| Author | Message | ||
     Hughlysses |
My father-in-law had one of the ones Toyota made back in the 1980's. Torque out the wazoo, ran out of breath at ~3,000 RPM (no turbo). Great fuel mileage. I thought it was a pretty cool little truck. Isuzu, Mazda, Mitsubishi, Nissan, Ford, and even VW had them back then but all dropped them by the late 1980's. A couple of years ago, I bought a VW Jetta TDI and I really like it. Great fuel mileage (~45 MPG average) and I was amazed at how much more grunt this 110 HP diesel has than the alleged ~120 HP gas burner in my Ford Ranger (which might get ~26 MPG with no load and a tail wind). A turbo diesel is the perfect engine for a truck. Trouble is, NOBODY sells small diesel trucks in the U.S. Practically all the manufacturers build them but they DON'T bring them into the U.S. VW is set to come out with a new truck with a diesel shortly (kind of like the Honda Ridgeline) but they're not bringing it to the US either. Enter the Indians. A company named Mahindra says they're coming with a diesel 2 door and 4 door pickup by February 2010. They've been building vehicles since the 40's and assembling and selling diesel tractors in the U.S. for about 10 years. I must be nuts for considering buying a truck made where they build Royal Enfields, but I'm thinking hard about it. My only other choice is to buy a small U.S. truck and do a diesel swap myself. There's plenty of info on the net on doing that, but it ain't easy. No bolt-in kits or anything like that. More info on Mahindra here: http://www.mahindrana.com/index.html What do you think? Any of the rest of you like the idea of a small diesel truck? | ||
| Doughnut |
I would love a small- mid size suv in a turbo diesel. About the size of the s-10 blazer or Cherokee Sport. | ||
| Boltrider |
I would be all over a compact turbo diesel truck. Low end torque is the most useable power in day-to-day driving, one of the main reasons I bought a Buell. My gasoline Toyota has it but needed a supercharger to get it there. (Message edited by boltrider on September 23, 2009) | ||
| Steve046 |
Sign me up. I'd love a truck like that. | ||
| Fireboltwillie |
always wanted to do a turbo diesel in a dodge dakota. | ||
| Cataract2 |
Seriously, we need to drop this gas hybrid crap and go with small TDI engine vehicles. Great gas millage all over and power to boot with no damned batteries. | ||
| Froggy |
I would kill for a 400+hp RWD 2 door mid sized sports car based pickup. In fact, I came sooo close to getting one, I am still pissed about that.  If that 400hp could also be diesel, that would be even better!  | ||
| Johnnylunchbox |
My wife's got an '03 Jetta TDI. Boatloads of torque and if you hypermile it you can get 50+ mpg easily. My family had an '81 Datsun 810 station wagon with a 3.0 straight 6 diesel. Fantastic car until some •••••• stole it. Give me a bare bones pickemup. Midsize crewcab and a 7 foot bed. 4WD and 6-speed manual. 3.0 liter turbo (V6 or inline6) direct injection diesel. I'll be there tomorrow to buy it. Everyone I know would buy one in a heartbeat. Goes to show how out of touch the auto manufacturers really are. The Mahindra looks cool, but India?? I don't know... | ||
| Aesquire |
Just bought a '09 Jetta Sportwagen TDI. 40+mpg solid @ 70mph higway, 33-35mpg town. I suppose I need to learn to hypermile. Turbo lag is notable, but once spinning, Torque! I've won stoplight drags. I'll take a diesel Van please. ( after this ones paid for ) I looked for a E series diesel, but hard to find, and 50k for a Sprinter is too much. ( I'm mad I didn't get one when they were 30K ) Something like Ford's new (from Europe) Transit Connect would be groovy. The Brit car show "Top Gear" tried to destroy a used Toyota diesel P/U. Swept out to sea on the tide, had an apt. block demolished out from under it...etc. Still runs & is on display on set. | ||
| Cataract2 |
Johnny, inline 6 FTMFW. Gotta say that my Dodge 2500 Cummins I6 does fairly well. Gobs of torque and it gets decent millage for a 5.9 diesel. Plus, that Cummins is bullet proof. Now, as for the rest of the truck... | ||
| Wpadave |
I have wanted a small to mid-size diesel pickup for the last 2-3 years. Chrysler had the rights to an Italian turbo diesel several years ago. I wrote letters pleading them to put the engine in the Dakota pickup. This would be a real winner. US drivers who drive pick-ups would accept diesels before the auto crowd. I own two diesel tractors and would never buy another gasoline powered tractor. It is all about the torque. A truck does not need a high reving engine. I think the auto companies are run by bean counters and MBA's not anyone who ever turned a wrench or pulled a boat or race trailer. If India builds a truck I want I'll buy it. This sends a message to the US companies how stupid they are. Money talks. | ||
| Indy_bueller |
