| Author | Message | ||
     Vampress |
Looks like our perserverance is starting to pay off. Lemonchili and I have been in touch with several magazines, blogs and newspapers over here in Oz, and it looks like someone finally 'gets it'. They have taken the information provided, done a little digging of their own and realised that 2+2 doesn't equal 5? This is the latest edition article they published with promise of a follow-up.  While the news about EBR is great, the more pressure placed on HD to sell Buell, so it can continue as a motorcycle manufacturer, the better. (Message edited by vampress on November 25, 2009) | ||
| Lemonchili_x1 |
A bit more pointed than the stuff on Cycle World and MCN. I wonder if H-D thought they were out of the woods with the EBR announcement? Hehehe, Australians causing trouble? Who'd of thought that'd happen...  | ||
| Methed |
Nice work!  | ||
| Jaimec |
+10,000!! | ||
| Doerman |
Great job, Vamps and Chili! (I somehow think you are behind getting the information to AMCN). This serves as a ramp for US pubs to leverage the the AMCN story. That is very important! Again, thanks!  (Message edited by doerman on November 25, 2009) | ||
| Hex |
Nice work Vamps and Chilli! Now go post that over at BuelletinBoard, it's time to rumble! | ||
| Vampress |
Beat you to it Hex, up for all to see  | ||
| Xbrad9r |
great work L-chili and Vamp, looks like some of these "squeaky wheels" are finally getting some grease. L-chili...I'm gonna meet you back on HD's Facebook page and get the squeaking cranked back up a notch there as well. | ||
| Lemonchili_x1 |
Squeak! I'm hoping there will be more articles like this. Don't forget the letter thread http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/406 2/514708.html | ||
| Babired |
good article I dropped my Uly off at the shop I've been with since 2000 and I"m so disgusted with HD not seeing any Buell stuff at all except a few t-shirts on the discount rack. I don't want to give them anymore of my money. I started looking at Triumphs this past week. K | ||
| Zac4mac |
Nice find, thanks Vamps. These have been a weird couple of months. A few days ago, Dave in Sales told me last month, H-D was only 30% of our income at the dealership - Buell was 70%. About the same time, I was out back having a smoke and noticed there were more Buells lined up for service than Harleys. Not just "Fire Sale" bikes either. An S-1, several S-2s and M2s, XBs and Lokis. Zack | ||
| 2008xb12scg |
That's great thanks | ||
| Gregtonn |
Excellent! G | ||
| Gregtonn |
By the way, it is west of the original but, its still East Troy.  G | ||
| Rocketman |
It's a pretty misleading article to say the least if we're to be honest. What lifelines were thrown, and which talk of potential external investors? I've not seen any reports of interest in MV either. It only went on the market yesterday 19th November with BNP Paribas in Milan appointed to handle the sale for Harley. Certainly Castiglioni says there's a lot of interest, but without knowing the price, rumoured to be around $22 million, such is just him talking up the brand until he shows us proof of real interest. But then why would interested parties be talking to him if Paribas are handling the sale? And we all know the 'dumpster' photo is not what the article leads us to believe it is. As for Walworth County and Burkhardt, I'd assume he's following standard procedure for the local agency he works for is all. Doesn't mean he had anything concrete. All in all a little sensationalist and not really helping the Buell cause. Rocket | ||
| Ezblast |
Anything that starts people to ask questions, such as that article, is a good thing, and that is what it is intended to do. EZ | ||
| Vampress |
You're right EZ, that's exactly what the intention was. To keep it in the news. To get people asking questions. Rocket is right...it is a little sensationalist...that was also the intention. People don't take notice of much less these days, so it has to make you double-take. All the other articles we've read lately are just a rehash of the same old facts..buell shut...harley in trouble...etc, instead of inspiring curiosity to what should/could be. This was different, and could lead to better places for Buell. IMHO it helps the cause a lot. | ||
| Rocketman |
As much as there is truth in any news is better than no news, the article could have more credibility simply by better journalistic skills being applied to the same information. Reporting the facts, or even speculating more positively could add more credence to the cause. But hey, looks like Saab might go to the wall after all with Swedish maker Koenigsegg announcing they're backing out of their intention to buy agreement. What hope has anyone if corporations like GM murder brands like Saab. Rocket | ||
| Gohot |
Not to seem dense, but what are you reading out of this? I'm still not believing that Buell will resurect by any of this, though I had hoped different. Mabe theres still hope? but I'm doubtfull. | ||
| Elvis |
