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Rainman
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 20, 2010 - 04:31 pm: | 
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I've met some younguns what like the Dark Custom thing, especially the Nightster and Cross Bones. I'm an old guy (52) who started on a Sporty and wanted (didn't buy) the Sportster Sport, the FXDX, the Street Rod and I wouldn't mind the XR1200, such as it is.
I fell in love with Buell during the Riders Edge instructor training courses when I was forced upon an XB9R for the experienced rider part.
They couldn't get me off. Even if I could have flexed my old hips, they couldn't have got me off.
Now I want mass centralization and radical steering geometry and 100 horses.
Until it's available again -- and the kids get out of college -- I'll settle for the Blast.
(Message edited by Rainman on April 20, 2010) |
Swordsman
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2010 - 11:12 am: |
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I still can't fully understand the failure of the VRod. That's a badass machine, and has enough iterations that you can find one to suit your style. Is it the price? I've read that technicians don't like 'em because they have a different engine than the rest. Combination of price and resistance from dealers?
(wait, that's starting to sound like a Buell formula...)
~SM |
Jaimec
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2010 - 11:18 am: |
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No bottom-end for one thing. Not much fun to lug around in low-revs going from bar-to-bar. Doesn't "sound" like an "authentic Harley" either.
The Street Rod was an interesting attempt to create an all-around performance bike around that engine but they missed the boat by putting that gigantic and HEAVY 19" front wheel on it. Guess they didn't read "The Trilogy of Tech" regarding unsprung weight.
Shame... it was the ONLY Harley I've ever ridden with a halfway decent riding position, too. |
Rainman
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2010 - 11:34 am: |
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I liked the Street Rod and the Sportster Sport and I like the XR1200, but it's been a long time since I had $12 to $16K to drop on a bike and it'll be a long time before I can do it again, judging by this economy. |
Swordsman
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2010 - 01:39 pm: |
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No bottom-end for one thing.
Really? I would have expected it to be a monster, at least on par with a Lightning.
~SM |
Jaimec
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2010 - 02:21 pm: |
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Anyone coming off an air-cooled Harley with it's big, thumping, down low torque will be disappointed with the "feel" of the V-Rod. The Revolution engine needs to be revved out to completely experience it's powerband... something a traditionalist would probably never even think of doing.
Most of the early reviews of the V-Rod mentioned the very un-cruiserish characteristic of the engine in terms of it's powerband. It feels like an oversized sportbike engine crammed into a cruiser.
Shouldn't be THAT surprising since it was ORIGINALLY meant to be the water-cooled Buell engine Erik wanted before Willie G. got his hands on it. |
Midknyte
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2010 - 05:58 pm: |
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It feels like an oversized sportbike engine crammed into a cruiser.
Hmmm. Geee. I wonder why... |
Redbuelljunkie
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2010 - 09:30 pm: |
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My first street bike was a Sportster, and my first performance bike was a Buell ('97 S1). Although all my prior experience with motorcycles (off road) had been Japanese, I never considered anything other than American for a streetbike. As the mechanical issues piled up, and as the attitudes at dealerships got more and more adversarial, I started to consider looking elsewhere for my next bike. After riding a '99 Triumph Legend, I knew immediately that H-D was heading down a dead end road.
The very first thing out of my mouth after getting off the Legend was "This is what a Sportster wants to be when it grows up". I had no idea how harsh, ill-handling, braking challenged, and unrefined the Sportster was until I rode its Triumph counterpart. Amazing was the number of differences in the Triumph- modern frame with stressed-member engine, mono shock rear suspension, 17 inch wheels front and rear, 885cc liquid-cooled carbureted inline three cylinder engine... yet it retained the classic styling and iconic lines like the Sportster. The difference was that it performed like a modern, performance-oriented, sporting motorcycle- unlike the lethargic, numb and disconcerting machinations of the Sportster. It was painfully obvious that the Sportster was not in the same league as the Legend.
As I gained more experience from owning many other bikes from Europe and Japan, I became more convinced that there was not an H-D product that could stand head-to-head with its foreign counterpart. For example, there was a test a few years ago that pitted the XL1200R against the Thruxton. The results were that the H-D had a slight edge in outright power, but in every other category (braking, handling, refinement, etc...) the Thruxton won hands down. What was most obvious to me, however, and was not pointed out in the article, was that the XL1200R has a 1200cc air-cooled v-twin- the Thruxton has an 865cc air-cooled parallel twin. The Sportster's only edge was a slight power advantage (with 335 more cc's)- otherwise it was beat. In my opinion- there's no excuse for this. Why does H-D refuse to make a better bike?
