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     Ferris_von_bueller |
November 7, 2009, 9:45 pm Lawmakers Detail Obama’s Pitch By Jackie Calmes In an odd coincidence, the House debate on Saturday to overhaul health care took place on the third anniversary of the 2006 election that gave Democrats majority control after 12 years of Republican dominance. It fell to President Obama and to Congressional leaders to persuade those Democrats still sweating the final vote that it would not prove the party’s undoing in next November’s midterm elections. Both Mr. Obama and the House leaders showcased Democrats’ newest colleague, Representative Bill Owens, who last Tuesday won a special election in an upstate New York district that Republicans had held since 1872. In the campaign, Mr. Owens gave unabashed support to the pending House health care bill, despite the opposition of national conservative groups, including the new Tea Party Patriots, who backed Mr. Owens’ conservative rival. Mr. Obama, during his private pep talk to Democrats, recognized Mr. Owens election and then posed a question to the other lawmakers. According to Representative Earl Blumenauer of Oregon, who supports the health care bill, the president asked, “Does anybody think that the teabag, anti-government people are going to support them if they bring down health care? All it will do is confuse and dispirit” Democratic voters “and it will encourage the extremists.” Another freshman Democrat from New Mexico, Representative Martin Heinrich, said the president’s comments overall were reassuring. “If you want to see a recipe for failure,” Mr. Heinrich said, “don’t do the things you talked about in your campaigns and turn your back on your base. All the independent voters in the world don’t matter if the Democrats don’t turn out.” “This is an opportunity to do something as big as Social Security,” he added. “And me, personally, I don’t want to be on the wrong side of history. http://prescriptions.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/11/07/ lawmakers-detail-obamas-pitch/ | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Swordsman |
"“This is an opportunity to do something as big as Social Security,” he added. “And me, personally, I don’t want to be on the wrong side of history." Yeah, cause that one's SUCH a success; it'll be bone dry before I ever see it, despite all I will have paid in. He's a bright one. I love how the Prez keeps throwing little things out there, keeps edging closer and closer to labeling those that disagree the loudest as evil. Where else is "extremist" used commonly in the press? In relation to Muslim terrorists is all I can think of. Are they trying to plant a subconscious seed? ~SM | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Cityxslicker |
Apparently I am now a criminal. weeehaw. I dont know how many they are going to send to come incarcerate me; but I do know how many of them I can fend off  | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Fast1075 |
So when is Charmin coming out with the new 1st Amendment line of toilet paper? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Cityxslicker |
Freedom of speech, as long as they agree it is something they want to talk about, and in an approved format, and you are supporting their view. Yes Comrade, there is much freedom in speech. brabblewawableesrbarp (FAGS) | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Didactic |
Um, yeah, you are extremists, no, nobody is stopping you from speaking your mind. Why do you all suddenly start acting like a victimized minority, just because we have a black president and your party of choice was voted out. You know you guys keep crying wolf all the time...I know, I know, your not crying wolf, your speaking truth to power and trying to protect all of the rest of us from the big bad government that is out to get us and kill our grandparents with death panels. Do you know how insulting it is to be treated like that by you all. You want to tell me your opinion fine but acting like the only people in the room who are worth listening to just makes you one thing... fags (thank you southpark for making that word useful again) go about your brumpprumpbrummoppump-ing... | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Nik |
Why do you all suddenly start acting like a victimized minority, just because we have a black president and your party of choice was voted out. What makes you think that all these so called 'anti-government extremists' are Republicans, or that all this discontent is 'sudden'? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Sifo |
“Does anybody think that the teabag, anti-government people are going to support them if they bring down health care? All it will do is confuse and dispirit” Democratic voters “and it will encourage the extremists.” So we are the anit-government extremists while BO shreds the constitution. Time to review the declaration of independence again! Why do you all suddenly start acting like a victimized minority, just because we have a black president and your party of choice was voted out. And for some reason race is brought into it. "THAT'S RACIST!" | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Jstfrfun |
