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Aesquire
| | Posted on Friday, December 29, 2006 - 11:08 pm: | 
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I am reminded of a hunting joke.....
2 guys went hunting, Bill & Ted. Bill tells Ted to walk through the woods & chase the deer towards Bill, who will then shoot one. Ted walks through woods, and as he comes out Bill shoots him. Bill hauls him to the hospital, and after some time in surgery, the doctor comes out, shaking his head. "We did what we could, but, sorry. The gunshot wound wasn't too bad, but did you have to dress him out?"
Since I like venison either in chili, ( cut into bite size cubes, dredge with flour, brown all sides, add meat & fond ( the brown bits stuck to fry pan ) to chili ) or as sausage, (mixed with a tasty pork sausage to add fat. venison is quite lean ) the odds are good that I offend at least 2 religions when I eat it. Often more. I can't seem to avoid religious wrath, huh? |
Jon
| | Posted on Friday, December 29, 2006 - 11:28 pm: |
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You won't offend me. In fact your post is making me hungry. |
Old_bird
| | Posted on Saturday, December 30, 2006 - 10:55 am: |
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Patrick,
Locally, it is bow hunting only within city limits. On my former employer's property we tried to enforce take two does before one buck. The hunters seemed to work amongst themselves where some would take enough does to cover those who only wanted to shoot trophy bucks. It seemed to work out. But we had a small group, somewhere between 15 and 25 hunters.
Shooting from a helicopter?!?! Sheesh, it would be a whole lot easier and much, much cheaper to just get a Xanax prescription. Sheesh!
I've got nothing against rifle hunting. I haven't hunted in many years (and that was pheasants) but find myself wanting to hunt now. I have a nephew who has invited me to join him turkey hunting. He eats what he shoots. If I remember right, turkey season is March or April here. I should give it a try.
Rocket,
I looked at the Wikipedia doc. It made my head spin (but I already had a headache.)
Thanks for the research cite. As you say it does appear that England has reduced its emissions from 1990 to 2003. Good for them. That still leaves the rest of the world, but somebody has to be first.
I'm just not convinced that "greenhouse" gases are causing global warming. I've seen claims that the majority of the temperature increase in the 20th century occurred in the first half of the century while the majority of the greenhouse gas increase occurred in the second half of the century.
Maybe I am jaded by the numerous times I have seen somebody use scare tactics to get what they want. It seems to me that happens a lot with land zoning issues, environmentalism and social issues. Those are all important issues; it just seems some really overstate their case to get what they want.
I think we should all go for a ride. Oh wait, I need to put my bike back together first. I should just buy a second bike so I can have at least one running. |
Old_bird
| | Posted on Saturday, December 30, 2006 - 11:04 am: |
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"Come to my house after Hamburger and baked beans night and I'll show you some greenhouse gas that's make your head spin."
Yechh! Bad visual!
"Since I like venison either in chili, ( cut into bite size cubes, dredge with flour, brown all sides, add meat & fond ( the brown bits stuck to fry pan ) to chili ) or as sausage, (mixed with a tasty pork sausage to add fat. venison is quite lean ) the odds are good that I offend at least 2 religions when I eat it. Often more. I can't seem to avoid religious wrath, huh?"
I almost asked a Fred Phelps follower (that wacko from Topeka) to reconcile Matthew 22:36-39 (Love thy neighbor) with their God hates message. In a moment of sanity, I realized I would be asking a rational question of an irrational person and that I would most likely get a vitriolic response. I still get sick to my stomach when I remember that mom holding a God hates sign in one hand and her little boy in the other.
Aw heck, I should call my nephew and go hunting with him or take my little boy out to the country and practice shooting. (I like a happy ending.) |
Rocketman
| | Posted on Saturday, December 30, 2006 - 01:45 pm: |
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Old, I too am not convinced about what is causing global warming, or whether or not it can be controlled or sustained or whatever it takes if need be to keep our world comfortable so to speak.
The problem I see, and I imagine many others too is if we are wrong and global warming becomes a very real and significant and irreversible problem and we did nothing when we could have done something...............
Rocket |
Bomber
| | Posted on Saturday, December 30, 2006 - 05:13 pm: |
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Blake -- due to your generous supply of bandwidth, I feel I owe you an answer --
however, after having read your words for the last few years, watching you denegrate other's religions, insist on specific vocabulary when refering you a brand of christianity, alter your enforcement of board guidelines in a seeming attempt to further your own religious and political views, act like a bully, misquote others statement, and generally display what I view as a remarkable display of closemindedness with regard to views that do not agree with your own, I think I'll pass --
this has long since stopped being an exchange of views, and has fallen into a shouting match -- I do not understand the reason for this behavior, but, as I've said on a number of occasions, it's your house, and you get to act the way you wish
enjoy the bully pulpit -- you'll find me elsewhere on the board, but uninterested in continuing this discussion.
