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Oisterska
| | Posted on Sunday, June 27, 2010 - 12:40 pm: | 
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[I know that I am going to get flamed right off the board for these comments, but •••• it. At least any Mexican reading this post will know that SOMEONE cares about their lives. That being said, I cannot believe that I took the bait... anyone else on BWB NOT a right-wing republican?]
When our country is in the tanks because of right wing war budget overspending (unfair jab, i acknowledge that it is not just the Repubs, they are just a symptom of the 2-party political disease), our children are idiots because their schools are unfunded, and are enlisted to fight and die in overseas campaigns which by all accounts could be avoided we sit here and blame who? Certainly not ourselves...
That's right, blame the illegal immigrants. Do not blame our government, our wars, our oil-consumption, our greed, our self-centric, run-the-world-because-it-is-our-right attitude. That couldn't play any part in our debts, our failing economy or our shitf^cked status in world opinion. nah... It is because there are people coming here who want to work. That must be it. If you can't get by on minimum wage, learn to use less. Or get some education. (Wait, we addressed this already. What education?)
So go ahead, continue to blame the Mexicans for the state of our country when it is fairly obvious that it is our own greed and over-extension that put us in this pickle.
Want to stop illegal immigration?
MAKE IT LEGAL. (And easy).
I make no claims to be a Dem or a Repub. In fact the two parties we are stuck with are another part of the reason we are in this situation.
p.s. I have no intention of following this thread. I know what the responses to this will likely be...
p.p.s. Walls work, right? Just consult history: Berlin, China, Gaza/israel/west bank. Or have we edited that out of our textbooks as well? Thank you texas board of education!
(Message edited by oisterska on June 27, 2010) |
Aesquire
| | Posted on Sunday, June 27, 2010 - 03:34 pm: |
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...war budget overspending... Some truth to that. The war we are in right now is made much harder by the huge defense cuts from the 1992-2000 admin. The entire Army in 2001 was smaller than the deployed army in Desert Storm. Anyway, Defense spending is less than entitlement spending, even with the financial idiocy of the 2000-2008 admin.'s war spending.
our children are idiots because their schools are unfunded
Completely disagree. Not that the children are not being taught anything, that's true... but the funding is plenty, more than ever, and the results worse. I leave it to you to blame Political Correctness, Teachers Unions, or the deliberate dumbing of our schools for evil reasons by progressives. I blame all of the above plus parents who don't fraking care. ( or are themselves too stupid to do anything about teaching their kids.)
...are enlisted to fight and die in overseas campaigns which by all accounts could be avoided...
I think we may agree on the substance, and not the reasons. If not for the actions of J.Carter, Iran would not be a violent, racist, sexist theocracy that is poised to nuke Israel, has been supplying arms and shelter to those who do mass murder in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, Lebanon, Gaza, the Sudan, etc. etc. The entire middle east would be a very different place if not for the anti semite leaders we have had ( and indeed may have today... ) that have made horrific choices about that region, leading to the war we are in today.
That's right, blame the illegal immigrants. Do not blame our government, our wars, our oil-consumption, our greed,....
No, we don't blame the illegals....anyone with a brain knows why they want to leave sh&tville and come here. It's better here.
I blame the Government, the greedy businessmen, the politicians who want fraudulent votes, and get them, en mass.
Oil consumption has nothing to do with criminal trespass. Do you have a self loathing problem with being American, or are you just parroting propaganda? ( and did believing that crap make you feel bad about yourself? )
MAKE IT LEGAL. (And easy).
YES! you got that part right! Why, then is that NOT what the amnesty guys want to do? Please think about that. Really.
Or have we edited that out of our textbooks as well? Yes they have.
Sorry you have no stated intention for defending your point of view, engaging in rational discussion, or being a rational human. I agree that we should make legal immigration easier, and illegal harder.
