| Author | Message | ||
     Chellem |
Now, I don't think I've ever hidden the fact that I lean to the right. NOT the Republican right - just the conservative side. But as I said in another thread, it's important to view both sides. So I subscribe to the ACORN emails, and I view CNN on occassion, as well as watching FOX News for a lot of info. I enjoy Glenn Beck. Although I find him to be annoying, I watch O'Reilly. I can't usually get through an episode of Hannity because it just gets too belligerent and shouty for me. This is a screen shot of the "Organizing for America" website - allegedly associated with Obama - i.e., my.barackobama.com. Of course, you can't view the events unless you submit your email addy, which I did not do. Yes, I found this image on Fox News, but I tried to read it with an open mind. See what you think. http://www.redstate.com/california_yankee/files/20 09/09/2phone-calls.jpg This is a quote: Our US Senators return to DC the Tues after Labor Day. That next FRIDAY, Sep 11, is Patriot Day, designated in memory of the nearly three thousand who died in the 9/11 attacks. All 50 States are coordinating in this – as we fight back against our own Right-Wing Domestic Terrorists who are subverting the American Democratic Process, whipped to a frenzy by their Fox Propaganda Network ceaselessly re-seizing power for their treacherous leaders. It is this sort of rhetoric that totally disgusts me coming from the Left. Faced with those who disagree with them, they classify them as Domestic Terrorists - and less than a breath after invoking the image of 9-11. They go on to claim that 75% of Americans are FOR Obama's plan. This is a statistic I've never heard before. I applaud them for trying to get like-minded people together to show support for their ideals. But why the rhetoric? And the hypocracy of constantly complaining that the OTHER side is organizing - WE'RE grassroots, THEY'RE astroturf. God I'm so SICK of this CRAP! I can't stand ANY of them! Evidently, it's since been taken down, BTW. Guess someone decided that quote wasn't in their best interest either. | ||
| Darthane |
I've seen that 75% number purported elsewhere as well - but I cannot find ANY reputable source, any major news network, any recognized polling agency - anything at all, really, that agrees with the number. In fact, that number is closer to what has been reported as the number of people who are satisfied with their current health care plans. I strongly suspect that that number is based on the number of people who said yes to the extremely vague question, 'do you think health care could use some reforms?' or something similarly leading and open to wide interpretations. <~~is very angry with the government today, from the county on up. I'm damned well convinced that once you get above the city level these people have no idea the reality of the areas they 'represent'. | ||
| Edgydrifter |
"Faced with those who disagree with them, they classify them as Domestic Terrorists - and less than a breath after invoking the image of 9-11." Welcome to the last eight years of my life (substitute "traitor" for "domestic terrorist"). Sucks, doesn't it? | ||
| Chellem |
"Faced with those who disagree with them, they classify them as Domestic Terrorists - and less than a breath after invoking the image of 9-11." Welcome to the last eight years of my life (substitute "traitor" for "domestic terrorist"). Sucks, doesn't it? I'm not disagreeing with you. I think the whole concept of classifying dissidents as domestic terrorists (or traitors) is ridiculous. I'm sad at the hypocrisy. First the one side, and now that the other side is in charge, THEY'RE the patriots, and the former patriots are now domestic terrorists. The same people who were crying about how the former administration went for power grabs, all in the name of public safety, are now those who are making power grabs all in the name of public health care. And the opposition are terrorists, or nazis, or whatever. It's all crap. I thought that was my point. Sorry if I wasn't clear. | ||
| Alchemy |
Just FYI, a recent video clip was making the rounds where a probably self identified conservative at some sort of town hall meeting referred to himself as a "terrorist". A poor choice of words and he modified his comments later. The notable part of the video was not the speaker but the congressman he was addressing who mostly just nodded along when he probably would have been wiser to reject the "terrorist" moniker. Probably should have said "extremist" instead. Google "conservative terrorist" and there are lots of hits. Taking guns to town hall meetings has probably not helped soften the use of this regrettable phrase. | ||
| Slowride |
I just entered this into my "status" on one of the social networking sites I belong too... Just wanted to say "Hello" and introduce you to a Right-Wing Domestic Terrorist that has been subverting the Democratic process by being whipped into a frenzy by the Fox Propaganda Network who is trying to re-sieze the power of my treacherous leaders. | ||
| Darthane |
Heh...finally, a good use for MyFace. | ||
| Hex |