From my point of view, H-D only compares itself to itself- not anyone else. Sure, their products have improved over the last century- but mostly in comparison to themselves, not the rest of the world. It works great when you sell a specific product to a specific customer base- and they've been more successful at this than anyone in history. The problem is, at some point you have to expand your customer base, and this is what H-D not only seems incapable of doing- it appears they refuse to do it. In the process, they are alienating many potential customers, who, as things continue to change, H-D is going to need in the future. In my opinion, not only is this a mistake- it's downright stupid.
I would love to be proud of H-D. I would love to buy an H-D I could be proud of because it performs to the standards I demand in a modern, competitive, well-rounded motorcycle. Unfortunately, not only does H-D not have a product that meets my requirements (the XR1200 could have been a contender had they not botched it), they then spitefully bury the only division that held a glimmer of hope to drag them into the modern world. I find myself wishing they become so close to failure that they have to implement the changes that they should be smart enough to have implemented years ago. |
Pso
| | Posted on Thursday, April 22, 2010 - 02:24 pm: |
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Vrod does not go "potato-potato-potato-potato" when idleing. |
Glitch
| | Posted on Thursday, April 22, 2010 - 02:32 pm: |
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I remember when H-D tried to patent the "potato-potato-potato-potato" sound.
The patent lawyers were laughing so hard then, they got no work done.
If you're quiet, you can still hear them chuckle. |
Jaimec
| | Posted on Thursday, April 22, 2010 - 04:09 pm: |
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That was in response to the Honda Shadow ACE, that duplicated the sound by putting the two pistons (set at 45 degrees) on the same crankpin. Previous versions of the Shadow used a staggered crankpin offset to counteract the primary and secondary imbalances of a 45 degree engine (which, of course, just introduced rocking couple into the equation).
Gee, if I upload an MP3 of a Harley at idle, am I infringing on somebody's copyrights?? |
Glitch
| | Posted on Thursday, April 22, 2010 - 04:17 pm: |
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Gee, if I upload an MP3 of a Harley at idle, am I infringing on somebody's copyrights??
Guess I forgot to mention, the Patent Office was/is laughing also.
It's a running joke for patent attorneys, I guess it's kind of their meme. |
Swordsman
| | Posted on Thursday, April 22, 2010 - 09:50 pm: |
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Most of the early reviews of the V-Rod mentioned the very un-cruiserish characteristic of the engine in terms of it's powerband. It feels like an oversized sportbike engine crammed into a cruiser.
And noooooow I want one. 
~SM |
Glitch
| | Posted on Friday, April 23, 2010 - 07:03 am: |
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And noooooow I want one.
Go ride one.
You're so used to your XB the VRod will feel alien to you.
Slow speed parking lot stuff is real interesting.
Don't forget, when you lift your feet to the pegs, your feet go forward! |
Tiltcylinder
| | Posted on Friday, April 23, 2010 - 09:58 am: |
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When Hardley was attempting to patent the noise... the catalog of bikes that year had a plastic sheet 45rpm sized record included... had all the various engine noises... still have it somewhere... whenever I unearth it, it makes me laugh. Harley was afraid, very afraid... the fakey davidsons were starting to sound the same too. I think the factory would have made offset journals if they had the technology in 1909. A 360 degree power pulse... they'd sound like bimmers now.
(Message edited by tiltcylinder on April 23, 2010)
(Message edited by tiltcylinder on April 23, 2010) |
Jaimec
| | Posted on Friday, April 23, 2010 - 10:00 am: |
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And DON'T slide your feet back on the pegs when cornering, you'll just drag your HEELS on the ground. DAMHIK. |
Swordsman
| | Posted on Friday, April 23, 2010 - 11:15 am: |
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Don't forget, when you lift your feet to the pegs, your feet go forward!
THAT would be my first mod: Street Rod pegs. And suspension. And seat. I sat on one back when they were available. Forward controls suck.
~SM |
Xbeau12s
| | Posted on Saturday, April 24, 2010 - 03:01 pm: |
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It's a motorcycle. There are lots of bikes similar to the sportster but they are not classified as girly. Most of the time people that say it's a girls bike don't even ride.
I don't like em because I don't like the way they handle at all and look but that's my opinion.
I used to have a Yamaha Midnight Warrior. That's one badass bike and could smoke many Hardleys and handled almost like a Buell! |
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