Again I ask, WHY is that NOT what the "comprehensive" reform guys want? I'm pretty sure they are ripping you off. Me too. And absolutely the illegals that will be forced to pay union dues or be deported. |
Ft_bstrd
| | Posted on Sunday, June 27, 2010 - 03:44 pm: |
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The "we aren't going to enforce the border until the wave comprehensive immigration reform" rhetoric is bravo sierra.
The American people know it. |
Crackhead
| | Posted on Monday, June 28, 2010 - 07:27 am: |
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My ancestors obeyed the law and went through Ellis Island.
Why should we trust people that broke the law the first moment the entered American Soil?
Think of this as you were a supervisor looking to hire a new employee, would you hire the guy that was arrested for "Breaking and Entering" into your business the night before the interview? |
Johnnylunchbox
| | Posted on Monday, June 28, 2010 - 09:12 am: |
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My parents were immigrants. They came here by 747 on legal visas about 40 years ago. They even went back home while their visas had to be renewed. They were far from rich, but managed to work hard, save money and sacrifice for the costs of legal citizenship. They worked their asses off to learn English, even watching Sesame Street and Mr. Rogers' Neighborhood with my older brother to practice their language skills. This sense of entitlement that is so pervasive is sickening. |
Reindog
| | Posted on Monday, June 28, 2010 - 10:06 am: |
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oisterska
Try reading history instead of smoking dope. No nation can endure with open borders but I suspect you don't care who your master is as you will be subservient to them. Glad you hurl a spitball and then claim that aren't going to follow this thread. That is the mark of cowardice. Why open your mouth when you can't open your ears? |
Crackhead
| | Posted on Monday, June 28, 2010 - 10:29 am: |
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The process for immigration should be hard. Think of it as a test to see if the applicant is worthy. Similar to going through bootcamp before you are a member of the military. |
Ft_bstrd
| | Posted on Monday, June 28, 2010 - 10:54 am: |
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The last great empire to have an "open borders" was Rome.
It worked out really well for them. |
Orman1649
| | Posted on Monday, June 28, 2010 - 11:20 am: |
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I don't know why (some) Americans are the a-holes of the world for wanting stricter border policies. I would bet that at least 75% of countries out there have more strict fines & penalties for being an illegal alien. What other country can you go to illegally and sign up for school, welfare, and get a drivers license? What other country can you go to and have people fighting for your *right* (lol) to be in that country illegally and milk all the social services? It's not just Mexicans…I don't care what color your skin is. If you are here in my country illegally, GTFO. It's that simple. You get no freebies, you get no free pass. I don't care if you have paid taxes or graduated 1st in your class at Harvard. You broke the law. You will be fined/imprisoned/deported/all of the above….what is the problem here? It's probably because most of them don't want to be bothered by learning English.
How many people know what the immigration process actually consists of? I find it hard to believe it is "too hard" for all these illegals to follow the process. How many people followed the proccess 100 years ago? I guess we should just open the door and not care how many people move here, their means to support themselves, & their criminal record. We need more deadbeats slurping up the social services and getting pissed off if their food stamps get cut back b/c they are entitled to those! We need an even more lax border policy so its even easier for criminals and terrorists to flood in.
Amnesty? B.S. - I think Americans are too hard on child mollesters, we should give them all amnesty….who decides what laws are OK to break and what laws need to be upheld?
Anchor babies? B.S. - The children have citizenship because they were born on American soil…ok, I'm fine with that. The parents can go sit in w/e country they are citizens from and leave their kid w/legal citizens or they can take the kid home and he/she can come back to America on his/her 18th birthday. |
Reindog
| | Posted on Monday, June 28, 2010 - 02:30 pm: |
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quote:Boasting a population that is 97% Hispanic, more than half foreign born, and 40% illegal, the Los Angeles County, Calif., incorporated city of Maywood has achieved the Reconquista goal. It is now as lawless and chaotic as any place in Mexico. Maywood is a warning to every city and town in America.
