| Author | Message | ||
     Oddball |
Festival !!...... Festival !!.....  | ||
| Cityxslicker |
Hell blow me out a new Duc Hyper 700 for 5K and I would take it too. duh | ||
| Reepicheep |
And in news just in... 4 buggy whip testers review the new "automobile", and find it full of interesting potential if you turn a blind eye to several obvious shortcomings... If you can find *any* mechanical thing built today that you don't need to ignore something about, your doctor did a *great* job with the meds  | ||
| Rex |
I wonder if what would have happened if Erik would have made things a little bit more mainstream? Just wondering? -Regular front wheel with dual brakes -Regular radiator -Regular frame -Regular looks, no big air boxes, no side radiators ? Just wondering what people would have thought? I know he tried to be different, look different, design different, etc. But I do not think the main stream understood or liked this, and then having the bikes in HD dealerships, probably didn't help. Triumphs are different. Threes, the styling, etc? They seem to make it through okay. Personally, I think if the first 1125R's had come out with the current Black frames, the full fairing to cover the pods (I like the pods myself), and a slightly lower price, they would be have been accepted more readily. My opinion. Just wondering....Personally, I was drawn to Buell during the S1 days, and liked how they were different. I personally do not like any of the Japanese sport bikes. They all look the same to me. Kind of boring. I like the Triumphs, Moto Guzzis, Ktm's, Buells, Aprilias, etc....My point of view | ||
| Rex |
Another thing. It is surprising to read some of the posts at other magazines and discussion boards.... Some comments about only having the air cooled motor, and it is a shame Buell didn't have a water cooled motor? Where do these people live? Then some people you talk to, has never heard of a Buell? | ||
| Ezblast |
I think the CR rocks! EZ | ||
| Cataract2 |
Some comments about only having the air cooled motor, and it is a shame Buell didn't have a water cooled motor? Where do these people live? Then some people you talk to, has never heard of a Buell? Rex, that's where we come back to the part on Buell's weren't marketed all that well by HD. Not to mention the dealerships. Ask just how many sales were most likely lost due to the dealerships that didn't even try to sell the bikes or put the bikes in the back tucked away in a little corner. | ||
| Phelan |
Ugly bikes? I love Ducatis like the next guy, but I think the CR looks a lot better than any of the Ducs. Looks are subjective. HD didn't shut down Buell because they didn't sell well in Europe. Hell, they didn't shut them down for not selling well in the states. Buell was in the black when HD shut them down, so nobody really knows why they shut Buell down. And yes, for the 2 1/2 years I've been on this board everybody besides you have agreed that HD poorly marketed Buells, and I'm sure they felt that way long before I was here. When you walk into a dealership and the salesmen make smirk comments about you for looking and asking about the Buells, which they know less than nothing about, it kinda sets up a communication barrier, wouldn't ya think? Pretty hard for anyone to keep a desire to buy a bike from the likes of them. | ||
| Reg_kittrelle |
Curious, Phelan, how do you know "Buell was in the black"? | ||
| Rex |
I agree on the Ducatis. The new Monsters look terrible. Yes, it is wierd to hear the funny comments that the salespeople tell you about Buells when you go in to look around, and you are just asking questions. The funniest one, is if you really want a bike, you need to look at the harleys...REX | ||
| Rocketman |
What I see is a couple of people intent on bating. Rocket | ||
| Paint_shaker |
The following portion of the article sure doesn't seem very "Buell friendly" to me. "The overall verdict was, on the strength of this test, Buell didn't make bad bikes - they just made ones that weren't good enough, either because of dubious styling, poor finish in some areas, a clunky powertrain (on the Harley-powered models) or insufficient performance. The XB represents pretty good value, the two 1125s offer good road performance. But for all three you have to turn a blind eye to some of their faults to be tempted to buy one. And perhaps, as our Buell virgins found, there's the rub. All three of the bikes impress - but they also disappoint too much as well and in a ultra competitive market at a time of recession, sadly, that simply isn't good enough. Bye bye Buell, we'll miss you - but not as much as we might have done. " The above portion of the article REEKS of anti- Harley and anti Buell sentiemnt.!! | ||
| Jon |
Harley got Buell airborn, but along the way could not provide a culture correct ownership support experience and in so many other ways they (HD) just missed the mark. They never understood the Buell product, culture, or customer/audience. Poor Buell. | ||
| Phelan |
For example, the XB series was originally supposed to have a turbo that would have bumped the power to about 150 HP (which would have been competitive in 2003). Harley shut down the plans though. The turbo plan is why the '03-'05 models have a tunnel through the frame. EB knew how to make a competitive bike. HD just wouldn't let him do so. | ||
| Reg_kittrelle |
"Harley got Buell airborn, but along the way could not provide a culture correct ownership support experience and in so many other ways they (HD) just missed the mark. They never understood the Buell product, culture, or customer/audience. Poor Buell." I think that an excellent, spot-on assessment, Jon. In fact, I think a lot of Harley management would agree with it. | ||
| Bads1 |
Phelan Sorry Bro but they would of been competitive with what??? Turbo's,NOS or anything added is not ever going to make its way on a race track. Not only that. It would of been 2-possibly 3 grand more for the purchase. So ask yourself...... would you pay 13-14 grand for a Air cooled twin?? Not me...... Most will buy the Gixxer or what ever for 10. then with the extra buy a track day or two. Possibly buy the wife a nice ring or something to smooth over the money he just spent. | ||
| Buellinachinashop |
After seeing what a Thunderstorm can do to a dyno lab window when it grenades, I find it hard to believe that HD would have designed it to be turbo'd. | ||
| Hootowl |
