| Author | Message | ||
     Delta_one |
"no matter where the beads are" yea so long as you flick em to the bottom of the bottle! A viper truck has a big flat contact patch just like the sides of the bottle. would i need to kick the beads to the sidewalls before I start every time? and that's all great if your tire is is smooth as a plastic bottle on the inside but mine has belts and imperfections. how many miles does it take for the beads to wear the inside of your tire and beat up your wheels with them spinning around all the time when you slow or accelerate? I don't want a passenger moving around on my bike as I ride why would I want a bunch of weight moving inside my tire as I corner? | ||
| Blake |
If I had a plastic bottle, I'd go ahead and make a video that would annihilate the con job video of the bead believers. | ||
| Ratyson |
What we need is someone that can make a clear replica of a tire (bike and car alike), mount that tire on a rim with some balancing beads in it, then throw some weight to put it out of balance and see what happens. Any takers?? | ||
| Blake |
You already have your answer to that, the bead hucksters themselves clearly state that the beads won't balance a wheel on a spin balancing machine. They have some bogus excuse for it. Buncha lies designed to separate folks from their money. | ||
| Blake |
Found it:
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| Woody1911a1 |
kinda contradicts their bottle demo ? | ||
| Nik |
Uh so what excuse would they come up with about a road force electronic balancer? | ||
| Glitch |
Uh so what excuse would they come up with about a road force electronic balancer? The Dyna Beads are smart, they know when a wheel is being tested and when it's actually being used. They waste not the energy when they're not really needed. | ||
| Delta_one |
^^^^  | ||
| Froggy |
My dad has an electric balancer in his shop for car tires, I will have to borrow it for an afternoon. | ||
| Thetable |
Blake, why do you care so much? Are you selling tire balancers, lead, or run a tire shop for a living? For someone who hasn't tried them, it sure seams that you are putting in quite a bit of effort to debunk any myths that may surround the beads. To anyone who may want to try something that works in a similar manor, but don't feel like spending the money on brand name beads, if you mount your own tires, throw a couple ounces of airsoft pellets in the tire. If you don't mount your own tires, you can use ceramic bead blasting media, as it is the same basic thing as the Dyna Beads. | ||
| Glitch |
Blake, why do you care so much? I'd bet he just dislikes dishonest products, and the dishonest people that deal in such dishonesty. Blake is an engineer, and has an acute understanding of physics. Sorry if I stepped in where I shouldn't, Blake. | ||
| Blake |
You stated that perfectly Glitch.  | ||
| Fast1075 |
I have seen this discussion before..not only here, but in several off road truck forums I participate in since I love to go get one of my Jeeps muddy from time to time. The tire beads and similar variations on the theme are prevalent. The table brings up the airsoft pellets for example. I have seen the ceramic beads, airsoft pellets, marbles, ball bearings, BBs, and golf balls used....some people say it works...and it may APPARENTLY work in that at least with large heavy tires it can reduce what is often MISTAKEN as imbalance. Here's the deal...a properly constructed tire with a DESIGN spec for balance tolerance will need none or little weight. The total picture involves the wheel and all items attached to it...and the tire. If the wheel is concentric and symmetrical and properly machined, it will require no weight. The tire is the question..the most common problem with a tire is out of round..assuming we are using a high performance street tire...if a tire mounted on a good wheel is not perfectly round, it is defective and should be exchanged for a usable tire..an out of round tire can be balanced perfectly in both static and dynamic conditions...but it is still not round...obviously the out of round tire will impart suspension movement resulting in what seems to be an imbalance. The second most common problem is poor mass distribution...the tire is round, but the materials used are not evenly distributed in the tire carcass...this tire will need weight...again, it can be balanced...but at speed, the portion of the tire that is heavier will be displaced outward by centrifugal force...creating...an out of round condition that causes suspension movement..and the apparent imbalance. | ||