+1 Edgydrifter, 'all will reap what they sow.' See Karma thread... | ||
| Cityxslicker |
75% of all democrats polled agreed, not a democrat?, we didnt ask you. Now with my new found freedom from having to work, I can spend all of my day doing reloads and cooking up batches of samogon vodka, Viva La Revolutia | ||
| Blake |
When someone repeats the propaganda of our enemy that is intended to demoralize and diminish our resolve to defeat al qaeda et al, then they are being traitorous. I'd not call them a traitor, but their idiotic and foolish behavior is traitorous. I have to reject calling someone a traitor for their mere opposition to a war or for disagreeing on political policy, just like I have to reject calling someone a terrorist for the same. | ||
| Chellem |
+1 Edgydrifter, 'all will reap what they sow.' See Karma thread... So, it was wrong when "they" did it, i.e., the previous administration, and now that the current administration is doing the same thing, i.e., reaping what was sowed, it's fair? Not still wrong? I mean, if it was wrong when YOU were the alleged traitor/terrorist, shouldn't you still be morally outraged on behalf of the other wrongly accused traitor/terrorists? Or is it funny now that it's happening to someone else? Because I doubt you were laughing when it was happening to you. THAT is the problem with the entire system. When *I'M* the terrorist, it's crazy, ridiculous, and unfair and I should be able to speak my mind. When *YOU'RE* the terrorist, it's funny/acceptable/fair because it happened to me, and turnabout is fair play. IT'S WRONG NO MATTER TO WHOM IT IS HAPPENING. Stop making it worse!!!! | ||
| Hex |
We could not have had this conversation two years ago, I will never forget that... | ||
| Hmartin |
Doesn't matter who said what about whom and when. I'm right, you're free to disagree, but you'd be wrong. Shout 'em down. Traitor. Terrorist. Hitler. “Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.” - Daniel Patrick Moynihan (1927-2003) It's a d*** shame that political punditry, sound bites and opinion poles have replaced true investigative reporting. What happened to facts? Too many facts are missing from the debate any more. | ||
| Blake |
What happened to facts? They've been outsourced to China and the UN? | ||
| Edgydrifter |
Chellem: You're right and you're right. You're right that it was wrong then and it's wrong now. You're also right that it's somewhat funny to me now despite the fact that I wholly agree it shouldn't really ever be funny at all, but that's only because I am (despite the best efforts of my wife to improve me) a wee bit petty and vindictive. Eventually the amusement will fade, a frown will replace my smirk, and I'll go back to being generally outraged by everything. I'm not there yet, but it will happen. | ||
| Court |
>>>They go on to claim that 75% of Americans are FOR Obama's plan. They lied about every program they've introduced to date , . . what's one little statistic going to hurt? | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
What is black is white, up is down, right is wrong. | ||
| Hex |
Sir Walter Scott: Oh what a tangled web we weave, When first we practise to deceive! Abraham Lincoln: If you once forfeit the confidence of your fellow citizens, you can never regain their respect and esteem. It is true that you may fool all of the people some of the time; you can even fool some of the people all of the time; but you can't fool all of the people all of the time. Abraham Lincoln (attributed): You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time. Adrienne Rich: Lying is done with words and also with silence. Anonymous: A lie is an abomination unto the Lord, and a very present help in trouble. (a combination of Proverbs 12:22 and Psalms 46:1) Benjamin Disraeli: There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics. [attributed, perhaps incorrectly, by Mark Twain] Carl Sagan: One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we've been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. The bamboozle has captured us. Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back. Demosthenes: Nothing is easier than self-deceit. For what each man wishes, that he also believes to be true. George Eliot: Falsehood is easy, truth so difficult. John F. Kennedy: The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie -- deliberate, contrived and dishonest -- but the myth -- persistent, persuasive and unrealistic Mark Twain: A historian who would convey the truth must lie. Often he must enlarge the truth by diameters, otherwise his reader would not be able to see it. Mark Twain: Always tell the truth. That way, you don't have to remember what you said. Mark Twain: When in doubt, tell the truth. Montaigne: He who is not sure of his memory should not undertake the trade of lying. Noam Chomsky: It is the responsibility of intellectuals to speak the truth and expose lies. Otto von Bismarck: People never lie so much as after a hunt, during a war or before an election. Ralph Waldo Emerson: Truth is beautiful, without doubt; but so are lies. Sam Rayburn: Son, always tell the truth. Then you'll never have to remember what you said the last time. Thomas Jefferson: He who permits himself to tell a lie once, finds it much easier to do it a second and third time, till at length it becomes habitual. Virginia Woolfe: If you do not tell the truth about yourself you cannot tell it about other people. Wendy Kaminer: To rationalize their lies, people -- and the governments, churches, or terrorist cells they compose -- are apt to regard their private interests and desires as just. | ||
