| Author | Message | ||
     Ft_bstrd |
“Today I want to announce a sea change. This is the end of favoring motorized transportation at the expense of nonmotorized.”  | ||
| Froggy |
I agree 100%. Many roads are dangerous to bicyclists, especially outside major cities. | ||
| Damnut |
I have no problem with this. A dedicated bike lane? Yup, sign me up. | ||
| Nevrenuf |
all roads are supposed to add a bike lane when worked on down here in florida nowadays. for the most part, they do get used. | ||
| Froggy |
Just because you don't see someone using it doesn't mean they aren't being used. | ||
| Dbird29 |
They are good for passing on the right. | ||
| Hex |
I live in an old small city, Roseville CA. Our suburbs expanded a while back and lots of new tax revenue came in to the city coffers. Our city has made a great effort to revitalize our old downtown business area, maintain our old parks, and create new paved bike paths for miles. Guess what, Kathleen, Titan, and I use them extensively, and so do a lot of other people. We have four dog parks within a 5 mile radius from downtown. It's really nice that they haven't let our city center rot. I'm all for creating urban open space, greenways, and bike/ped/dog only areas for us 'city' folks. The streets are too dangerous for bicycling IMO. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
The article specifically says that they aren't talking about just adding a bike path. They are saying that they are going to give EQUAL treatment for bicycles. This means that those stupid HOV lanes, there are going to be equal number of those to lanes for cars and trucks. Instead of HOVs, it'll be for bicycles. Half of EVERY new road will be devoted to walkers and bicycles. You guys REALLY think this is a good idea? | ||
| Larryjohn |
I guess my reading comprehension is getting worse as I get older. I did not read that half of every road project would be devoted to walkers and bikers. Of course, if I held a strong belief that we are being turned into Vietnam, maybe I could have read that into what was said. Good thing I don't hold that belief. I agree, this is a good idea. The bike lanes where I live get used a lot as do the dedicated bike pathways. | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
Nothing wrong with equal treatment for bicycles, they're road users as well & need to understand that they have rights on the road AS WELL AS RESPONSIBILITIES. In France, cyclists cutting through pedestrian areas, making illegal turns, running red lights, etc, etc, are subject to the same penalties as drivers of motorised vehicles. People have lost their drivers licence here due to their actions on a bicycle. However in the US I can see a whole new business opening up. CYCLE LAWYERS 4 U Then the rules & regs will be amended (for public safety reasons y'unnerstan) & off we go into that wonderful world of litigation & legislation. What happens on the Interstates then? dedicated free bus service with a trailer for your bicycle? Should be fun to watch this develop, or go to ratshit, it's a bit early to tell. Just as an aside, Why do politicians always refer to a "Sea Change" if it was about boats I could get it. It's one of those meaningless bullshit phrases that boils my blood instantly, along with, "Level playing field" (No such thing exists, get over it), or "At this moment in time" (what the f**k is wrong with "Now") there's plenty of others I could mention, but I'd just work my self into a rage Hitler style. (Message edited by Mr_grumpy on March 27, 2010) | ||
| Glitch |
It's probably just another avenue to more taxes. How long do you think it will take for equal treatment to mean license tags on bicycles? Equal treatment as in, if you're riding on public roads, one must have insurance? Equal treatment as in inspections? Equal treatment? Me thinks if bicyclists were treated equally, they'd not be happy very long. Any time a change like this comes along, it's all about the money. | ||
| Damnut |
Sorry Fatty but I have just as much right to the roadway on my Trek as you do in your car. I think you're reading things that are not in that article. | ||
| Vtpeg |
One of my highlights last summer- The main road into my rural town is twisty and follows a river, would be a lot fun if it were well paved. The road also attracts many bicycle tours, think 10-20 bikes, bunched up impeding traffic. I watched a sheriff pass 10-12 cars and light up a tour. I doubt they got a ticket, but they were single file and spaced out the rest of the way down the mountain. | ||
| Bluzm2 |
Jim, not so. Fuel powered vehicles pay road taxes, bicyclists don't pay anything for infrastructure and upkeep. | ||
| Sifo |
It's just frosting to make $7.00 gas taste better. Funny, but I've read in cycling magazines how bike lanes tend to create accidents between bikes and cars at intersections. The bike looses 100% of the time too. I've always been big on bikes, but they just don't mix that well with cars. | ||
| Damnut |
So you're telling my that I don't have equal rights to the roadway (not highway) as a motor vehicle? What about a small scooter? <50cc? They do not have to pay for anything either, don't they have equal rights to the road? Sorry man but I pay the road tax, not my car. I pay it and I have the right to the road, whether I'm on my Trek, Buell, Jeep or anything else I feel like having on the street legally. I can get cited on my Trek for not obeying traffic laws as well. (stop light, signs, ect) | ||
| Pwnzor |
How long do you think it will take for equal treatment to mean license tags on bicycles? Here in Long Beach it's municipal code. You must register your bike every two years. If you are stopped by an officer and you have no registration they can impound it and you'll have to go pick it up and pay $1.00. I have just as much right to the roadway on my Trek as you do in your car Yes, you do. If your bike has lights, AND at least one mirror, AND you use hand signals. You also need a valid drivers license to be out in traffic. Here in the LBC, a helmet is also required if you are riding among cars. If you're under 18 you have to wear a helmet no matter where you ride. Not to mention that you cannot obstruct traffic which means you must be able to travel at least within 15mph of the speed limit. In other words if the speed limit is higher than 40mph you'd have to be in damn good shape to keep the pace for long. I agree, cyclists have every right to be out there, just follow the rules same rules the cars have to. Bicycle laws vary by city around here, YMMV. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
