| Author | Message | ||
     Blake |
"If we're going to keep perusing deep water offshore drilling, I suggest the oil industries involved need to be able to get people down to the seafloor at what ever depth they are drilling." Why? You want human pilots inside Air Force drones too? | ||
| Blake |
Alvin sounds nice, but has ZERO capability for heavy industrial work and need not apply. It would be an observation only device, not any more valuable than robotic subs with cameras. | ||
| Hex |
Every time we have had to service my Grandpa's Telescope (HST), we have sent people to do it, not robots. We only send robots to reposition it, not fix or maintain it. Anyway, I'm just thinking what these NEW industry regulations will be. Any suggestions from anyone interested should be encouraged in open forum/think tank environments. | ||
| Hex |
Keep it real. As real as the illustration as presented by BP above? I notice only ONE minor leak from the end of the broken pipe, not TWO as would be accurate according to other reports. (Second leak should have been represented above BOP in illustration.) | ||
| Aesquire |
I'm in favor of more manned subs with industrial abilities. But. As the trapped sub sends fading messages up to the surface, as power & air run out, ( "I love you Honey, tell the kids I love them..." } how loud will the outcry from ANY admin ( much less this one that runs IMHO completely on emotion based propaganda ) be to halt such dangerous things when "robots can do them with no risk to human life"? Now nothing can replace human judgment, and having an actual window to look through, or better yet a Lexan sphere, has got to give better views than limited cameras. But even if you could run scuba down there with some magic mixture, I'm not strong enough to turn the wrenches involved with fixing a bop. ( plus you'd need a habitat at that depth to decompress in for days, no possibility of quick medical attention or evacuation ) Even a Jim suit with power manipulators is iffy for the task. But I agree with Hex, a manned sub with manipulators and the power & range to be useful 1-2 miles down would be great to have. Think Obama would give them a tax break for that purpose?  I think we should stuff politicians down the hole till the leak stops. | ||
| Aesquire |
Remember Skylab? It took a human in a suit to fix it. No way a Robot, even the latest from Sony could have done the job. Sometimes you have to see the glitch and heave on something while kicking it. The good Mirror ( spare ) for Hubble was built by Kodak, Too bad they never built a second telescope. Thanks to new lenses and very smart, brave astronauts Hubble is a wonder. Your gramps should be proud. ( unless he's the one that has them save a few hundred bucks by skipping the knife edge test that would have show the mirror was very precisely wrong before assembly, then I'd tease him a lot if I were you ) I agree manned gear would be useful. I think it's hilarious you think the "popular mechanix" illustration should be accurate. | ||
| Reindog |
The zombies are shambling around on the seabed floor according to World War Z and some of them have been known to bite through protective suits. They are a big problem around oil platforms. | ||
| Hex |
New Underwater Footage Of Oil Leak With "Insertion Tube" -- Is It Working? (VIDEO) http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kevin-grandia/breaki ng-new-underwater-f_b_580489.html | ||
| Blake |
Pretty dramatic change in appearance. Looks like lots of gas. The easy way to see how well the insertion collector is working is to look at what is coming out topside. | ||
| Blake |
Eric, The BOP is the size of a four story building. It is comprised of MASSIVE mongo heavy steel components secured by bolts too big for mere human manipulation. It isn't your grandpa's telescope. The offshore drilling industry, contrary to what you imagine, is incredibly skilled in subsea robotic work. Before they can hook onto the choke and kill and perform the junk shot to plug up the flow, they have to design, build, test, and deploy the required system including miles of connecting piping that must all be suspended from a floating/heaving drill ship. On the drill ship are the massive pumps and hydraulic equipment required to perform the junk shot. They no fit on sub. Again, Alvin need not apply. If we had a big mongo deep sea manned sub with required equipment/capability then maybe it would prove valuable, but still unnecessary. I ask again, what do you imagine a man in a sub at 5,000 feet would do? Specifically? Spare me the false analogies this time. Don't disparage robotic operations. Surgeons are now using robotics to operate on humans and are saving lives. | ||