There have been rumors for a while that Ford is working on a smaller v-8 diesel for the F150. I personally would LOVE to see a Ranger/S-10/Dakota size truck with a straight 4 or 6 diesel. I'd buy one in a minute. | ||
| Thespive |
I am the Tech Editor for Four Wheeler magazine and we'll be testing one soon. It sure is ugly, but the specs are very interesting, small-size with big payload numbers and, of course, the diesel. Now the problem with light duty diesels is not the market, there are customers who will buy it. The problem is the expense. Clean diesel technology and mandated regulations have caused the current crop of engines to be 20% less fuel efficient than the previous generation. And when you are only getting a marginal improvement in MPG over gasoline at a huge upfront cost, the business case goes away quick and only the diesel die hards will buy. --Sean | ||
| Delta_one |
wasn't the ford ranger offered as a diesel in some country's? I think they even had a full four door model too. | ||
| Mikef5000 |
Give it 2 years. Most all of the auto companies are working on Turbo Diesels for the US right now. | ||
| Bishopjb1124 |
Jeep makes a turbo diesel Liberty and Grand Cherokee, so whoever wants a midsize suv you got it. | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
OK you guys scoop time. Ford already have a small High performance diesel V8, it goes in Range Rovers. More useful though, is the 2.7 V6 twin turbo, which kicks out well over 200 ponies & can be tuned further. That goes into Land Rover Discovery, Ford cars, Peugeot & Citroen. It's a super little plant. As for a Diesel Dakota, it's a nuts & bolts conversion using the motor from a Jeep liberty. For more info you'll have to dig on the Dodgetalk forum. If any of you guys want a diesel to do your own conversions, let me know the truck model & I can probably source a motor for it here. If enough people are interested it might be worth grouping for a 20' container. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Somebody started a Mahindra forum if you're interested in their trucks: http://mahindratruckforum.com/forums/ Here are photos of their trucks:   Mahindra styling is about like an early 1970's Japanese truck, but they're promising a standard 6-speed automatic and state-of-the-art common-rail injection 2.2L turbo diesel developed with assistance from Bosch and a company named AVL out of Michigan. ~30 MPG, 1+ ton load capacity, cost of around $20k although official figures have yet to be published. http://mahindratruckblog.com/ and http://mahindraplanet.blogspot.com/ are also good sources of info. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Mr. Grumpy- thanks for that info. The Dakota swap seems like an obvious one, but from what I've found that engine doesn't seem to be very well liked (reliability problems and mileage not that great). I understand the Ford Ranger sold in Europe is a completely different truck so I guess that rules out a bolt-in swap for U.S. Rangers. Any suggestions for other obvious candidates? | ||
| Nevrenuf |
having been a carpenter most of my life, anything less than an 8 foot bed is pointless(full sheets of drywall,plywood, etc,etc.. so to have a 150 with a diesel with the payload of the indian truck would be the cats meow for me. i've heard that vw diesel is a great little machine. | ||
| Aldaytona |
I'm not a techno or gadget guy. I like simple things. I ordered a VW Rabbit Diesel Pick Up in 1981 with 2 options. Radio prep and sliding rear window. Nothing to break. 50+ mpg for over several hundred thousand miles. Would still be driving it if not for a drunk in an Astro van who hit me head on in Hollywood. VW had millions of 50+ vehicles in the 70s-80s, I don't get it.  | ||
| Nevrenuf |
i worked with a guy down in miami years ago that had one of those pickups and he loved it. you couldn't kill the thing short of getting hit by someone else. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Aldaytona- I've seen several of the VW trucks (known as "Caddys") over on the TDI Club Forum (www.tdiclub.com) that have been updated with late model TDI powertrains, better suspension, wheels/tires, etc. They don't have a huge amount of load hauling capacity, but that'd be a nifty little truck. Still gets 50+ MPG and hauls butt! Neverenuf- the Mahindra regular cab has a 7.5 foot bed; it's almost there. The 4-door truck bed is barely over 4 feet long. I think it can just barely haul a Uly with the tailgate down. | ||
| Odie |
Now the problem with light duty diesels is not the market, there are customers who will buy it. The problem is the expense. Clean diesel technology and mandated regulations have caused the current crop of engines to be 20% less fuel efficient than the previous generation. And when you are only getting a marginal improvement in MPG over gasoline at a huge upfront cost, the business case goes away quick and only the diesel die hards will buy. True- ask anyone with a new Ford 6.4L F250/350. Absolutely miserable mileage from them. I love my F250 (7.3L) with a 6 speed manual. It sucks my cash down as fast as my Jeep and my Buell. I do like the idea of smaller diesel pickups like those running around in Europe but I'll keep my slightly larger one, thanks.  | ||
