| Author | Message | ||
     Hootowl |
Watching that video that was posted earlier, I have to wonder what the government could do that BP isn't already doing. Sure are a lot of people who think the government should be doing more. Last I checked (OK, I didn't really check) the government doesn't have the equipment or the experience to do what BP is doing. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Hoot... listening to them, the things the government are doing that BP isn't, is assigning blame to others (including, predictably, George Bush) for the problem, and taking credit for solutions other people are creating. So far it sounds like somebody at BP got a lot of good men killed (a really big deal) and did a lot of damage to the environment (not as big a deal, but still really important). That person, and BP as a whole, are going to pay a really high price as a result (which is as it should be). | ||
| Aesquire |
The govt. was supposed to have x miles of oil boom ready to use in the Gulf. There are plans for oil leaks and it looks like they are not working good. Now, I don't think you can blame anyone, yet. Obama, Bush, Clinton, not so much for bad plans & execution of. A President is supposed to give clear orders. He's not expected to calculate how much gear is needed and where it's stored. If Obama the day the explosion happened, called the Coast Guard, and the agencies involved in oil stuff, he did the first step right. just tell them handle it, report back. If the plans suck or the gear that's supposed to be there isn't, that's more Congress and the Federal agencies involved. Your opinion may vary. I'm not sure what's been done right or wrong, so I'll hold judgment on the corruption/incompetency until I'm not ignorant. Don't expect the politicians or media to gather facts & tell us about them, it's make yourself ratings time. ( so they won't wait for facts to judge ) I have a low opinion of them right now. Also, the govt. should be smoothing the way for stuff like dredged sand barriers. I don't know what's going on there, but the State govt.'s are bitching about the Feds, again. So there should be a good well designed effort to deal with the oil spill by the area governments.......but the actual plugging the hole business is beyond the competency and abilities of anyone but an oil company. Apple computers can't build me a new valve head, and the Rangers can't raise the wreckage. The State dept. sure can't run the barges, and the welding isn't going to get done by the White House catering dept. | ||
| Aesquire |
Here's a rational "don't get the panties in an uproar" editorial. http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=NjVlYjlmZ WJhNzdlZWUwMjVlMzZhYzE0ODQzNDg3ZTE= | ||
| Aesquire |
http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=MmUyYjZjY mMzZTRhMzg3ZTEzZmYzYTlhOGRkYzM1OTQ= http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=ZDU2OTA5Z TRmNzY2YTUzMGRlODIzNzVjOGJhZTQyNDk= I'm going to wait for the AFTER action report before I blame anyone. Bitch, that's just natural, but blame....wait & see. | ||
| Whatever |
I just watched the National Geographic show on the incident response. I am actually quite astounded that more men were not lost now. I feel bad for the families that lost their loved ones... but what I can say is Bravo to the US Coast Guard for getting the critically injured to hospitals and searching for the missing. Another thing I think people really need to take into account is the magnitude and complexity of the oil slick... they are tracking it on NASA satellites but still cannot get the thing stopped. Even only a week after the blowout they were saying the spill was the size of Jamaica. We can put a man on the moon, but we can't "fix" the undersea problem?  | ||
| Hootowl |
It is easier to get to the moon than the deepest parts of the ocean, assuming that you want to live through the experience. The pressure at the well head is over 2000 PSI. | ||
| Xb12xmike |
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| Glitch |
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| Hex |
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| Xb12xmike |
Does anyone actually know how big the reservoir/oil trap is? | ||
| Blake |
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| Whatever |
It's a big 'un http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2009/sep/02/bp- oil-find-gulf-of-mexico | ||
| Blake |
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100014240527487041 13504575264721101985024.html Harrowing, tragic story of what exactly transpired on the Transocean Deepwater Horizon just prior to, during, and after the blowout. A must read. | ||
| Court |
Interesting, and scary, to listen to the possible effect this layer of dark oil atop the water may have on the hurricane season . . . BP's problems would take on a new dimension with that oil scattered across Oklahoma and Missouri. | ||