Gohot, Did you think, a couple weeks ago, that there would be any hope that Harley would let Erik leave to start up his own racing shop and be allowed to buy and assemble parts that preciously could have only been bought by Buell? There is still hope. At this point, all we would need is for Harley to take the simple step of saying: "Okay, if you want to continue making and selling motorcycles, you can continue to buy the parts you are buying and you can modify them and hang lights and turn signals on them and get them street certified and make them into your own, new models." The only thing standing between Erik Buell and the manufacture of street-bikes at this point is Harley saying he can, and they can do that at absolutely no cost to themselves. He wouldn't need the Buell name. He wouldn't need existing Buell designs (though both of those things would be nice), all he needs is for Harley to allow him to make the next logical step with his venture. If there is a cost to their image of not doing that, we may get to a point that the board will realize it's in their best interest to allow Erik to continue making street bikes. It's the least they could do and it's something they could do very easily. As for the accuracy of the article, if there is anything in the article that isn't true, Harley is free to clarify. I would be willing to bet that the article is more accurate than what we have heard from Harley regarding the matter since Oct. 15th. | ||
| Rocketman |
I understand your frustration and passion Elvis, but man you're living in la-la land if you think Buell will ride again after all that's been said. I also thought I pointed out the inaccuracies of the article. If you or anyone else wishes to believe otherwise, then don't let me stop you looking through rose tinted glasses. Go for it. EBR was likely a done deal even before Erik was crying into his camcorder. Rocket | ||
| Jon |
I have to admit, I agree with Rocketman on the non-future of Buell. As I took in Erik's online announcements (closing and racing), he is very specific in his acknowledgments to HD. He does not seem to be at odds with HD at all. He is a non poster here and apparently has no beef with the MoCo from what I can see. Look, Erik has already lived the life, fought the fight, built the company. You think he wants that again? Or fight a battle with HD? I think he wants a life too, and is going to find one focusing on racing, his original passion and in a capacity that keeps his next passion active. I agree with Rocketman...we've seen the last of BMC. HD can do what they want, even if it is unfair and hateful toward their Buell Customers. (Message edited by jon on November 28, 2009) | ||
| Lemonchili_x1 |
I've never been one for causes, but I believe Buell Motorcycle Company will be back in some form, and I'll do what I can to help with that by writing letters to editors and things like that. Maybe it will be in a year, or 2 years, or 5 years. Right now H-D is really messing with the timeframe by shutting down Buell and effectively freezing the technology. I would understand if Erik Buell wanted to go into semi-retirement and just go racing, he's more than earned that right, but from everything I've read (I've never met him) I don't think he wants to do that just yet. I find it strange that Erik can manage to thank H-D, but I've come to the conclusion that he's a lot more professional than I could ever be. I'll take a guess that he's not so polite behind closed doors. I don't think EBR was created any more than 2 or 3 weeks ago. RMR changing to Suzuki tends to support that. | ||
| Elvis |
Rocket, Regarding "innacuracies", if you go back and read the article closely, you'll see that nothing in it can be disputed. AMCN is not reporting any details - they are simply reporting things that are being reported by other sources. If no offers have been made and no interest has been shown, how difficult would it be for Harley to say that? They haven't said there haven't been offers or interest. They have said that Buell is too integrated to sell and that is a lie. I will offer, right here, right now, out of my own pocket, $200,000 for the simple rights to work with existing Buell suppliers and assemble existing water-cooled Buell motorcycles from existing parts along with the rights to develop those designs going forward. So there. Now nobody can accurately report that no offers have been made. I would offer more than that, but it's all I can comfortably afford. There are others who could afford more and (while I don't know the details of what has or has not been offered at this point) I'm absolutely certain others would offer more if given the chance. Regarding the idea that I'm delusional in thinking there's any hope, stop and really think about this: Imagine for a moment you are a Harley board member. You want Buell dead and buried, never to see the light of day. You don't want any serious offers because you won't consider any serious offers because all you want is for Buell to never again exist. With that perspective in