The Maywood City Council announced this week that after years of radical policies, corruption and scandal, the city was broke and all city employees would be laid off and essential city services contracted out to neighboring cities or to L.A. County government.
quote:Maywood is the warning of what happens when illegal immigrants, resisting assimilation as Americans, bring with their growing numbers the corruption and the radical politics of their home countries. Add the radical home-grown anti-Americanism of Hispanic "leaders" and groups like La Raza and you get schools where learning is replaced with indoctrination, business and jobs replaced by welfare and gangs, and a poisonous stew of entitlement politics.
Welcome to Maywood, Mexico
(Message edited by reindog on June 28, 2010) |
Aesquire
| | Posted on Monday, June 28, 2010 - 08:25 pm: |
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Oisterska, I'm sorry for the "self loathing" comment. THAT was a flame, and undeserved.
This is pretty obviously a political or social comment thread. Argument will happen. Expecting different is like sticking a finger in a lightbulb socket and expecting to get wet.
Flaming, while it does happen, is most frequently coming from the kind of guy who, when someone points out an error in fact or logic, instead of rethinking his position, checking the truth, or admitting a mistake, jumps to personal attack instead of honesty and truth. Even the obviously opinionated me will admit to error, if you show me I'm wrong.
Now, my OPINION, is that most of the flaming jerk types are leftist, but not all, and I can document the argument techniques used by them, if you care to read books on Communism, Dialectic materialism, or Revolutionary Thought. Skip Mao, though, the little red book is mostly a rip off. Read "Art Of War" by Sun Tzu, instead, he lies a lot less.
"Rules for Radicals" by Alinsky is the Bible of the current crop of Politicians. Barack's mentors worked with Alinsky, Hillary wrote her thesis praising him, ( Barack's seems to be missing, along with his grandparent's FBI files.... make what you will about that Hillary's IS available online.. I've read it. It's not bad, she's pretty smart, for a Young Republican from Wellesley ) and the techniques Alisky promotes are very obvious, if you read his book. ( I did, back when Hillary was writing her thesis. It's a real eye opener on political theory, and technique. ) Read it. If you follow it, I will flame you. It's a book on how to lie and cheat.
Some here do get flamed. Some deserve it, others don't. I often see the following tactic. ( the subject is irrelevant to the tactic. )
A-"kawasakis suck because the frames are spaghetti. My old H1 was a suicide machine. Lots of power, hinge in the middle."
B-"True the old H1 & H2's were prone to toss the rider, but if you could hang on, you'd win. Besides, that was a long time ago, a modern ZX or a Concours has nothing to do with the old stuff. You should try one"
A-"Yeah? Well George Bush rode a Z1 and he not only couldn't adjust the suspension, but murdered 50 million people lying about counter steering!!!"
Ok, ok, I suck at that kind of argument....but you get the idea. We can tell pretty easy which one, A or B is the jerk in the above example.... |
Jstfrfun
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 29, 2010 - 04:23 pm: |
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Anyone who knows anything of life in Mexico has empathy for the mexican people, however, the problems of a people with that kind of government cannot be an excuse for this country to abandon its laws in order to accomodate the downtrodden.
Our educational system is overcrowded with non-english speaking children who drag down the educational process to there rate of learning. Our infrastructure is over taxed by people who want to live under the radar, but still enjoy the lifestyle the rest of the legitimate immigrants and citizens have earned!
NO ! the laws of this country cannot be subverted by the greedier and more over extended 16 million criminal tresspassers!
Since when is the solution to criminality to ignore or abolish the law ?
I will not drop a text bomb and then pretend to ignore the fallout, I will follow this thread, here or on the backfire board and continue to text my "experienced" position and views...just for the fun of it. |
Aptbldr
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 29, 2010 - 06:10 pm: |
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Repeal of Prohibition is an example of when its (apparently) okay to abolish the law.
Immigration law started in the US about 125 years ago.