| Reindog |
There is now a great opportunity for technological advancement in preventing future blowouts. Obama once again, is taking precisely the wrong action, but soon he will be irrelevant. At the rate he is exposing himself, Charlotte will be sipping tea and voting for Palin to get this guy off the stage.  It appears that there were structural and management systems failures that led to this accident ala the Challenger explosion. The hurry up and git er done mentality is dangerous and exists in both free and totalitarian societies. We have a better chance of learning from our mistakes. This isn't the biggest oil spill but it is a damned sight not pretty. (Message edited by reindog on May 28, 2010) | ||
| Whatever |
Maybe I am not understanding this correctly, but what both these articles are saying is that TWO sub-contractors to BP told them they had some MAJOR problems... and the BP executives did not listen... First, Halliburton had told them that their procedures were incorrect and they needed to follow the proper procedure for cementing the well... BP opted to do it quicker at risk by emptying the mud out before emplacing the cement outside the casing... big big big mistake... Then, Transocean almost mutinied over the fact that BP was not doing the proper Quality tests before continuing operations by circulating all of the mud to see if it was absorbing gas... BP then sent the specialists home 12 to 16 hours pre-maturely... I was reserving from blaming BP, but it seems like BP now stands for "Big Problem"... and the sad fact is that almost all of those men had wives and children at home... I hope those families sue the pants off of BP and win... although that will not bring their fathers and husbands back... btw I think Palin is a complete joke...  ALSO, unless Department of the Interior/ Minerals Management Executive was consulting directly with Obama's administration on the decisions they made, they have YET AGAIN dropped the ball on the Public's Trust they were sworn to uphold... Think about this, Department of the Interior (the oversight agency for the Bureau of Indian Affairs) is the same federal agency that "accidentally" misplaced over 3 BILLION dollars worth of money that belonged to the Native American's oil and minerals claims... Those crooks should have all been cleaned out after that fiasco... (Message edited by Whatever on May 28, 2010) | ||
| Aesquire |
Char, help me here...It seems that an oil slick would reduce evaporation and reduce the forces added to a hurricane? It seems that "the hurricanes are coming" schtick is utter bull. Here's an anti BP opinion piece. http://www.nationalreview.com/planet-gore/13287/bl ame-bp/chris-horner | ||
| Gregtonn |
"We can put a man on the moon, but we can't "fix" the undersea problem?" We could, and did, at one time put men on the moon. Using currently available technology we can no longer do so. The Space Shuttle is only able to achieve low earth orbit. In order to return to the moon we would either have to develop new launch vehicles or return to currently obsolete technology. The "latest and greatest" technology often has its shortcomings. G | ||
| Whatever |
I do not know how oil would effect the weather... I am no meteorologist and I am no oceanographer, although I did dream one day of being an oceanographer... I would think the biggest problem with the oil is the dissolved oxygen that so many aquatic species need to survive would get pretty messed up... ie... depleted... causing organisms in the area to basically suffocate... Anyhow, not looking too good right now for BP... like I said... BIG PROBLEM... I am not going to patronize them anymore...  BIG PrickS (Message edited by Whatever on May 29, 2010) | ||
| Gregtonn |
"Char, help me here...It seems that an oil slick would reduce evaporation and reduce the forces added to a hurricane? It seems that "the hurricanes are coming" schtick is utter bull." Water surface temperature not evaporation is what adds the most energy to a hurricane. Darker water surfaces (oil slick) like asphalt results in higher surface temperatures thus adding more energy to hurricanes. G | ||
| Sifo |
I seem to recall that you need evaporation to carry the heat into the atmosphere in the form of water vapor. Personally I doubt that the experts have enough real world data on this type of thing to really model it well. Also NOAA has in recent years repeatedly warned us about terrible hurricane seasons only to have egg on their face time after time. The experts seem to not be able to model this stuff very well under normal conditions. The sky could be falling, but it's still up there in my neck of the woods. | ||
| Sifo |