mind (and that would be the attitude that would create hopelessness), what would you do when Erik Buell came to you and said he wanted to support the Buell race program by creating his own company and buying Buell race parts to support Buell racers? Would you even consider allowing him to do that under my hypothetical? I certainly wouldn't. Without Buells racing, the Buell name would die much more quickly and the goal of having it die would be much more assured. If Buells are racing they will be getting attention from fans, investors and potential customers of new Buell products. Keeping a racing program alive would fit perfectly with the idea of selling Buell down the road and maintaining the value of the asset until that can happen. Keeping a racing program alive would be the exact wrong thing to do if you wanted the brand and bikes to simply go away and die. (Message edited by elvis on November 29, 2009) | ||
| Hughlysses |
I do keep wondering if Erik didn't know the closure was in the works long before October 15. Remember the "barn tour" videos that were released this summer? Isn't it a little curious that they picked this year to "restore" the barn facilities and reveal the true story of the VR1000 prototype and the later water-cooled fuel-in-frame prototype, things that had evidently been "top secret" previously? Then in September, Erik did the interview with the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel: http://www.jsonline.com/business/59803327.html In this article, Erik states that he had not renewed his contract with Harley Davidson. He also made this statement:
In hindsight, that sure reads like he knew Buell's closure was coming. I don't think you can really read anything (one way or the other) into any statements Erik has made since the closure announcement. If he's still under a non-disclosure agreement, he could be legally liable for any statements he makes apart from what HD authorizes. Regardless of his feelings on what HD's done, he wouldn't do himself any favors by making any negative comments at this point. Don't forget the old saying either: "You catch more flies with sugar than with vinegar". | ||
| Rocketman |
Well there's little point in debating a poorly written somewhat sensationalist piece of journalism......so why am I. Moving along swiftly. I agree with Hugh's comments above, and I too think they're good observations and insights in what was to become. I don't believe Harley or Buell's solicitors had time to draw contracts and agreements for EBR's birth in a handful of days. This was a well orchestrated manoeuvre I'd say. And no I don't believe for a moment we will ever see production Buells anywhere near the scale they'd grown to, IF EVER AT ALL again. Rocket | ||
| Anonymous |
Sorry to rain on Hughlysses' and Rocketman's conspiracy parade, but Erik did not know in advance, and EBR was indeed put together at the last minute. The videos and all this summer were done as part of the new move to make Buell more of a sportbike brand, but obviously that came too late. Erik was supposed to go to work at H-D, as was mentioned in the original Buell closing press release, but none of that had been discussed with him in advance. When it came down to an H-D job for Erik there wasn't a fit, so he chose to start EBR as the best thing he could do. The idea behind EBR is to add value to the motorcycles for the dealers and the owners, and for H-D who have to sell the remains of the inventory and hopefully be able to get more for Buells that are traded in. H-D agreed and the deal was created. It didn't happen overnight, but it happened in between the announcement of the Buell closure and the EBR announcement. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Anony- Thanks for the info. I wasn't thinking of any conspiracy, but it certainly seems like Erik was unconsciously prophetic back in September. | ||
| Court |
>>>>It didn't happen overnight It actually took about 6 days and almost didn't happen. It's a really cool deal that NO ONE had any clue would exist 10 days prior to the announcement. Very neat and very exciting. Conspiracy theories will always abound . . . folks, lacking fact, thrive on them. | ||
| Rocketman |
It actually took about 6 days and almost didn't happen. So I am wrong regarding the time factor. The above comment suggests my reasoning might well be supported by 'ALMOST NOT HAPPENING'. Nothing to do with a conspiracy. Just me thinking of the hurdles one would have to jump when dealing with such a huge global corporation. Amazing to have done whatever it was within 6 days then. Conspiracy theories will always abound . . . folks, lacking fact, thrive on them. Oh pipe down Court. My beef was with a poorly written AMCN article. Not you Erik or Buell, ffs. Rocket | ||
| Jon |
Thanks for the post, Anon. Theories do abound in the absence of facts to no fault of the theorists. What are people to do in the absence of substantive information? Anony's post is a good start. Let there be more information and on a regular basis. |