| Ratbuell |
I love our '05 Cummins Ram - quad cab, 8' bed, 4x4, auto. It's a great truck for hauling and towing stuff, and gets great mileage....on the highway. C'mon...it's a huge, heavy beast. Stop and go kills it to the tune of about 21 in town. 30psi stock boost out of the turbo...it'll MOVE (my wife said "you know your truck hauls ass when it does a smoky burnout pulling a trailer" after I ...um... "had to" do that merging into traffic pulling a car trailer), but the mileage definitely drops in city cycle driving. Highway, mid-high 20s are easy. But even pulling that car trailer (yes...WITH a car on it) over a mountain, it averaged 18 Small diesel, I'd be all over it. But, we'd have to find a way to match the euro makers' mileage numbers. The TDI is an outstanding powerplant, with amazing economy. The TDI Liberty wasn't that great - for it's physical size, the Liberty is still a porker, and they had fuel delivery issues, solved by an aftermarket lift pump in most cases - and as nice and smooth as the diesel Grand Cherokee is...the mileage just doesn't support the expense. But again, the Grand is a porker. The US needs to come out with a reliable, economical (both purchase $ AND fuel mileage) small diesel passenger car. Don't over-think it. Don't try too hard right off the bat. Learn the technology - right now, all US diesels are HEAVY, big-truck diesels, and they don't fit or work in a passenger vehicle. Learn how to make small ones, put 'em in a car....then, once the reliability is down to a science just like building gas motors is "easy" for them, put one in a light SUV or a pickup. Get the economy and durability down first....THEN tune it for torque and make it a workhorse. Most of that can be accomplished with the same base engine (block/heads/pistons/compression ratio), and just playing "musical turbochargers" - figure out the power output requirements, build the block for the heaviest-duty situation, and put a small turbo on passenger applications, bigger turbo on "work", or truck, applications, and have electronics to match whatever the situation is. | ||
| Hootowl |
Ford makes Diesel cars...but they only sell them in Europe. They know the tech. They just need to realize that there is a market for them in the states. | ||
| Xl1200r |
U.S. regulation are way too tough on diesels - that's the biggest reason Ford (and other U.S. companies) don't bring them over here. Jeep had a diesel Wranger, but not in the states. If it were sold here, I would have bought it. I like diesels and I think we're idiots for not embracing them more on this side of the pond. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Ratbuell- Some of the most interesting swaps out there use the Cummins 4BT. It's basically your engine with 2 cylinders lopped off. These things are apparently easy to find in junkyards as a lot of bread trucks and similar vehicles use them. There's a site largely dedicated to these swaps at: http://www.4btswaps.com/forum/index.php A lot of the swaps are for 4WD vehicles; the low speed torque is highly valued for off-roading. Of course, guys hot rod the living crap out of these things and are pulling 200+ HP and gobs of torque out of them as well with simple mods (larger turbos and cranking up the fueling mostly). Another popular swap is using the OM617 5-cylinder diesel from 1980's Mercedes sedans. These engines are supposedly the most bullet-proof passenger car engines every built and live to 500K+ miles (!!!). Several guys have installed these in S10's and similar trucks. Xl1200r- is that really true about our emissions laws being that much worse? Mercedes and VW have figured the tech out; it's not that hard. I know our main problem until a couple of years ago was the high sulfur content of our diesel fuel. (Message edited by Hughlysses on September 24, 2009) | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
Another problem is refinery quotas, so I'm told. I don't know the truth or the technicalities of it, but apparently you can only get so much diesel & so much gas from a barrel of crude, & if the demand for diesel rises in the US there'll be a shortfall elsewhere. Europe it seems has a gas surplus from refining & the US a diesel surplus, so they do swapsies to keep the markets stitched up tight. Again, I have no idea of the veracity of this, I'm just repeating what I've been told. | ||
| Odie |
We wouldn't have a diesel surplus if they would lower the price some! I'd drive my truck more often than I do now. I want $1.10 a gallon No. 2 back!! |