| Delta_one |
or if you just put enough weight in the tire the significance of the minor weight out of balance is lessened. a 20 lb tire with a 2 gram weight on it or a 80 lb tire with a 2 gram weight on it adding all of these beads will increase your un-sprung mass and still not eliminate your out of balance issue, just make them feel less significant. | ||
| Billyo |
I've got them in the wife's Blast and in my Firebolt. They work just fine over 100mph. Just because the manufacturers don't use them doesn't mean anything to me. After all, I like my RSS and they don't put car tires on cruisers from the factory but...maybe I shouldn't go there. Try them for yourself-That's the only way you'll know. | ||
| Just_ziptab |
Wouldn't water work just as well,maybe even better? Beads....water............both fluid in motion........... | ||
| Just_ziptab |
So I had a couple of minutes to waste and ran a dry wall screw thru a bottle cap and chucked it in my drill. Spun it up and it ran pretty true. Put a couple of ounces of water in the bottle and spun it up. Sometimes it would wobble so bad from the start(slow start or fast) that I had to shut it down. Sometimes it spun really nice,but phased in and out of balance......again to the point of having to shut it down. It didn't seem to matter whether the bottle was up,down or horizontal. This bottle did not have a weight on it to make it wobble. Things seem to get worse as the bottle wore out the hole in a cap and the screw would let it wobble more freely............  | ||
| Dbird29 |
You better machine up a billet test jig there Zip. | ||
| Billyo |
Wouldn't water tend to coat the inside of the tire unless the inside was waxed or siliconed? | ||
| Geforce |
If you want to use them go for it... my opinion... garbage gimmick. Kinda reminds me of the tornado... http://www.tornadoair.com/buy1/ Now my GN does has a "power plate" between the doghouse and intake, but that plate helps to redirect 32 PSI of air to hit those cylinders at a more optimal angle than a massive column...cool part is, it works great and helps reduce detonation. Now, if you'll 'secuse me I gotta get me some beads and a 'nado for the XB! Woot! | ||
| Geforce |
"Wouldn't water tend to coat the inside of the tire unless the inside was waxed or siliconed?" Even though we already have moisture in our tires to begin with, I don't think it's a desired condition. One of the big reasons nitrogen is being used on certain applications is to help reduce the moisture... | ||
| Pkforbes87 |
100% nitrogen pressure isn't affected as much by temperature as air is. | ||
| Thetable |
Water has a vapor pressure that grows exponentially with temperature, thus making the tire pressure come up more (as opposed to dry air) as the tires get warm. I still don't by the nitrogen/pressure argument as anything more than a negligible gimmick. Air is already 78% nitrogen, and most of the water that finds it's way into the tire is actually from the water based tire lube that many places apply with reckless abandon. Are any of you skeptics willing to put it to the true test? I'd be more than happy to send someone a few ounces of the ceramic bead blasting media I have been using if you will be willing to put it in your tires and report back. After you have tried it, only then can you say that it doesn't work. | ||
| Blake |
Define "work". | ||
| Thetable |
Force*Distance | ||
| Blake |
Or torque times revolutions.  But I was meaning in context to the claim that "After you have tried it, only then can you say that it doesn't work." | ||
| Billyo |
I know the question "define work" wasn't directed to me, but, what I meant was that my tires roll smoothly with no vibrations and there is no uneven wear after 3500 miles. Perhaps the beads do not "balance" the tire but merely cause it to roll smoothly when on a road surface. I am willing to concede that both the Pilot Road 2's and the Avon AM63's may have been just about perfect to begin with, needing no weight initially. I'm not sure how small the ceramic bead blast media is. The dynabeads are tiny-almost powder. One ounce in the front and two ounces in the rear if anyone wants to try it. | ||
| Billyo |
P.S. The tires need to be dry inside. If they really slopped the goo in there when mounting any media would tend to get stuck to it. | ||
| Blake |
"I am willing to concede that both the Pilot Road 2's and the Avon AM63's may have been just about perfect to begin with, needing no weight initially. " Exactly. Thanks for your integrity. |