I VOTED FOR THE SONOFABITCH, AND I DON'T LIKE THE CRAP HE'S PULLING ! GET SOBER! | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Technomad |
Certain folks like to call anyone who doesn't agree with them racist to try to shut them up or at least discredit them. Other folks, unhappy with the out-of-control government they saw under the Republicans, allowed the Democrats to assume control. Now they're thinking "Holy $h!t, that didn't work out so well!" and figuring out what to do next. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Cityxslicker |
I am equal opportunity, If a White guy was in office and pushing the same policies, I would be up against it as well; oh wait did you all forget the Clinton Healthcare feasco of 92-93? I was up against it then, I am up against it now. Anytime you try and take money out of my pocket for failure of the next guy to adequately plan in a manner that I have already done for my self; yeah, Im gonna be pizzed about it. And Bush doesnt get off the hook either, that whole AIG bail out was on his watch, it was a dumbazz move and set the wrong precedent for capitalism. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| M2me |
What makes you think that all these so called 'anti-government extremists' are Republicans, or that all this discontent is 'sudden'? I don't know whether they are Republican or not but the suddenness is pretty remarkable. Where were these people for the eight years of the Bush administration? Where was Fox news while all the deficit spending was going on? As soon as Obama got elected these people all seemed to find religion at the same time. They suddenly decided that deficit spending is bad and they must rise up against it. Energy? They've got a simple, no cost solution. Drill, baby, drill. Why didn't they try to do anything serious about this simple solution when they had a chance? Afghanistan? Now they seem to know exactly how to win it. Why didn't they implement any of their winning strategies while they were in control? Health care? Again, they claim they have a painless solution. Why didn't they push it while they were in power? Where were the "grass roots" rallies? Where were all the 912ers, all the tea baggers? Never heard a peep out of them. Now that they've been voted out of office, they suddenly seem to have all the answers. It would have been helpful if they had been as excited about their solutions during the 12 years they controlled Congress and the 8 years they controlled the White House as they are now. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Technomad |
Many were unhappy with the deficit spending under the Republicans and complained about it. They also failed to support the Republicans in the 2006 and 2008 elections. Many do not identify with either the Democratic or Republican party and just try to pick the best of the poor choices that make the ballot. Others simply don't vote. The Democrats are making it much, much worse. Many have been pushed beyond what they can tolerate and are ready to fire the entire federal government and start over. Even if this were to happen though, it could only have a lasting effect in combination with strict term limits for congress. A permanent political class is dangerous and subject to great temptation. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Geforce |
+1 Technomad "A permanent political class is dangerous and subject to great temptation."  | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Reepicheep |
I complained vocally about Bush as well. Obama did something for me that I thought was completely impossible... he made Bush look like a fiscal conservative. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| P_squared |
 Yup, he's doing a splendid job since it's all Bush's fault. By the way, when exactly does he stop whining & accept that it's his problem now? Just curious. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Cityxslicker |
I will get up in G W B's shiat just as much as OBamas'. The government that governs best is the one that governs the least. Dunder headed stupidity out of Bush ? sure: The FEMA response to Katrina. There was absolutely NO fiscal responsible connotation to those FEMA shacks, They were somebodys pork barrel push, they were unusable, and unsalvagable, you we paid for em. (do something, anything the sky is falling) War in Iraq/Afghanistan... (gonna get some shiat for this one, I dont care) THEY WERE SAUDI. If any country should have been 'invaded' in retribution; it was SAUDI ARABIA. and they should lift the ban on assassinations and let us just kill the miserable cave dwelling terrorist Bin Laden where he is hiding. The AIG bail out?!? WTF. bad move on so many levels. Lets just pour money down a hole and see if it solves jobs, currency values, housing crisis, trade deficits, or credit/banking corrections ! NOPE (wanna know where that one got F'd ? Back in 1996 when they repealled the legislation that KEPT banks and insurance companies from combining funds, and selling 'securities' under the same entitities..... that lil f*ckapoolooza led us into the last Depression) I am not a fan of Bush either. I am however a big fan of the Constitution of the United States of America. I have sworn to protect that document against all enemies foreign and domestic. Pity the current leadership doesnt take the same view. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Aesquire |
