| Author | Message | ||
     Rick_a |
I chose this dealership as they were the nearest dealership having the exact car my wife wanted. The salesman was all "yes" when inquiring about the sale of said vehicle and in response to my terms and wishes. When all was said and done I was low-balled $500 on my trade (about half of what was agreed upon) and was flatly lied to; the salesman saying that the bank needed an additional $1000 for downpayment. I did not pay it, had proof that it was not true, and yet received harassing phone calls for two months from this guy, leaving messages and even calling me at work asking for this money. On top of all that I was obligated to purchase an extended warranty (for their trouble?!) which I promptly canceled and they took their sweet time to refund. Later a warranty issue came up...the staff promised the use of loaners for service issues that are more than routine service. The vehicle was misfiring on one cylinder, stumbling and lurching badly. The Service advisor told my expectant wife to keep driving it and that they didn't have a loaner...she'd have to wait until they had an opening. Outraged, we demanded they take the vehicle in and loan us a car (turns out they an entire fleet of cars to loan) and we were finally taken care of albeit with a lot of unnecessary drama...as is the way they seem to like doing business. Every dealing with this dealership has resulted in great frustration and some kind of hassle...their customer service is terrible and what they promise is never delivered. Anyone else deal with this kind of stuff at car dealers? BTW the car is an '07 Honda Fit Sport w/ manual trans for the wife. It's a fun little car and very practical...roomy for its size and has a very flexible interior...wouldn't have been my choice but she loves it. | ||
| Toe_cutter |
Isn't there another Honda dealer to go to? Placing a call to Honda directly might help also. Personally I would never trade a car in, it's just too hokey dealing with them, just sell the thing on craigslist or ebay. More than likely the appraisal of your trade wasn't what he thought and had to cut the difference out of the new cars profit, which probably isn't much on a Fit. Not that the dealer cares, it's the salesman who's taking the beating on that. Having been in the business I wish you would have posted this prior to buying it, but for the future and for those others that might read this here's a few hints in buying a new car. 1) no trades, just sell it 2) Secure your own financing, if you have credit union at your work these usually offer the best deals. 3) Dealer costs are readily available on the web, edmunds and even your bank will have them (the use them for evaluating loans). Figure out how much the dealer paid for it first and then negotiate from there. I know for a fact that American cars can be bought for cost (some times under) almost anytime (unless it's a really hot model ie. GT mustang). As far as used cars go, it's a crap shoot, but the financing and trade thing still applies. Also, just in case you don't know, at most dealers hardly any of those used cars are trades, they came from an auction. oh well. just my $0.02 | ||
| Kdan |
Car dealers are very low on the evolutionary scale. Do not ever buy a car without reading this. All of it. It has saved me thousands. http://www.carbuyingtips.com/ I'm serious...Thousands. | ||
| Etennuly |
Having worked in dealerships for many years and being rather savy at the new car game I was ripped off in the same way a few years ago. They called me back after a few days and demanded an additional two grand. I had the contract in hand and told them to pack it. They went to my wife's work and repo'd the damn thing. I called a lawyer and the law has a limit like $3000 on how much you can sue a dealership for in this type of contract dispute. Oh by the way...it'll cost $2500 to fight them and will take six months or more. They had taken our traded car out of the dealership saying it had been sold and the lawyers told me that if I didn't want to loose more to just pay the two grand to get the vehicle back. I called all of the TV news guys who do the consumer help programs, but guess what, they won't return your calls if you are trying to report one of the dealerships that spend thousands of dollars on advertising every month! Ahhh crap! don't get me started...I got more.  | ||
| Swampy |
What was the name of the one movie that Robin Williams played the car dealer in? Cadillac Man? Motorcycle?, AK47? Awh forget it..... Toe Cutter is right, too much hokey, when it comes to trades, you will end up financing that "new" car for way more than its worth and be upside down on it when you drive it off the lot. Also there is no such thing as investing in a new car. | ||
| Xbrad9r |
