| Author | Message | ||
     Midnightrider |
Rode into town (DC) last night to meet some folks for dinner. Uneventful trip. Tooled around town a bit then the first few raindrops hit - so headed back home. It was a steady rain but not a downfall. Anyway, about 10 minutes into it my Kuryakin (?sp) voltmeter drops from green to red. A few minutes later, more red. Etc. Switched from the after marker HIDs to the aftermarket PIAAs. No change. For awhile I noticed higher rpms/lower gearing boosted the volts but never into the green. After awhile that no longer made a difference. Long story short, about 30 minutes later the last red light went out and so did the power. Got it home and the battery was reading 11.7 volts across the terminals - but not enough juice to even make the starter click. Pulled the battery, cleaned the terminals, reinstalled and put it on a slow charge. After 30 minutes it fired up put wouldn't start the second time. It's been on a battery tender 4-5 hours and did start but even at a fast idle with no lights wouldn't go green. I'm continuing to charge but wondering 1 - battery ? it's the original on a 2006 Uly 2 - something got wet and really didn't like being wet 3 - something else (alternator/stator) It did this once years ago and I found a shorted/melted ground wire on a back-off brake modulator - but at the time I was thinking I did that trying to fast charge it (10 amps) too long the day after I guess the acid test would be to ride it but no one else is home and I don't want to have to push it home or walk back home and trailer it again Thanks ps - i'll check the trouble codes but I couldn't remember which pins to connect and I was unable to connect to the BW last night and most of today | ||
| Panhead_dan |
I have an '06 too and just recently fixed my electrical problem. It turned out to be the battery. I could have eliminated a lot of work by doing a load test on it sooner rather than later. I'm not saying that is your problem, just suggesting you do a load test to eliminate the possibility. | ||
| Zac4mac |
Sounds like a stator, but you know the possibilities - Check the last thing you messed with before the problem. In order I would look at: Stator Regulator Wiring Battery Good luck hunting. Z | ||
| Etennuly |
Look at that '77' connector near the front belt sprocket. | ||
| Brumbear |
start at the battery | ||
| Bluzm2 |
The battery is on borrowed time.. Check it first. Mine are shot after 4 years... | ||
| Reepicheep |
If it's dying while you are riding, it isn't battery, though it's never a bad idea to check battery connections (as they can cause other parts to fail). That leaves stator, regulator, and 77 connector. As it happened in the rain, I would say the 77 connector is most likely, but when stators die, it's sometimes raining, and the two facts are unrelated.... FWIW. | ||
| Sifo |
It could be lots of things. Diagnose it. While you are doing so take a real good look at the #77 connector (you will have it open anyway). Here's a great write up on doing the diagnostics by Gentalman_jon... http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/327 77/442480.html#POST1400571 | ||
| Midnightrider |
OK folks to make this simpler I've copied parts of Gentalman_jon's post here Step 1: CHARGE the battery. Don't do this by revving the bike, do this by charging the battery. Step 2: Set multimeter to DC volts, and connect directly to battery posts. It should read 12.8-ish to 13.2-ish. If it's lower, see step 1, or replace battery. if your battery is more than two years old, it might not hurt to throw a new one in there, unless you like riding in tow trucks more than riding on motorcycles. mine is 12.9 Step 3: Start bike. Battery should NOT drop below (ideally) 9 volts while cranking. Typically, if it'll crank the bike over at a consistant speed, for a few seconds, it's fine. This is not a true load test, but it's close enough for the homeboy mechanic. If you own a true load tester, you shouldn't be getting your electrical advice from the internet, anyways. step 4: at idle, Multimeter on the battery should read 13.5+ volts. Just off idle, to redline, should read 14.4 volts. Less than 14 is serious cause for concern, as is much OVER 14.4. If it's 14.7 or higher, go buy a regulator right now, and avoid running the bike until it's charging at 14.4 or less. Battery explosions suck. mine is 12.3 OK, less than 14 volts? Check: Battery cable tightness, regulator ground, stator connections, etc. Re-test. Done. No changes THEN with bike OFF, unplug stator. Connect multimeter leads to stator side of the connector. DON'T jam your multimeter leads directly into connector, unless you LOVE intermittant electrical issues. Note: now is the time to pray some previous owner didn't JAM his multimeter leads into the connector. If you've ever met one of your wife's ex-boyfriends, you know what I'm talking about. Once making contact with your multimeter, set it OHM's. It doesn't matter which stator wired you connect to, as you'll try them all. Pick one pair, measure, then swap ONE lead to the other wire. Measure, then swap the lead you DIDN'T move the first time. 3 ohms or less, you're golden. if the meter reads "open" or similar, you're buying a stator. If it reads significantly higher than 3 ohms, you're buying a stator (what's "significant"? 6 ohms or more). any combination across the white wire reads 6-7. But only on the higher 20K scale. Seems illogical to me. Lower scales it remains at 2 ( does go to 0.0 something if you touch the leads together ) Now check all 3, one at a time, against ground (The engine, frame, chassis, negative battery terminal, etc). It SHOULD read open. If it reads any resistance (Ohms), at all, go buy a stator. no reading (well actually remains at 1) POS Harbor frieght multimeter - i'll get a real one and retest tomorrow OK. So we know the stator is not fubar'd, yet. Notice we're moving on, and we didn't ohm-check the regulator. That's because there is NO such test. Sorry. You can ohm-check it if you want, but it's not a valid test. I've measured several dozen, some new, some used, some old, some new, some bad, some good. The consistancy just isn't there. Because the regulator also rectifies, it can fail in many different ways. Undercharging, no charging, failure to rectify, etc. I've seen regulators with the backs melted off, putting out ZERO volts, smoking from the input voltage, and not having a proper ground, and they've ohm'ed out the same as the