| Edgydrifter |
Hex: You forgot Space Ghost! "I believe every word that man just said, because it's exactly what I want to hear." | ||
| Swampy |
Sounds like an attorney, ruthlessly bloodsucking while telling lies... | ||
| Cityxslicker |
Rhetoric is one thing, when they start to implement it, codify it, indoctrinate it and worship it, then it is entirely another. Polite company is best kept downrange. 200 yards is just about fine. | ||
| Greenlantern |
"I believe every word that man just said, because it's exactly what I want to hear." That might just be be the greatest quote I have ever read!  | ||
| Hex |
When someone repeats the propaganda of our enemy that is intended to demoralize and diminish our resolve to defeat al qaeda et al, then they are being traitorous. I'd not call them a traitor, but their idiotic and foolish behavior is traitorous. When someone repeats the torturous practice of our enemy that ultimately demoralizes and diminishes our resolve to defeat al qaeda et al, then they are being torturous. I'd not call them a torturer, but their idiotic and foolish behavior is torturous. If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck...  | ||
| Liquorwhere |
If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck... So true, Obama walks like a communist, quacks like a communist....must be a communist..... | ||
| Dbird29 |
Always look at the bright side of Life! | ||
| Blake |
When someone repeats the torturous practice of our enemy... Hasn't happened. You make stuff up. I don't know why. | ||
| Hex |
Waterboarding??? did I make that up??? did America???? I wonder if the Nazi's used it? Weren't the Nazi's ever one of our enemies? | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Waterboarding is the best you can do? You forgot about talking to them in a stern voice. | ||
| Reindog |
When someone repeats the torturous practice of our enemy... Daniel Pearl would beg to differ with you if he could. America stands on bedrock regardless of the protestations of this ooshy gooshy hand wringing mindset. | ||
| P_squared |
You're really trying to draw a moral equivalency between the U.S.A. and the Nazi's? We waterboarded 3 AQ terrorists. We waterboard hundreds of military every year in S.E.R.E. I haven't seen any ovens being constructed though. | ||
| Chellem |
When someone repeats the torturous practice of our enemy that ultimately demoralizes and diminishes our resolve to defeat al qaeda et al, then they are being torturous. I'd not call them a torturer, but their idiotic and foolish behavior is torturous. I don't understand - when did we start beheading people on camera to demoralize the resistance? When did we begin stoning women to death for being raped? Have we as a society approved yelling "Death to Afghanis" and the public burning of the flags of middle-eastern countries? When someone who commits a terrible crime resulting in the death of 180 people, do we give them a hero's return upon their mysterious early release from prison? Let's not compare water-boarding to beheading, shall we? I mean, given the choice (which the victims of beheading are NOT) I think we all know which one we'd choose. If we don't torture people, if we don't show strenght and resolve, they laugh at us and consider us weak. If we do what we need to do to protect our citizens, we are evil Americans. Someone on this board (more than one, perhaps) has accused conservatives of only complaining, but not offering any viable alternatives. What is the alternative to the questioning methods we used? Polite requests for information? Perhaps bribery with tea and crumpets? PLEASE let's not confuse our interrogation techniques with those of our enemy. And let's not start comparing Americans to Nazis again, OK? When we've started rounding people up to be incinerated en-masse, THEN I'll agree that we're behaving like Nazis. But waterboarding? Please. | ||
| Halffast |
After being waterboarded the detainee is wet. After beheading the detainee is dead. Do you understand the difference? | ||
| Liquorwhere |
Waterboarding??? did I make that up??? did America???? I wonder if the Nazi's used it? Weren't the Nazi's ever one of our enemies? Hex, It sounds to me you are part of the "self loathing America", those that just don't like our country, our freedom, our way of life, the pursuit of happiness and so forth. I don't get it, but whatever, HERE you are free to dislike yourself all you want to.....I love this place, I want to preserve it for those that come after me, I think we do things that are shady, I hope they are for the right reasons, but the fact is the only parallel I can see between the Nazi's and America is our current President. So there ya go. |