Happy New Year, everyone! |
Jon
| | Posted on Saturday, December 30, 2006 - 07:58 pm: |
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I have a conservative Christian friend who is also a physicist at Lawrence Livermore Lab. He is involved in top secret stuff for Homeland security. He is brilliant and studies microbiology (like many of us) as a hobby.
He definitely believes in global warming. His field of expertise for the last many years has been the earth and it's atmosphere specifically. I know that top scientists disagree on the subject. But whether or not it's true, one thing we should all agree on is that man has treated creation like a backyard work shop. And we wonder why cancer is off the hook.
Pass the red dye number 5 please. I only eat red postachios. |
Frankfast
| | Posted on Saturday, December 30, 2006 - 08:56 pm: |
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And red meat. |
Jon
| | Posted on Saturday, December 30, 2006 - 10:05 pm: |
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I only eat red meat if I can be assured that the stock was organically raised....and tortured and ripped limb from limb. Then I eat!
You can't barbecue bean sprouts Frank. |
Old_bird
| | Posted on Sunday, December 31, 2006 - 10:33 am: |
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"The problem I see, and I imagine many others too is if we are wrong and global warming becomes a very real and significant and irreversible problem and we did nothing when we could have done something............... "
Okay, I can agree with we need to be concerned. I think agree that scare tactics and hysteria should be avoided. So my uneducated but common sense (at least to me  ) opinion is that additional impartial research needs to be done and that people, companies, hospitals and governments should be alert to effective, reasonable cost changes that can be made. The extreme greenies need to admit , or at least allow a correction of, the mistake of banning DDT and the belief that just because something is "organic" its better. (One "organic" that I have seem claims of higher cost and ecologic damage is "organic" milk. It appears to be perpetuated by the extreme greenies and the company that has positioned itself to take advantage of the "organic is better" belief.)
One area that I believe could be better addressed is mercury poisoning. The photo of a Japanese villager ravaged by mercury still is in my mind. China is the biggest mercury polluter in the world. While the US has done much to improve its mercury emissions, it is my understanding that there is currently no technology which removes mercury from coal burning. Maybe the amount of mercury being released is so small it doesn't matter but I am not sure of that.
One area that the greenies have had a good effect is water runoff (but again they take it to extreme). I understand from a local councilman that there are still some people dumping used motor oil in storm drains. Really stupid considering the damage it does and that virtually every service station and auto parts store takes it free of charge. The amount of trash in streams is really disappointing. (Come on people take that plastic bag/bottle to a trash container. Sheesh, lazy butts!) But the extreme is you can't wash your car in your drive and that you have to bag your grass clippings and you can't put pesticides on your lawn. (On the pesticide thing, I know several chemists who point out that the greenies have successfully forced the replacement of effective, relatively benign, long lasting pesticides with more expensive, shorter laster, more toxic pesticides.)
Sorry, I'm slipping into rant mode.
I better shut up for now.
Happy New Year. |
Old_bird
| | Posted on Sunday, December 31, 2006 - 10:43 am: |
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"this has long since stopped being an exchange of views, and has fallen into a shouting match"
Bomber,
I know there is a disagreement between Blake and you.
On the other hand, I believe Rocket and I are having a reasonable discussion on the environment. I admit that early on I was afraid it would turn into a flame war between Rocket, Frank and myself. I am grateful it did not. We all have strong beliefs and can easily fall into believing that ours is the only right view (when the reality is that we are both part right and part wrong.) Who knows, maybe Frank will let me eat a big cheeseburger when I buy him that beer I promised.
Blake and Bomber, thank you to both of you for keeping your conversation civil. The overall civility on this board is just one more reason I am leaning heavily to buying a Buell soon. (Now if that d*&% Ducati just wasn't so good looking )
Happy New Year. |
Rocketman
| | Posted on Sunday, December 31, 2006 - 12:37 pm: |
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Old, some could do with much of your levity in the FX thread. It seems I'm to be lambasted (again) for Buell blasphemy.
The only thing I know about mercury is if you induce the most tiniest of amounts you will be lucky to get to the toilet before it's too late.
Back to the 'green' thing. I think there is a more pressing problem with debating the experts opinions. Time to do so might be time not enough. That is another sensible reason, scare mongering aside, not to take the risk of working towards a cleaner environment sooner rather than later. At least starting now can only be a good thing.