i am the General Manager of a multi-line car dealership...i like to trade with customers who have done their homework, because it makes it easier and the customer knows what a deal i have given them when we are finished. there are good and bad in every business and unfortunately the car business gets a bad rap because it has poorly trained people that bounce from dealership to dealership that lie to customers, try to make a quick buck and then get away from that dealership before all his customers rat him out for all his false promises (free loaners, free oil changes, etc, etc). ask your salesman how long he has worked there and as a general rule the guys that have been at a dealership 2-8 years, more often than not, are good, legitimate salesmen that try to keep their customers happy and want return/referral business. as far as never trading in...you may end up costing yourself quite a bit depending on how your state does the taxes. Tennessee for instance, charges 7% on the sales price or the trade difference, if a trade is involved. so, if your trade allowance is 20,000 that would equal $1400...so in essence you are getting 21400 for your car because of the 1400 you are knocking off of the tax part of the transaction...and i let the customer know this so that they can make an informed and correct decision. I normally can beat most credit unions rates as well and save you more money on interest side of the deal...again if you are educated (know your credit bureau score, call local banks and credit unions, and check their rates based on the amount of money you plan on financing, the term, and your credit score so you can compare) you will know if you are getting a deal or getting smoked. One of our favorite sayings in the car business is "Buyers are liars". If i had to tell one lie to every customer that i talked to for the next year, the customers would still have told me more lies than I did them. It is absolutely unbelievable what people will look you squarely in the eyes and tell you. (i have actually "run off" two customers recently and told them to never return to our dealership because of the level their lies climbed to) the top ten lies customer tell their car salesman...this is right off the top of my head from personal experience (1)I serviced it every 3,000 miles ( well let's see it's got 28,000 miles and you've had it done 4 times) (2)It has never been in a wreck (oh except for those three you just reminded me about on the Carfax that i had forgotten) (3)It doesn't need a thing (other than tires, a paint job, brakes, clutch, new carpet, smoke removal, stain cleaner, etc) (4)Those miles are all highway miles (did you park at the exit ramp and walk home each day) (5)The internet says its worth _____ (could you send the internet a couple of pictures of yours so they can appropriately correct that dollar amount) (6)My credit is perfect (if by perfect you mean I am late on every payment, every month, no matter what) (7)I saw the exact same car at dealer X for thousands less (oh yea, except it didn't have power windows, cruise, 6 disc cd, aluminum wheels, tow package, leather seats, or two thousand $ worth of other options that i forgot to mention) (8) It's better than new (ah, yes the better than new line...if by better than new you mean it has "spoiled dairy product smell" instead of "new car" smell and the rounded off tires help it get better mileage because they reduce the total vehicle weight). (9) My car is worth more than a normal one like this (your right, that NO FEAR sticker is awesome, your fart can of a muffler sounds great, all the hand painted items in the interior that are peeling and flaking are really sporty, and that lowered suspension and low/"no" profile tires helping to rattle feelings loose really adds a value that i just can't put a figure on) (10)I am not trading anything in (hey, now that i have been here for three hours hammering you down to your rock bottom, show me the invoice, absolutely best price possible, take a look at my twelve year old, 180k mile, whatzamijigot. that... "#1", "#2", "#3", "#4", "#5", "#8" and "#9" and just so you know..."#6". And then after all of this..."#7" I could actually write a sitcom about all the incredibly laughable things car shoppers do...one of my favorites is the "scare-dy cat shoppers" the husband pulls all the way up to the vehicle, makes the wife jump out and leave her door open as she runs to the window sticker, and then yells here he comes in time to get her back in the car so they can make their getaway before the spooky salesman can drink their blood. Oh and don't even get me started on "cup suckers" and "brochure collectors" and to all those who take offense to this and still think we (car people) are low evolutionary scale people. then it takes one to know one, and i am in good company aren't i? | ||
| Corporatemonkey |
Just be thankful you didn't go here (warning this story will make your blood boil) http://www.komotv.com/news/5266251.html Watch the video | ||
| Rocketman |