I also wonder what the real effect of a hurricane would be on the oil slick. No doubt that surface winds drive an oil slick, but hurricanes are a pretty different animal than typical surface winds. Choppy seas help to disperse the oil by keeping it from laying on the surface. You certainly would get plenty of choppy seas from a hurricane. Again I wonder about our ability to reasonably model and predict what the outcome would be in the real world. | ||
| Hex |
Does anyone actually know how big the reservoir/oil trap is? http://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2010/05 /how-much-oil-remains-under-the-gulf/57411/ ...Left unattended, the Macondo prospect would fully deplete because the pool of oil sits under the weight of thousands of feet of ocean and rock, he said: "The earth is providing the pressure." | ||
| Gregtonn |
"Choppy seas help to disperse the oil by keeping it from laying on the surface." I agree that hurricanes may be a good thing with respect to dispersing the oil. Nature has ways of healing herself, many of which we don't understand. G | ||
| Gregtonn |
"First, Halliburton had told them that their procedures were incorrect and they needed to follow the proper procedure for cementing the well..." Careful there Char.  As a lib you know that Halliburton is supposed to be evil. You are bordering on heresy by implying they were trying to prevent this disaster. G  | ||
| Xb12xmike |
If 50+ million barrels of oil leaks out into the gulf... I think we will have more things to worry about the who's fault it was. It could happen... Why aren't we preparing for THAT? I mean.. we don't even know for sure if we seal this leak... that the pressure will leak out somewhere else and/or explode into a bigger leak. But, for sure, once we find out who's fault it is, we can sue THEM too!! (sarcasm) | ||
| Whatever |
According to some I am not a liberal... but a socialist...  Every evil corporation has good people working for it, as every corrupt government agency has good people too... I think the problem here was that the people in charge at BP just didn't give a crap for anything but the bottom line... which is all too common today... Next thing you know they will be "outsourcing" their labor because they have to pay for their stupid environmental disaster they created... they will start shipping in workers from Mexico or South America that they pay half as much... just wait... I tell ya... It all stinks!!!  Sounds like the guys on the drill rig floor knew exactly what was going on and did the right thing, as did the supervisor that was running up there when the thing blew up... unfortunately they and their families payed the heaviest price... while the man in charge was too stupid to call in a mayday immediately... Alright... time to ride... I am outa here... | ||
| Blake |
I sure wouldn't have waited for authorization to "push the button". I don't understand people that are slaves to the letter of the law. I still don't understand why they can't just close the rams. The annular is toast, so be it, but what is stopping the other two sets of BOP systems from functioning? Char, I think the casing is fully cemented and tested. The cement they are trying to place now and also when the blowout occurred is the cement plug(s) inside the casing. Now without any drill string in the well, I guess they are just pumping mud as fast as they can. Doesn't sound like a good prospect for killing the well, but I sure don't know. Cut the darn riser off at the BOP or just above it where it's still nice and straight, get a drill string inserted, plug the riser or down inside the casing, wherever makes the most sense. Then collect oil and gas via choke and kill lines that they now have installed for pumping mud. Why is that so tough? Cowboy? Drop in a giant 100 ton lead bullet like a huge needle valve. Seems they are stuck on conventional technology. Reportedly the riser is made from high strength steel. Heck why not fish the riser off the sea floor and put a patch on it's compromised section(s)? This is starting to piss me off. | ||
| Blake |
I also agree with Char, it sure sounds like the BP boss on rig was over-eagerly looking to be a hero by cutting corners to save some money ($500,000/day rig rate). In the end however, it was Transocean's call, and they failed the test miserably. Transocean could have kicked the BP boss off the rig if needed. The captain is king and he works for BP. The toolpusher has final say on drilling issues wrt the rig. It's no different than a crane for hire complete with operator. If you ask the operator to do something that he feels is too risky, not safe, he will simply refuse, no matter how much of a fit the contractor who hired him may throw. When mud starts rising in the pits that is a glaringly clear red light that a friggin nightmare is about to happen. How the heck do they not have methane detectors in the intakes of all engines on the rig and an automated means to kill the engines or re-route to alternate air intake ducting should methane be detected? Answer, lack of imagination. Happens all the time. |