Hard to believe, or hard to understand? From what I gather, the turbo'd engines went through reliability testing, and passed muster. | ||
| Buellinachinashop |
Where'd you "gather" this from? What some guy posted on a Buell board other than this one? If the turbo was the intent, where's the drawings, where's the prototypes, where's the EB videos of him stating this in his garage, where's the talk of it before now? | ||
| Spike |
I have no idea if it was intended to power the XB, but at one time there were pictures an info about Erik riding a turbocharged X1 Lightning. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Where'd you "gather" this from? What some guy posted on a Buell board other than this one? From an earlier thread on the XB forum: http://www.buelletinboard.com/forums/showthread.ph p?t=12992 Not sure if anyone of note has verified the story or not, but it sounds plausible. The hole in the frame seems like a immensely complicated way to get air into the airbox for a naturally aspirated bike if that was all it was intended to do. | ||
| Bads1 |
John there was some turbo work done. It just never came to be. | ||
| Buellinachinashop |
I know there was, but not to the extent of being a "production bike" and "snatched away by HD". I was told the turbo used wasn't even reliable enough to endurance test it. | ||
| Rocketman |
I think the turbo would have been an excellent route to take for the XB. A turbo would suit the motor perfectly. As Buell no doubt knew from the S1 they beta tested some years previous. The performance would have been astonishing but not just in high performance terms. I don't see that a turbo addition would have to cost so much more either. The technology is widely available and doesn't involve that many more parts. In mass production terms I'm sure the cost would have spread out economically enough to make it possible. I do see set backs to it though. The racing route is an obvious no no, but in Buell consumer terms not so important. Nor do I believe a turbo would put off prospective set in their ways Harley types, as they do not I imagine make up significant numbers of the Buell purchaser anyway. Yes the purchase cost would go up. Insurance premiums too maybe. Having some embrace the turbo technology on a V twin of old. And maybe the XB platform was a little long in the tooth. I'm sure there are a number of reasons it would be not such a good idea, but I bet the good would outweigh the bad, and a turbo XB would be a great seller in Europe Japan and Australasia if not so much the States. What it would have been is a great alternative to the high tech MV Brutale where the brute force of Buells streetfighter prowess could have come to the fore and very possibly built a world beating somewhat unique tractor that would have turned the two wheeled world on its head. MCN might not have tested an XB Turbo, but had they, I'm sure they'd have scored it a sad goodbye rather than a good riddance. And in case you don't know, MCN tested an Austrian Aerocharged Buell some years ago and front page headlined it as the most powerful V Twin in the world. Another example of MCN's liking of Buell and their dedication to the marque. And in case any trolls are wondering. Rocket would have loved a turbo XB12S. My kind of bike. My kind of Buell!! Rocket (Message edited by rocketman on January 06, 2010) | ||
| Phelan |
Thank you Sean. There's hope for you yet!!!  I agree, HD should have okay'd the turbo. The XBs (save the XBRR) and tubers were never really raced outside of the Buell-specific races anyway, so racing wouldn't have been as big of a deal as it seems. And yes the cost may have been more, but people would pay the premium if the bike was marketed correctly. This isn't a YamaKawaZuki, it's a low-production #s hand-built American sportbike, which is why HD should have treated it as so. People will pay a hefty premium to have something unique, especially if it's competitive. No doubt a turbo XB, with its amazing handling abilities, would have been an even more killer hooligan bike that everyone would envy. | ||
| Cataract2 |
Dallas, The passageway through the frame that you used for your turbo pipe was actually put in the frame for that reason. Although we kinda pointed an air scoop at it for the naturally aspirated bikes, actually the XB series was designed from the get-go for a turbo derivative. Had nothing to do with Germany, except as one of our many markets. We were deep into turbo research and pre-production testing for turbo bikes and made it all the way through our full durability testing with two pre-prod bikes. However, the project was killed by H-D leadership. So after we knew it was dead and gone for good, we plugged up both sides of the hole and added fuel capacity back. I think that happened around 2005. We were not using the Garret, but a variable turbo with an ECU controlled boost level. 150+ RWHP and 120+ ft-lbs torque with full durability, emissions and noise compliant. They were cool as hell. Erik Just for those who are curious. This is the e-mail that was in the link posted above. | ||
| Sparky |
Somewhere in the hopefully not dumpstered Elves' files there are specs for this turbo XB model. Now if this info still exists, it would be nice for a full disclosure for us enthusiasts or is this too much to ask for given that even to this day the government still does not acknowledge alien beings piloting UFO craft in broad daylight. | ||
| Anonymous |
I know there was, but not to the extent of being a "production bike" and "snatched away by HD". I was told the turbo used wasn't even reliable enough to endurance test it The turbo-XB was scheduled for 2006, codename Diablo. Prototypes passed 99 percent of accelerated durability testing with an aftermarket turbo, and then Harley decided they would design their own. It wasn't reliable enough to endurance test. The production intent engine made 150hp, 120 foot-pounds at peak boost, which wasn't allowed indefinitely to keep the engine from overheating. The hole in the left frame rail of early XBs was for the intake air from the turbo. The packaging was so slick you would have had to look twice to tell the bike was turbocharged. Quite a number of people have ridden the Diablo mules, and every one of them gets big eyes when they recall what it ran like. | ||
| Rubberdown |
That bike would have been a HUGE seller. Different in every good sense, with a healthy dose of nonsense. Shame. I'd write a check for one. | ||
| Rex |
cool stuff. |