As for oil down the storm drain. The mind boggles when you think of ALL the products we drain and flush down our household sinks and toilets. I wonder if there are huge vats of recycled washing up liquid and shampoos at the far end of the drain pipe.
Rocket |
Frankfast
| | Posted on Sunday, December 31, 2006 - 04:47 pm: |
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Bird - get the Ducati. My 996 is soooo special. I had a cheeseburger and a beer last night. I'll hate myself tomorrow. |
Blake
| | Posted on Sunday, December 31, 2006 - 05:00 pm: |
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I proudly admit that I am close-minded when it comes to:
1. Equating mass-murdering terrorists to soldiers. I reject entirely such a notion.
2. Recognizing that a "religion" whose laws mandate the execution of apostates is an evil cult and those who support such draconian laws are members of the cult.
3. Recognizing that many of the teachings and actions of mohommad are barbarous and malevolent and that none of the teachings or actions of Jesus are in any way comparable to them.
Yep, I'm a bit close-minded concerning the above. But I do welcome the opportunity to be corrected through factual debate of the issues. I asked for examples on some. I'm extremely hurt to get personal attack in return, from one I count as a good friend.
I think one of us is reacting emotionally.
I'm not shouting, not at all. You've misread my tone. Sorry about that. |
Aesquire
| | Posted on Sunday, December 31, 2006 - 06:54 pm: |
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"At least starting now can only be a good thing."
Yes, unless your actions make things worse. There are 3 problems with "global warming".
1. Some of the promoters are proven frauds. The "hockey stick" graph that "proves" our ongoing rush to disaster is not only flawed, but the formula used produces the same graph if random #'s are input. That's not misunderstanding. That's deliberate falsehood.
The use of cherry picked data by a former V.P. is exactly equal to graphing complaints about Buell Fuel Injection, by listing 1994 thru 2001 data only. Holy cow they get worse, real badly, & never improve! As my Father often says "Figures don't lie, but liers figure like crazy".
B. the Green movement is not rational ecology mindedness, but a quasi-religious cult. Originally formed by the KGB as a force to bring western democracy to it's knees, ( like KGB support for the KKK ) It is now a powerful force for evil in the guise of saving people from themselves. ( IMHO any group that wants to "save people from themselves" by any means other than calm persuasion & soup kitchens can kiss my...)
Groups like peta, foe, etc. sponsor, & participate in terrorist activities.
Global Climate Hysteria is a means to take power & eliminate freedoms. By evil people.
3.The sun is a variable star. Our science is not good enough to explain all things.
Although there is ample evidence that the sun is warmer than a few decades back, it is still 4 deg C cooler than 1000 years ago. The science of anthropomorphic climate change is still very new, and more study is needed that is not influenced by political pressure. From Exxon or Al Gore.
Once again. If there are 2 mutually exclusive solutions to a perceived problem, and you can only do one or the other, your science better be good enough before you act. Or else you paint yourself into a corner. For example, DDT use will probably not be approved, ever, since the folk who take credit for saving us from a minor if not harmless threat, will never take the blame for the millions of people who needlessly die from malaria & other diseases that would now be almost forgotten if effective safe pesticides were used. I don't care if E-bola vanishes from the face of the planet.
lastly.... since this is a religious subject with zealots involved, I think it best not to argue about it, lest some eco jihadist decide my excessive use of chlorinated brake cleaner, violates "all natural" sharia law, and a fatwa is call upon me.
Blake,
1. Right on. the enemy even is proud of their position as to the murder of innocents.
2. You betcha.
3. Yes, although my understanding of the semi fictional history that has sprung up over the founder of the cult of submission is limited. Islam, like Christianity, has some good teachings. Also like Christianity, when evil men use a faith to steal power for themselves, and oppress freedoms, I no longer care about the "good message" and oppose that faith having power over me. wish me luck. |
Blake
| | Posted on Sunday, December 31, 2006 - 07:10 pm: |
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"Also like Christianity, when evil men use a faith to steal power for themselves, and oppress freedoms, I no longer care about the "good message" and oppose that faith having power over me. wish me luck."
100% agree! 
I'd even take your point that islam "has some good teachings" even further; I'd say that the koran puts forth a BUNCH of good teachings. No doubt about it.
Then as corollary to your "when evil men use faith" statement, I would add that...
The most insidious and dangerous evil is that which is cloaked in virtue. Hammas for instance understands this implicitly.
And then following that the wise old truth that...
All evil need to triumph is for good men to do nothing.