I can't believe anyone missed people complaining about Bush's fiscal responsibility. ( probably too busy freaking out about the idiotic use of the phrase "war on terror"..... relax, it's now the "contingency operation" on "man made disaster" ....like that's in improvement. ) For 8 years, opposition party ( dem, in this case ) yelled, "worst economy since the Great depression". 8 years of, frankly, lies about how bad things were, just to try and gain political advantage. Since the "economy" is, in large part, a matter of trust that a chaotic system is working, being told it's not had a negative effect on the economy, even when it's a lie. So, thanks a--holes for making things worse. How much does that count? good question, how much did opposition b.s. about the economy hurt it during Clinton? HE had a recession his last year, another b.s. bubble. History may not repeat, but it sure rhymes. It might help if people shouted "you lie" when they DO more often. I'm not going to rehash any war b.s. but if we had spent the money on building nuclear power plants & the recycling system needed to make that work, we actually could buy electric cars, and not black out the country if we plugged them in to recharge. Instead, Congress once again refused to open ANY storage or reprocessing facility & spent fuel rods sit in pools all over the place. Obama could have called for full freedom from foreign oil and accomplished it with nothing more than the budget DEFICIT in spending his FIRST year. He'd be such a hero he could get socialized medicine passed in a heart beat. But instead, he signed a pork bill the bulk of spending programed to take place to help his party get reelected, created an international dollar crisis, and spent so much time telling people that "his plan" would give everyone everything & save money, that somehow details never appear. Whatever "his plan" is, it sure doesn't match the truth of Congress's multiple plans to spend a couple MORE trillion dollars without ever actually solving the problem of people being un-insured. In fact, every time some one complains that the plan in congress does not do what Obama says "his plan" will, they are called extremist. THAT may be the most obvious problem with this administration. Instead of countering "lies" with "truth" they are countered with personal attacks and stonewalling. If you didn't trust the govt. under the dread Rove, why would anyone trust a govt. under Rahm?? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Swordsman |
"Why do you all suddenly start acting like a victimized minority, just because we have a black president and your party of choice was voted out. " Spoken like a true liberal. You are the very... first... one to bring up race in this conversation. Why can you people simply not accept the fact that we disagree on POLICIES!? Damn, what a thick-headed bunch! It's like debating with a f'n bowl of vegetables. ~SM (Message edited by Swordsman on November 10, 2009) | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Swordsman |
"Where was Fox news while all the deficit spending was going on? As soon as Obama got elected these people all seemed to find religion at the same time. They suddenly decided that deficit spending is bad and they must rise up against it. You're joking, right? You can't be serious. Yeah, the Dems were all up in arms over Bush's spending, and then when they get in power, they blow many, many times more than Bush's 8 year expenditure in the first 6 months. And you wonder why everyone suddenly panicked? Energy? They've got a simple, no cost solution. Drill, baby, drill. Why didn't they try to do anything serious about this simple solution when they had a chance? I believe they tried, and were stopped. Pelosi exploited her power as speaker and wouldn't even bring it to a vote, repeatedly postponing it in favor of other items until the time ran out. You can once again thank your Democratic buddies for that one. Where were the "grass roots" rallies? Where were all the 912ers, all the tea baggers? Never heard a peep out of them. Again, this has everything to do with the sheer level of displeasure that the Democrats have inspired in the general populace. Just how bad do you have to F' it up to get the average American off the couch? Pretty darn bad. I don't have the numbers, but I'll bet you a beer a large chuck of these protesters are independents. ~SM | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Bott |
are you a Liberal? don't like the way a conversation is going? disagree with someone's opinion? just don't like someone? just cry RACISM! it's the Liberal's version of the "Easy Button" | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Blake |
"Tuesday won a special election in an upstate New York district that Republicans had held since 1872." That is a crazy lie. Democrats held the seat as recently as 1993.