There were no illegal immigrant "problems" before then, but plenty of immigrants.
Immigrant quotas are ignored by those who seem astounded by these notorious & dangerous law-breakers.
Free immigration policies represent economic freedom, and perhaps a significant measure of US global economic strength. |
Liquorwhere
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 29, 2010 - 07:25 pm: |
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The last great empire to have an "open borders" was Rome.
It worked out really well for them.
Actually it did, they lasted longer than we have so far, but we may catch those 440 years, and have left impressions on the world that continue to this day even in this hemisphere, if you need an example just look at your roads...you might want to pick another example.
As far as the strain on the tax payer I agree it is a problem with health care and services, that is why a sales tax instead of an income tax makes more sense for federal funding, and that socialized medicine is a fraud. The sales tax catches all the economies or at least does a much better job of catching the economies.
As far as illegals taking jobs, if your job is taken in this country by someone that is illiterate on average in there own language, unable to speak the language of the country they are in, and all they have is a strong back, a willingness to work for anything seeking a better life and you think that losing your job is your biggest problem I think you should look deeper. If you are this person and you are a native to this country you are, IMHO lazy, weak and have no future if this is your competition, and you lose.
I see more immigrants working, maybe for less than Americans, maybe because they are not "too good" for it, mostly jobs the Americans I have seen don't want...who knows....and I see my friends that have immigrated here as more American than some born here as they know for a fact the opportunity that exists within these GREAT borders.
If you really want to deny people the ability to come here and live the American Dream you need to re-read the poem...
Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
"Keep ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she
With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
I don't agree we should keep people out of here, I think we should welcome them. It is just an opinion but that was what the great melting pot was supposed to be isn't it??? |
Reindog
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 29, 2010 - 08:06 pm: |
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As stated earlier, I am a strong proponent of immigration for people who have strong skill sets to make America greater. We do not need ditch diggers right now because we already have plenty of ditch diggers who think they are above that work simply because they are Americans. After Obama runs out of money and no one will lend us any more money, Americans will beg, if not demand, that they be hired to do the ditch digging. Just like in the Great Depression. Being in denial won't change this simple but ugly fact.
Don't want to be a ditch digger? Simple. Get two or three jobs and work your way through college if you have no other means. Otherwise, stand in line for those "shovel ready" projects. The Party is over. |
Ft_bstrd
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 29, 2010 - 08:07 pm: |
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Actually it did
You need to reread history.
Open borders and the lack of assimilation of those immigrants (peaceful and not) into Roman society was the single largest contributor to the fall of Rome.
The overdependency of the masses upon the government overstrained the coffers. The monetary strain resulted in military weakness and porous borders with immigrants seeking to avail themselves of Roman society without interest in assimilation. This further strained the system further military weakness allowing even less benevolent "immigrants", Goths and the Huns. |
Aesquire
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 29, 2010 - 10:23 pm: |
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So, if I break into your house, I have every right to be there & eat your food, use your stuff as you?
The problem with almost all the immigration laws are that THEY are racist. Too many new Poles? they put quota's on Poles.
How come japanese-american students are not minorities for college entrance racist quotas?
Same answer. Racist politicians, Racist laws.
Open does not work. Your house is mine sucker.
Rational works. Rational is not even proposed by Congress.
Make it easier to be legal, harder to be a criminal, and the problem gets smaller. It's never going to go away, but right now, illegal immigration plus social programs to redistribute wealth equals closed emergency rooms and bankrupt governments.
See California.
Ft, don't forget the death of patriotism and the welfare state, ( called Bread & Circus's ) as causes of the death of Rome.
When the Legions had more immigrants than Citizens..... loyalty to Rome died with Rome itself. |
Crackhead
| | Posted on Thursday, July 15, 2010 - 11:44 am: |
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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100715/ap_on_re_us/us _immigration_states
I am going to contact MD's attorney general to tell him, I want Maryland to join in with the other states supporting AZ. |
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