to choose from. I would suggest you take some time to get the skills you need to compete, lean out your lifestyle, and prepare for the future because sitting around and complaining about a TV show is not going to stop it from happening. (Message edited by koz5150 on September 13, 2010) (Message edited by koz5150 on September 13, 2010) | ||
| Kyrocket |
I think the trailer is hilarious, especially the part about the grits. | ||
| Blake |
>>> Did you know they (India) have more students graduating school with honors then we have students graduating overall? Koz, if you check your grammar in the above, you may find it quite humorous. It's not matching skills that is the sore issue concerning outsourcing in America; it is the disparity between labor rates driven in large part by the artificially devalued Chinese currency relative to the dollar. | ||
| S3ters |
This is a talented Nashville artist SETH WALKER. Support Live Music In Your Town. 2 Feet Left To The Ceiling http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EbpIkJlLjLA Days Like This http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkWz4IBuTUA Leap Of Faith http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nU6tzcqoptQ You Don't Know Me http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A0qpcnEUJCA Sorry Wrong Thread (Message edited by S3ters on September 13, 2010) | ||
| Marksm |
That is based on a movie of the same name. I thoroughly enjoyed the movie and I hope the TV series does well. I watched the movie just before my first trip to India and it actually helped to prepare me for some of the things there. Outsourcing sucks, but it's not their fault. They have to make a living just like anyone else. | ||
| Koz5150 |
Yeah, I missed one up there... I read this article right after reading about the HD vote happeing in Wisconsin today. http://www.jsonline.com/business/102748549.html Kinda a bit of the same thing. HD workers are complaining that their workforce is going to downsize overall and use "temp" workers who get 1/2 the pay and no benefits. How can you complain about corporate greed when you make more money on an assembly line then most workers make in white collar jobs today. Sounds like personal greed to me. These guys are scared that many of them will be replaced, and they should be. There is no other company in the world that will pay them that kind of money for the skills they have. Why should HD, because of some labor agreement with a union? I can imagine how competative HD would be if it were a non union shop? Heck maybe they could even make a full size bike for less then $10,000. It's not like they need to spend money on R&D..... | ||
| Reepicheep |
I have heard that and understand the stats, but that sure as heck hasn't been my experience, unless the "smarter" margin is being completely consumed by overcoming the language barrier. My (first hand) experience has been that our offshore staff isn't any brighter or dumber than our onshore staff. I haven't seen compelling cost differences. Offshore is cheaper by the staff hour, but for one reason or another the job never seems to get done until costs are back to about what it would have cost locally, especially if you are factoring in agility and time to market. The big reasons to outsource, at least in IT, is scalability. You can add 500 people for a 18 month project, and just stop when you are done, without trying to figure out what the heck you are going to do with those extra 500 employees. (IMHO, YMMV, not speaking on behalf of anyone but myself, etc) | ||
| Rainman |
We Amerikens are so dum-stupid. To make it betterer for companies to stay here we should all strive tooo live the same lifestile they do in Mumbai. That way we can be competeteve with the rest of the wurld. Who do we think we are, anyway, wanting to make enough money to buy single-family homes, motorcycles over 125cc and SUVs? | ||
| Xl1200r |
I agree that it's not their fault in India - they're just trying to make a buck and we'd all do the same. But they can be difficult to communicate with and in my personal experience the work generated is not typically on par with someone on shore, employee or consultant. I think the fault lies more with the companies who hire these people without looking at anything more than the bottom line. My father's company was one of the first to really start outsourcing, and started with a call center (as most companies do). They performance was so poor that they moved the operation back to the States. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
check the tides, they are turning, the number of Ukrainian / Russian girls wanting to come to the US has DROPPED dramatically since last Christmas (2008) My side job has dwindled to I now have more demand than supply for the first time in 15 years. Whatever you think America is... the world view is that it isnt any more. (Message edited by cityxslicker on September 13, 2010) | ||
| Rocketsprink |
Do you honestly think if H-D went all non unuon, their bikes would be cheaper? Why can't people understand that 99 % of the time the price of the product does not change relative to the production cost. and again, for the millionth time, why must you put down the American worker for making a good living wage. If you want to make a few bucks a week, by all means, move to India, China or one of the many other countries that treat their workers like slaves. there is a reason for that too. no workers rights. for once I totally agree with Blake. it's in very poor taste. How would you feel about a comedy about 9-11 or the Irag war or terrorists attacking the USA? | ||
| Hootowl |
"the number of Ukrainian / Russian girls wanting to come to the US has DROPPED dramatically since last Christmas (2008)" Yeah, that's my fault. They won't send me any more of them. They claim too many have died in what I euphemistically call my "activity pit". | ||
| Blake |
With such heartening agreement I hesitate to oppose the following, but what the heck... >>> why must you put down the American worker for making a good living wage. Rocco, Why do you imagine anyone is putting down the worker? I don't see it. I sense it is more the big labor unions that people are put off with. Don't the non-union folks at Toyota earn about the same pay as their unionized counterparts? I know two recent retirees from the GM plant in Arlington, Texas. They both hated the union support for underachieving workers; the saw their own union as being in favor of more members rather than better members, and they both hated it. Of course they were both achievement oriented hard working folks. Are they wrong? | ||
| Slaughter |
In California, we outsource-in-place as do many other states. No need to send work overseas. | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