"In the campaign, Mr. Owens gave unabashed support to the pending House health care bill..." Another lie. The truth is that until just days prior to the election he had been campaigning and promising to vote against it. Here's why I am nearly violently opposed to the bullshit being perpetrated against us in Washington today: The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) late last Thursday released a more detailed cost estimate of the Pelosicare bill that shows when the leviathan bureaucracy is fully implemented it will cost taxpayers over $3 trillion over 10 years. That in addition to the fact that what is being sold as a program that is fully funded over the first ten years is a HUGE ••••••• lie! It is shown as funded as a result of some $400BILLION in fantasy "savings" from medicare and medicaid with the rest coming from tax increases. But that isn't necessarily the worst of it. The first ten years includes a full ten years of taxes, fees and the fantasy savings from medicare/medicaid, but--this is ••••••• outrageous--it only provides for six years of actual program implementation, meaning actually paying benefits. So D'UH! It takes tens years of increased taxes and revenue to cover just six years of benefits, and the morons in congress think that is just swell? They should be tarred and feathered and rode out of the country on a rail. This on top of the near $1TRILLION of stimulus debt crammed through without any debate and zero transparency. A fraud perpetrated on America whose aim appears to be reinforcement of political power. Then the idiotic cash for clunkers. Then the moronic cap and trade energy bill. Raise taxes, spend like a fool, but cut our military budget by 10% while engaged in warfighting, and not just any warfighting, but in fighting "a war of necessity." You could NOT make a better plan to defeat, demoralize and kill America. More from the opposition. (Message edited by blake on November 10, 2009) | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Blake |
Promise that unemployment will stay below 8% if you support the TRILLION dollar stimulus con, then beg forgiveness for being wrong when it blasts past 9% and continues heading right past 10%. You want to trust these idiots with our health care? This is no different than the morons who estimated medicare would only cost $65M/yr. Lies, deceit, corruption and idiocy beyond the imagination. All the big government proponents just don't get it. They see suffering or injustice and just want it to go away. I do too. The difference is that I love freedom and recognize that with every bit of power we bequeath to the federal government, the less freedom we have. The analogy that rings true for me is one of children deciding to stay with their parents or to leave home to strike out on their own. If children wish to remain safe and protected by their parents, they will then be obliged to live by their parents' rules. They sacrifice freedom for security. I'd rather strike out on my own. I'd rather be free than safe. If you'd rather have Uncle Sam take charge and look after all our needs like a giant wet nurse nanny, I will oppose you at every turn. You are threatening my liberty. I will NOT pay any fee or tax for government mandated health care. I will resist anyone trying to enforce that miserableness upon me. I am angry, VERY angry! (Message edited by blake on November 10, 2009) | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Swordsman |
I believe the time of the Libertarians is at hand. I see them continuing to gain a following until the Republicans panic and switch their format to be more in line with Libertarians. Either way, it'll be a good thing. The liberals had their party, but it got a little too wild and someone called the cops. Time to pack it up. ~SM | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Mikej |
Or redefine it. I have concerns about what is coming, and I'm not referring to the stuff on the surface. Excuse me while I go take care of some things (like my education and career) while I still have that option along with my health. The first options are always to speak your concerns and vote your conscience. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Roadcouch98 |
Now, stop picking on the Liberal Monkeys. See No Evil, Hear No Evil, and Speak No Evil, unless it is about "GWB". | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Sifo |
"Tuesday won a special election in an upstate New York district that Republicans had held since 1872." That is a crazy lie. Democrats held the seat as recently as 1993. Glad to see the facts on this. I heard on the news that the Republicans held this seat for the past 100 years. I forget what reputable news channel I heard that on. Looks like someone didn't do their homework before flapping their lips on camera. I don't know whether they are Republican or not but the suddenness is pretty remarkable. Where were these people for the eight years of the Bush administration? Where was Fox news while all the deficit spending was going on? As soon as Obama got elected these people all seemed to find religion at the same time. They suddenly decided that deficit spending is bad and they must rise up against it. I know that Glen Beck is a favorite target of the White House as a FOX personality. Did anyone ever see him talking about Bush spending. It's where I first heard the phrase "this will make blood shoot out of your eyes". BO is giving us a real blood bath.} | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Bob_thompson |
From an independent here, living a very conservative lifestyle, KEEP YOUR VOTER REGISTRATION CARD HANDY for next November and in 2012. WE CAN MAKE IT RIGHT AGAIN. Bob | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Sifo |
Clinging to my gun, bible and voter card! | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Rainman |
Got my gun and voter card, but can't figure out which version of the Bible to hold onto. Maybe I'll just hold onto my Blast owners manual. You can't interpret that but so many ways and it's never inspired anyone to kill. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Cityxslicker |
Guns, Ammo, Gas and Gold Everything else is just lip service to somebodys agenda. |