brand new unit that fixed the problem. Back to the stator. Bike OFF, switch multimeter to AC voltage. Now, this is the point where the bike can shock you, hurt you, kill you, insult your children, and knock up your wife. You're playing with AC, so no touchie on the wires, okay? Hook up, start the bike, and measure the AC output between any two wires. Got voltage? Good. Does it increase in a relatively linear fashion with RPM? Good. Honestly, at this point, I don't remember the spec, so maybe someone will chime in with it (Assuming they've read this far). If you have a service manual, it's in there. Now check the other combinations of stator wires, like we did for the ohm-check. If you have smooth, linear AC power starting at the mid-teen range, and ending up at 35 Volts or so, and the output is similar for all three legs, the stator is OK. It's the behavior more than the actual number at this point, but the number need to be reasonable enough to provide voltage for a 12 volt system. didn't go this far - i'll try tomorrow with a better meter So if the stator is outputting (and if it doesn't pass the ohm-check, it won't be), and the battery isn't charging 14.4-ish, go buy, and install a regulator, and retest at the battery, looking for 14.4 (DC, you did reset your meter to DC to test the battery, right?) volts. If that doesn't fix it, let me know. Also don't forget to re-connect the stator to the regulator, before continuing on with other tests, or test rides. Don't ask how I know this. This may seem overly complicated at first, but print it out, read it, it will make perfect sense. One additional problem that is not mentioned above, is failure at connector #77, between the voltage regulator and the battery, or the wires that go from 77 to the battery. These often melt or break, so checking continuity from the connector to the battery, and checking the connector is also a good idea. I had a hidden broken wire in this area. Here is another excellent post by "Rays" that describes checking the voltage regulator. http://docs.google.com/View?revision=_latest&docid =d4rbxwr_20dq5khf&hl=en Of course, having a shop manual and parts book doesn't do any harm either. just my .02¢ 77 connector - possible tiny tiny bit of corrosion at the tip of one blade. Not even the sides of the tip - just the tip tip. Applied some dielectric grease with no change in the battery at rest and battery at idle readings How much does a stator cost? | ||
| Reepicheep |
The POS harbor freight multimeter (which, if it is like the POS harbor freight multimeter I have, really is a POS) was probably actually reading right... it was trying to tell you the resistance was infinity, meaning your stator has a broken wire. So get another meter and check again, but your stator is probably dead. | ||
| Midnightrider |
Yep Better meter, any reading across the pin connected to the white wire reads high. Not crazy high - but 9-10 compared to less than 3 on the other ones | ||
| Swampy |
I believe that the AC volt reading you are looking for is twice the charging voltage, say 28 or so AC volts. The voltage regulator is really a big rectifier it works like a really big diode, it only lets the voltage go in one direction. Since the AC voltage is a wave that goes above and below zero, the voltage regulator only takes the positive portion of the wave, or half the volts of the AC wave. | ||
| Midnightrider |
But wait - it gets better! The bike has sat for a week, because, frankly, the wife's been out of work for 6 weeks after surgery to repair both wrists (carpal tunnel/repetitive injury deal)and we're a little short Anyway, the bike has sat. Tonight, I tried again to test for resistance to the stator. Last time I didn't go as far as to try the current it was putting out so thought I'd try this time. Not sure why, but tonight I didn't get any reading. Operator error on the meter I think ( no "owner's manual") I'm not even sure if I was checking the correct plug - is it the black one or gray? But to the point. I hooked it back up and checked the battery voltage. 12.9 Then I fired it up. 13.4V. Increased up to 13.9 with some throttle. Everything seems better - but then I tried it again and when they key is turned on all the panel lights come on, then the engine light ( the little V-twin icon) goes out. 2 seconds later the V-twin light comes back on. The bike will start right up, but the engine light stays on. Jumpered the pins and get alternating trouble codes - 16 (battery voltage) and 21 ( exhaust actuator). Interesting because long ago I put on a drummer and I don't have the actuator anymore. Disconnected the battery, restarted, still get the engine light. Any ideas? Don | ||
| Midnightrider |
PS The Kuryakin voltmeter stays in the green ( where last week it would go amber as soon as I switched on the headlight) | ||
| Reepicheep |
It's annoying when electrical problems go wandering... hard enough to debug them when they are consistent. First, don't try and measure current from the stator with your meter, you will likely just burn the meter up. Don't know what the problem is, but I assume an intermittant stator short could be common, just based on the nature of the failure. You should be measuring resistance and AC voltage output on the wire going to the stator (not the one going to the voltage regulator) with the VR disconnected. Again, don't try and measure current output, though you could jumper the stator output to an old lamp with a 100 watt light bulb and see if it goes to "about half brightness", that would be a cheap and simple load test. | ||
| Froggy |
Since you got the drummer, do you still have the actuator servo still connected or did you do something to defeat it like a resistor plug or race ECM? If not, the bike will look for the actuator at startup and isn't finding it. | ||
| Midnightrider |
froggy I honestly don't remember any "defeating mechanism". I can say I've run the bike for at least 2 years in the current configuration and this is the first time I've seen the trouble code ( although I've seen many others during that time) and this is the only time the trouble light came on and stayed on | ||
| Midnightrider |
In fact, I now remember that the servo mechanism I left in place but disconnected when I installed the drummer was flat-out gone when I installed an updated inner airbox this winter. I assumed that the service tech removed it entirely last time I had the bike in for replacement of a broken throttle body valve |