I know about outsourcing in place, half the truck drivers in the UK are from Poland or Hungary or somewhere east of the former Iron Curtain. Why? because they can be paid less of course. This doesn't happen in France. Why not? because the French have nationally negotiated pay scales in the transport industry, so there's no incentive. The downside for many UK hauliers is that accident rates & consequently insurance rates have gone through the roof. Not to mention the rigs that have gone on a trip never to be seen again. Free market forces at work, "Live by the sword, Die by the sword." | ||
| Midknyte |
I was not aware that it was a movie. Have added to my Netflix que for context. Thanks. | ||
| Midknyte |
The whole of American industry is disheartening. In my [only one] generation [ago], it was understood that you entered the workforce at the bottom and worked your way up. It's sad how we've side-sourced our entry / low level jobs to foreign / immigrant labor because we are too proud and expect everything at once. Entitlement has taken full and firm root. It's stupid how we now suffer from a lack of jobs now, largely because we've refused them en' mass, and no one, no one, is doing the math on this. | ||
| Rocketsprink |
Well Blake, are you worth what you get paid? If so, why? How would you feel if they brought in some one to do exactly what you do, but made 1/2 the pay and no benefits? What would you think? Would you care? Do you think it's fair? Do they not deserve the same payrate as you? Would you be willing to get knocked down to their "level"? Now to your original question. I believe Koz made my points. Reread his post. Putting down the American worker. Happens here more than you believe. Mostly when unions are involved. Lazy. Stupid. Whiners. Greedy. What more do you need to see? Being that only 12% of the workforce is union, where do the other lazy workers come from? All non union employees are over achievers? What cloud are you living on? Let's face it, if you're good you're good and if you're bad your bad. All depends on the worker, union or not. For a company that built itself on the backs of the employees , to turn around and treat theml like garbage is very sad. Wonder if a $30000 HD will now cost $15000? Yeah, right. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
I feel sorry for the average union worker. They have been just as abused by their union leadership as any corporation. At least there is some sort of symbiotic relationship between management and labor. The AFL-CIO flushed $10M dollars down the drain in JUST Arkansas on a loser candidate because Obama requested it of Trumka. That's just one very small state and a hopeless race. Let's assume that this level is used by AFL-CIO leadership in only half the states (some are solidly blue and don't need and others are solidly red and no use). That's $250,000,000 of union dues paid by hard working men and women for which those assets are not at work for them providing benefits. At $50,000 salary per year, those dollars could have kept 5,000 American workers employed. This same leadership seeks to keep the flow of illegal immigrants flowing in the hopes of partnering with Administration leadership to work to turn illegal immigrants into loyal Democrats and union members. Average wage levels are secondary to all those new dues to be had. Sorry American worker. Better luck next time. Deplorable. | ||
| Spdrxb |
I worked for United Airlines Pre 9/11. Unions have their place in big company's (sometimes). However I think they are a double edged sword. Unions allow a fair "step" ladder payscale and work rules, for the most part nobody can complain about. Unfortunetly they also protect the "lazy" and "most senior" workers as others have said. After and 9/11 when the layoffs started the most efficient and harder workers that wanted to be there, were the ones that had to go. Frustrating, even though they may have deserved to stay due to their years of service,frankly they were just coasting till retirement and didn't do poop!Go home and get your pension etc let someone else have a turn! There are a lot of undue financial burdens that unions put on a company. One of the crazy rules we had, the whole crew was directed by the company to be at the time clock 15 min. before clock-out time.The reason for that was if we punched out late the "union" rule was to pay us an hour whether we worked the hour or not, 5 min over= 1 hour of pay. Talk about waste of manpower and money! imagine 10 guys all around the time clock waiting for 15-20 min before punch out! | ||
| Rocketsprink |
I believe it was Reagan that granted amnesty to some 6 million illegals, no? Ftbstrd, have you ever belonged to a union? | ||
| Wheelybueller |
+1 Ft_bstrd | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Yep, Reagan granted amnesty to 6M illegals with the expectation that the illegal immigration laws passed at the time would be enforced, citizenship would be verified, and employers hiring illegal immigrants would be punished. Now what happened? Nothing. It was never funded. The laws were not executed. By either party. For the Democrats the illegal immigrants became potential voters. For Republicans they became cheap labor. Deplorable. Yes I was in a union. I had to become part of some sort of performing artist's union when I sang on Sandy Patty's Gift Goes On Christmas album when I was 9 years old. I got paid $25. They withheld Social Security and Medicare. And my membership dues. I think it was $.50. Other than high school jobs, I worked for the first three years out of college for someone else. After that, I've been self employed. Have you ever been self employed? Hired an employee? I used to run a $3.5M annual sale store with 80 employees. At Age 24. | ||
| Blake |
I'm self employed and perfectly happy with the free market. I sure don't need a union speaking for me. You conveniently ignored the testimony of my two retired union friends. Do you not find it valid? I suspect your union is much smaller and much less corrupted as a result. | ||
| Pwnzor |
Did you know they (India) have more students graduating school with honors then we have students graduating overall? US Population: 308 million (325 million if you count illegals) India's population: 1.2 Billion They also do not share our immigration problem. | ||
| Pwnzor |
half the truck drivers in the UK are from Poland or Hungary or somewhere east of the former Iron Curtain. Half of ours are Mexicans. In the border states, they can afford to work for half the commission of an American Owner-Operator because they come up here with 600 gallons of Mexican diesel on board and Mexican license plates. They'll run local all week long pulling containers out of the harbors or doing intermodal turns, then go back home and refuel for the next week. When we're not outsourcing, we're letting interlopers come in and take the work right out from under us. | ||
| Slaughter |
we're letting interlopers come in and take the work right out from under us. Outsourcing-in-place |