There is nothing wrong with bike paths. I don't think anyone would be against that. Current bicycle riders DO have the same treatment on the road as drivers. That's the way things CURRENTLY are. The question is what would create a "sea change". Doesn't that connote a much larger expansion? Would Federal funding of paint for a bicycle path really require a national declaration? | ||
| Damnut |
Never know, this may first step in a bigger scheme of things................ G'ment eventually taking away our vehicles and making us ride bikes. | ||
| Froggy |
I just read the article again, I don't see it either. | ||
| Crackhead |
“Treating bicycles and other nonmotorized transportation as equal to motorized transportation would cause an economic catastrophe,” warned Carter Wood, a senior adviser at the National Association of Manufacturers. “If put it into effect, the policy would more than undermine any effort the Obama Administration has made toward jobs. You can’t have jobs without the efficient movement of freight.”  Somebody forgot to tell the Surly guys. | ||
| Ted |
i'm a x-cycle-commuter. equal rights is all good, but here anyway there is minimal enforcement of cycling rules. i was vehicle or a pedestrian depending on which was more convenient at the time. a whole laneway of a bridge is dedicated to cyclers ,which is a major waste imo, in our (van, bc) climate. | ||
| Bikertrash05 |
I am with Glitch on this one. "We are from the Government, and we are here to help (bicycles get equal treatment)." | ||
| Jstfrfun |
If my truck is traveling at the posted speed and Bob-n-Nancey byciclist are in the road, blocking traffic flow, there will be an air horn announcement, which if unheeded, will be followed up by a crowding from my fender to the side of the road! Streets and roadways are NOT designed and built FOR byciclists! It is simple enough to understand that the human bone is no match for the steel fender, all bikers understand it motorized or not. | ||
| Damnut |
As a cyclist I don't even know how to respond to you Jstfrfun. You are definitely in my category for being a Douche Canoe though.  | ||
| Froggy |
+1, and the whole point of this thread is about adding bike lanes to avoid situations like this. Remind me to terrorize you with an airhorn and dangerous tailgating when you are on your X1. | ||
| Mikej |
I have mixed reactions to this: In my personal experience I've found myself in situations where I was safer on the roadway than I was on a nearby bike path, in one place I felt safer on a 45-55mph road with no shoulder than I did on a bike path along a lake front going through a residential neighborhood ( Bothel Way vs the Burke Gilman Trail out of Seattle into Lake Forest Park and Kenmore) . 2. When the government says equal they usually mean taxation and licensing. Have you all seen that goofy commercial with pedestrians walking around with tail lights strapped around their rumps? 3. I'll refer some of you to look up John Forester and his cycling book, it's about vehicular cycling and even within the cycling community it generates heated debates. 4. I won't get into the fuel tax arguments. Tax is tax and few taxes to my knowledge end up going only where they're supposed to go. 5. If this turns out to be a grand scheme to indirectly force people onto mass transit by penalizing pedestrians and cyclists then I for one will not be surprised. 6. Re: Huntington Beach: how do they handle cyclists from outside their jurisdiction, do they stop anyone without a plate and ticket you if you don't have non-H.B. Residency I.D. on your person? I picture someone from Costa Mesa riding down to Huntington Beach and leaving their wallet/ID at home like I did many times when I lived in that area. (Edit: just noticed Long Beach instead of Huntington Beach, I didn't ride up that far very often, still the same analogy applies.) 7-10. I may or may not be back to fill these in. I will simply say I've been hassled and threatened by motorcyclists while out bicycling just like I've been by car/truck drivers. The road is for riding, the track is for racing, if you come around a blind corner dragging a peg and slam into me while I'm cycling I will not be happy. 'nuff said. I'm sorry, I've lost track of what this thread was all about.... 7. Jstforfun (or whateveryournameis), there are 3' Laws in many U.S. Jurisdictions requiring motorists to give a minimum 3' of clearance between their vehicle and cyclists on roadways. There are also many true stories of what eventually happens to truck drivers like you who behave as you say you do. There are also lawyers who specialize in defending cyclists just like there are lawyers who specilize in defending motorcyclists. Share the road dude, or get off of it, have a nice day before you kill someone either directly or indirectly. You sound like one of those jerks who tailgate me and flash their lights when I'm driving my car at the posted speed limit. (Message edited by mikej on March 29, 2010) | ||
| Crackhead |
+1 Damnut. People like Jstfrfun are the reason why we have a sweeper to block traffic from trying to pass us when it is unsafe. We have even had a sweeper run a truck off the road when he tried to pass us when there was a double yellow line. Thanks to a few of the anti donuts LE fitness requirements, we use to have a few cops that rode with us and would radio in tags. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
There are two completely different issues: 1) Courtesy to bicyclists sharing the road with vehicles 2) Federal planning of roadways to create expanded bicycle and pedestrian throughways at the expense of commercial throughways People who buzz bicyclists are a$$hats. I even pull in my clutch and idle past bicyclists to save them the noise. Just like we would advocate stiffer punishments for drivers who fail to yield to motorcyclists, there should be stiffer penalties for those who fail to yield to cyclists. | ||
| Buellerandy |
I've been struck by an f150 while in a pedestrian x walk on my mountain bike. Lines or no lines... Your still not safe IMO. | ||
| Aesquire |
This may be the most accurate explanation of the Vietnam War I have EVER read. A bit snarky, but how can it not be? http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=36110 Since a lot of the kiddies here have no Idea what traffic in Saigon was like "back in the day" or Asia in the 20th century. They rode lots of bikes since they were so poor they couldn't afford cars. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
I like it Aesquire! |