| Hex |
Well, I feel better now that I wrote the President: http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact Dear President Obama. I rallied for you. I voted for you. I want you to use every resource you have to stop this oil leak, permanently. I suggest 'Plan Z'. You know the Russian one? The one where you nuke this well closed immediately. Mini-nuke 2000+ feet below the ocean floor, and directly adjacent to the well shaft. This is a really bad situation. My Grandfather was C. J. T. Ryan. Q security engineer for Lockheed. Hubble Space Telescope chief engineer. He helped this nation understand underground nuclear detonation. You need to use his and other's knowledge and stop this gulf oil release. Good luck. Do it now. Eric Ryan xxx-xxx-xxxx cell  https://www.cstars.miami.edu/Media/photo-gallery?func=detail&id=186#joomimg (Message edited by Hex on May 19, 2010) | ||
| Reindog |
Dear Eric, I'll get right on it. Venceremos. Signed, Barack Obama | ||
| Slaughter |
To recommend the use of humans at those depths in submersibles is just silly. IN order to have viewing windows at those pressures, the windows are TEENY. Field of view is FAR BETTER on a TV Screen than looking through a 6-inch conical window. The manipulations must ALL be done through remote manipulators. Putting a human at depth and at risk might sound good from an emotional standpoint but makes ZERO sense from a technical perspective. You have a crew at depth, using remote manipulators and in order to get a GOOD view of the work-space, they're looking through TV displays. What do you gain? | ||
| Hex |
What would Red do? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Adair "If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." | ||
| Glitch |
Well, I feel better now that I wrote the President:  | ||
| Glitch |
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Reminds me of the saying. "If you think heathcare is expensive, wait until it's free" | ||
| Hex |
Good reference report on Deep Submergence Vehicles. It somewhat supports your argument for ROVs, but also lauds DSVs usefulness. http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ship/dsv.htm This one has a panoramic view at 3000 ft:  | ||
| Hex |
Glitch, they're wiping tears from their eyes... | ||
| Hex |
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| Glitch |
Yeah, because they can't believe some of the mail they get | ||
| Hex |
"People start pollution, people can stop it." | ||
| Glitch |
"People start pollution, people can stop it." The day I can confirm that you have stopped polluting and torturing fish, is the same day I'll do the same. | ||
| Hootowl |
Last I heard those tar balls they found in Florida were not from the gulf spill. Chemistry is wrong. Wonder where they came from? Bilge pumping? Natural seepage? There are places along the California coast where tar seeps out of the ground right next to the ocean. Does oil seep out of the sea bed in the Caribbean? | ||
| Hootowl |
"I think we should stuff politicians down the hole till the leak stops." That will never work. They're too slimy to form a plug. | ||
| Glitch |
That will never work. They're too slimy to form a plug. Maybe, but at this point I think we ought to give it a try. It won't hurt. | ||
| Hootowl |
True dat. I volunteer the delegates from the Great State of Texas. | ||
| Hex |
It is now the size of the state of Florida. http://rapidfire.sci.gsfc.nasa.gov/subsets/?subset=USA7  | ||
| Blake |
>>> "It is now the size of the state of Florida. " Your pronouncement is ridiculously over-eager. Eric, you're confusing ocean reflectance with oil shean. The clouds are obscuring the view of the actual oil. Compare to the photo you just posted and claim shows an oil slick the size of Florida to that from yesterday...  The oil is only the light gray swirl off the Mississippi delta and the connected tail moving with the loop current. The rest is reflected light. (Message edited by blake on May 19, 2010) | ||
| Court |
It occurs to me that innovative, creative Americans are very well qualified to find a solution. I don't know what it is but am convinced we have the firepower if the government stays away from "helping". | ||
| Cowboy |
Hex the sky is still up there I dont think it will fall. I just want to know one thing, when you get your check from B P for all this advice will you buy a tired old man a beer. |