Brad, even though I'm several thousand miles across the ocean with my own motor trade business, nothing you said could be more true. It pains me often the number of times we hear of how low we motor traders are thought of by the car buying / owning public. I can't remember the last time I charged anyone £48 call out fee to at the very least look at a Saab that won't start outside their house. That's because I never have. I do it for free. I want my customers to know I want their business and I'm happy to look after them. Charging for something that can be given as good will and sentiment is no way to win any customer in my book. Try calling a plumber or an electrician, if you can find one that will come within a week or even a fortnight to your house, and they will want that £48 before they so much as step over your door mat. The great thing about specialising in one make of vehicle is it does your reputation the world of good if you do it right. In twenty odd years of looking out for Saab people I have made lots of real friends. Some are closer to me now than kids I grew up with. Many take pleasure from looking after me. After all, when you're several Saab's down the line and you need the kind of service I offer, if I were no longer in business I can guarantee my Saab friends and customers would at the very least suffer in their pockets having to go elsewhere. As for whoever gave your post a 1 star rating, they're the type of customer we motor traders can do without. They're the ones who know better than you, tell you how you've done them wrong no matter how good we are at our work. Their angle? To try get the bill down. I too chase these single star types away. Thanks for your post Brad. It's good to know there's an element within our trade that's willing to speak out above the myths. Rocket | ||
| Xbrad9r |
Rocket thanks for your reply, you are so correct in all you say. Rick and Etenn...i am sorry to hear about both of your circumstances and believe that both of you got jerked around, i have never asked a customer to come back after the fact to ask for more money or re-do the paperwork. i apologize to you (as a member of the car business) and hope you will be able to find a good & reputable dealership that you can have a long term relationship with and not get worked over again. one star rating...my first one me thinks | ||
| Xbrad9r |
and i will add/correct my first post by stating that not all customers are liars, just that the bad ones make up for those that don't lie and then some...which on the other side of the spectrum is why i get dumped on by people like in one of the previous posts because the bad people and horror stories are what you hear about and think is the "norm" and that "all of them" are that way. again there are good and bad in every walk of life, Brad oh, by the way, the sitcom idea i talked about...A&E kinda has that with their "King of Cars" show...which by the way is (or at least was) one of the highest grossing Dodge dealers in the whole country...which means they average more profit per car than any other dealer, yet the customer thinks they got a great deal there. oh well  | ||
| Reepicheep |
Good stories Brad! | ||
| Rick_a |
Brad and Rocket, I can understand your points of view and agree...I work in a motorcycle dealership myself and have seen such things first hand. However, it seems that the honest, working-class consumer is often the target of maltreatment. I wasn't too sore on the trade-in thing...the NADA trade value was only $780 in fair condition...which it was. I just don't like being lied to at all for any reason. Basically they originally wanted $1500 over MSRP...maybe not a ton of money but I won't pay over MSRP for anything and I don't have any money to be giving away. They seemed to be trying everything they could to squeeze that $1500 out of me later...and then some. The main issues with our '88 V-8 Dodge pickup we got rid of was fuel consumption, a single bench seat, a total lack of safety features and no A/C. Bad for the wallet and unacceptable for the new baby. What it was good at was destroying newer cars on its rear bumper (we got rear ended a few times without a scratch!). If it ever ran rough it was an easy fix, and in four years it only left us stranded twice. This Honda has already had 2 issues in as many months  ...no big deal, really so long as it's fixed hassle free. Most of all I miss the 'ol Dodge setting off car alarms from across parking lots  . Anyway, the customer service chick at this particular dealer is exceptional...though she seemed to have a hard time believing me at times! Still, I'm letting Honda, the general manager, and the owner know what I've had to deal with. There are three other dealers I can go to...and I'm sure I'll find a better one. Oh, and we were offered a free oil change by the salesman at the time of sale, and I'm damn well claimin' it! (Message edited by Rick_a on January 20, 2007) | ||
| Aldaytona |
Car and motorcycle dealerships are mostly staffed by salespeople who aren't long term employees because they get cheated out of their commissions/pay and float from place to place. They don't have product knowledge or brand loyalty because they work from day to day without job security. Honda today, Chevrolet tomorrow, don't get me started on Harley-Davidson. Every manufacturer talks about CSI (customer satisfaction) but for the most part that's all they do, is talk about it. Once they get your money, you're on your own. Deceptive ads you ask? I've been to dealer parties where owners brag about getting caught and fined millions for deceptive ads/practices, and boasted that they made so much more than the fine that they will continue to do business like that, the profits are just too huge to stop. Buyers are liars? You had better be. But for someone who practices lying several times a day, who do you think the bigger and better liar is? BUYER BEWARE! | ||
| Lake_bueller |
I recently bought a certified pre-owned vehicle for my wife. It may well have been one of the best dealer experiences I've ever had (with the exception of DaveS). They didn't try to sell me any extra crap. The price was more than far (under KBB retail). And the customer service was outstanding. Case in point....I bought the car from a dealership that was 3 hours from my house. On my way home, I thought I noticed a little vibration that I didn't remember from the test drive. After pulling the car into my garage, I noticed the right rear rim was severly scratch and slightly bent. I immediately called the dealership. They agreed to replace the rim AND pay for my gas. While this dealership is not close by any means, they have a potential long-term customer. And I'd recommend them to anybody! See...not all experiences are bad. | ||
| Steve_mackay |
Lake, what dealership was it? | ||
| Lake_bueller |
The Saab Exchange in Lake Forest, IL. They are one of the largest Saab dealers in the country. Good folks! | ||
| Eboos |
The industry doesn't turn honest people into liars or bad people, the people are liars by choice. You can be honest and successful at the same time, in fact it is easier. As far as other people's perception of you as a salesman, you are in direct control of that by the way that you conduct yourself. If people still have an ill opinion of you, either you actually did something wrong and need to correct it, or that person did not spend enough time with you to gauge your merit. If the later is the case, you need not worry. | ||
| Nevrenuf |
out side of one bad experience when i was parting out the totaled m2, everyone else i dealt with on this was totally honest and if they weren't happy with something that i sold them i would have gladly refunded them their money. most of the stories you read about on this web site are pretty good. and it seems that just about everyone here would go out of their way for someone else, even though some of the things that get said are pulled out of our arses, myself included!! is it because you ride a buell that makes you that way or you got a buell because you are that way to begin with. | ||
| T9r |
My wife needed a vehicle. We chose to get a new 2006 Mustang GT. We had a friend who provided us with an X-plan pin number and got the car at the SET price, I was pleased. The dealer tried to sell us some extras but didn't spend much time with us on that. I'm now dealing with buying an extended service plan (ESP). I found the best deal on a 5yr/100k mi Premium Care warranty thru a dealer in TX that deals with the Mustang Source forum. It pays to shop around and to know someone. Our local dealer, even though I knew someone was still shady when it came to pricing the ESP. Ditto... Buyer Beware. | ||
| Nevrenuf |
if you belong to a credit union, you can usually get a good service plan from them at a fraction of the cost. | ||
| Etennuly |
Over the years I have purchased probably ten new vehicles not counting bikes. Of those deals three were incredibly bad, two were eh...no real foul and five that went incredibly well. A dealer in Florida one time tried to lock me in and office with my daughter and force me to give up my personal info and keys for my car that I wasn't even considering trading. I was just there to inquire about a price on a new van that wasn't listed. I had to push my way passed two sales bully's dragging my then twelve year old daughter. We ran to our car and the whole sales team ran after us exclaiming that we had to give the info. They surrounded our car wherein I put it in gear, blowing the horn, and stomping the gas pretty hard. Those bastards were jumping that day! I had heard that they were doing that to unsuspecting customers. If I had known how bad I would not have taken my daughter. There is more, later. | ||
| Daves |
I buy all my stuff from the dealership I used to work at. Kandie has been a customer there for a long time too. Good dealership, always has been and since they "know, that I know" they always just give me a good deal up front. Of course it helps that I don't treat them like 2nd class citizens and I expect and want them to make a profit. I always get a salesperson involved, he has been there 18 years. Yes, I could just go straight to the owner, to cut out the salesperson's commission but I always hated people that did that,still do. The owner isn't going to take care of me as well as a salesperson that made a commission off me and that I send business to. I could go on for hours about stuff that customers tried to pull in the 9 1/2 years I sold cars. As for the deal the dealer in FL tried with Etennuly, well that would've been the day a couple of salespeople got the crap beat out of them. | ||
| Court |
I recently bought a new car for myself and one for the SCU. Both experiences were superior. I consider it, at least partially, pure luck. | ||
| Nevrenuf |
I wouldn't be surprised to hear that it was one of the ford dealers in town. maybe even brandon ford vern. sometimes it's hard to find a dealer to get a good repore with cause how often do you go into a dealer to get a new car and after that how often do you go in to have the car serviced. i know i haven't bought the first thing from you dave but you were willing to go out of your way to help me decide what i should try and get a buddy for his birthday. of which he was unable to decide. the only thing i know from what i read is you have the confidence of most of the people on this site for what you do for other people and it's a shame that you don't see that anywhere you go. florida, being the transient state that it is, you get alot of sales people down here looking to get over on people like you cause what are the chances your going to see them again before they end up moving. | ||
| Etennuly |
That particular dealership was shut down and sued so many times, but Ole' Big John would open up a new one with a different name, even on the same property a couple of times. There was another time I had purchased a new Lumina van. The salesman made a mistake on the contract but I didn't know it. They called me at work and insisted that I get to the dealership NOW. I told them I would be there after work and that I wanted to go get my copy of the contract at home. They called several times over a couple of hours and insisted that I get there now or they would send a Deputy to pick me up(they have connections right or wrong). So I went. The salesman had listed a $3000 down payment on two separate lines, giving me a $6000 down payment. The way that contract form was designed I missed it, he missed it, the loan officer missed it, and it was only found by their accounting people a month later. Well they hurriedly escorted me into a little cubical with a new contract. I didn't have time to get mine and they refused to show me the original that they had. I told them I wanted to see what mistake they were talking about(I didn't know about it yet). The loan guy said just sign this new contract and you can leave. I told him I'd do no such thing without proof. He then said I couldn't leave until I signed. I took that as a challenge. I got up to leave that cubical and two muscle bound weight lifting gorilla's immediately blocked the door. I squeezed out between them and they caught my arms and pulled me back in. I verbalized what was happening to the customers in the show room so that someone would see what was happening. I figured I needed witnesses to this mess. They forced me to sign, so I did it in a way that could easily be interpreted as being done under duress. I got the name of two of the witnesses and got out of there asap. I did a police report as soon as I got back to my office and called a lawyer. I would have been happy to correct the mistake on the contract and pay the $3000 due. I bought it, it was a mistake, no big deal. But after being treated like that and being held against my will, that was just nuts. I sued, I won, they still suck. But it cost them more than four times the mistake. There are still more sad but true, later. | ||
| Daves |
wow! | ||
| Xbrad9r |
Hey T9r, pm me and I will let you know what you can get that ESP contract for so you won't get burned. anyone that ever has any questions about Fords Mercs Chrysler Dodge or Jeeps. let me know and i will give you figures to keep dealers from screwing you over. I agree with Daves 1000%, i am here to average enough profit to keep my job and hopefully get enough repeat/referral and word of mouth business to be a success. I am not trying to sell anyone (unless you are close enough. wink-wink) but just to help you make educated deals and protect yourself from the less scrupulous persons you may deal with. Thanks, Brad | ||
| Rocketman |
Of course it helps that I don't treat them like 2nd class citizens and I expect and want them to make a profit. Fortunately there seems to be more people who realise this, but there are those who don't. Seller beware! Rocket | ||
| Rick_a |
All I know is that the next time a salesman supposedly makes me a deal I want it in writing FIRST. The only other bad deal I had was that Dodge when we initially purchased it. It blew up 13 miles down the road. Apparently it had a blown head gasket...gasket fix in the cooling system lasted just enough to make the test drive...but not the drive home! I payed cash/check...the guy didn't want to work with me about the thing blowing so I put a stop payment on the check (it was only $150). I was going to work it over some anyway and rebuilt it to my liking. I was still pissed over having to use an S1 as a family vehicle for several months, taking the wife to/from work as well her son to/from school. Now those are hard times! Next time it'll be a personal check! |