Yeah, that might be seen as intolerant by some. I don't care. On account of I'm intolerant of evil and when I say "evil" I'm not meaning beliefs different from my own. No, I'm meaning mass murder and brutal oppression. |
Frankfast
| | Posted on Monday, January 01, 2007 - 09:47 am: |
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My 2007 predictions for the war in Iraq.
1 - The president will not take the recommendation of his Joint Chiefs and will add to the number of troops in Iraq. This may have a marginal effect on the civil war there but not in direct equation as to the number of soldiers employed in the effort. More muslim fighters will move in. There is no limit to their numbers (we are breeding them all over the world - a self sustaining cycle) as there is to ours. In two years dumps the mess in the hands of a new president. At least he is not seen as giving up and does not have to apologize for his mistake.
2 - The president keeps the troops at present levels and the civil war persists and increases in intensity. In two years dumps the mess in the hands of a new president. At least he is not seen as giving up and does not have to apologize for his mistake.
3 - Starts pulling troops out. He will never do this for the reason above.
I hope for the sake of this country these two years go by quickly.
Happy New Year!
(Message edited by frankfast on January 01, 2007)
(Message edited by frankfast on January 01, 2007)
(Message edited by frankfast on January 01, 2007) |
Blake
| | Posted on Monday, January 01, 2007 - 02:07 pm: |
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Frank,
Happy New Year! You're way off topic dude, but I'll humor you. What are your predictions for Iraq after Hillary becomes President? And as corollary, what are you predictions for Iraq if we abandon it before ensuring stability of the government there? |
Frankfast
| | Posted on Monday, January 01, 2007 - 02:23 pm: |
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My crystal ball has only a two year limit. I got it at Walmart. |
Frankfast
| | Posted on Monday, January 01, 2007 - 05:00 pm: |
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Didn't mean to sound "rude". I'm just longing for those years when the media was reporting on the amount of head the Prez was getting under the table at the Oval Office and not the number of body bags being sent back from Iraq. I hope after these two years we can get back to that. And to tell you the truth, I don't really care what happens to the stability of the government there. Not my(our)problem. They'll work it out. As far as a woman being president. Might do us some good. Too much testosterone in politics these days. |
Vegasbueller
| | Posted on Monday, January 01, 2007 - 07:48 pm: |
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On Blake and religious discussions....
Not that I think Blake needs help in defending any statement here but I thought I might throw in just one other perspective.
I have had the opportunity to sit down (or was that laying in a hospital bed) and discuss religion with Blake. My wife and I are openly Wiccan and believe it or not live by many of the so called "christian" values that the rest of the world does. During the days that we had the opportunity to talk, we probably discussed religion as much as motorcycles or barbeques and I was (nor was my wife) ever left with a feeling of being offended. We talked about reading/studying the Quran as well as the bible and other religious texts. I never felt judged during any of our conversations.
This is one of the reasons that I absolutely hate the internet. There is so much left to read into a conversation with out seeing facial expressions or sensing tonal inflections that you get in person. Unfortunately this usually lends to one party or the other taking immediate offense to something otherwise not meant to be.
Just my cent and a half.
Nick |
Blake
| | Posted on Monday, January 01, 2007 - 08:03 pm: |
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Blasphemy! A jihad on VegasBueller! 
" I don't really care what happens to the stability of the government there. Not my(our)problem."
That's what folks used to say about Afghanistan. Care to rethink that view?  |
Rocketman
| | Posted on Monday, January 01, 2007 - 10:18 pm: |
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I'd volunteer to give Hilary head in the Oval Office.
Rocket |
Mortarmanmike120
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 02, 2007 - 02:03 am: |
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Sean, you're sick....
Where's Ft_Bstrd when you need him? I'm sure he'd have a disgusting picture to go along with your last post.
Happy New Year All |
Johnnylunchbox
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 02, 2007 - 10:45 am: |
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I think Rudy Giuliani will beat Hillary in the 2008 election. |
Frankfast
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 02, 2007 - 02:18 pm: |
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Blake - no |
Bluzm2
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 02, 2007 - 09:17 pm: |
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Rocket,
That was DAMN funny!!!
You go ahead and do it for the rest of us that couldn't stomach the task........ |
Cochise
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 02, 2007 - 09:42 pm: |
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I think Rudy Giuliani will beat Hillary in the 2008 election.
RUDY...RUDY...RUDY |
Rocketman
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 02, 2007 - 10:54 pm: |
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Funny? I was being serious! And she'll taste like a peach. A million dollar peach at that.
Rocket |
Aesquire
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 02, 2007 - 11:54 pm: |
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Since any leader needs to have certain needs taken care of to keep their thoughts clear & less stressful, I thank Rocket for his generous offer. Go for it. ( can I get a promotion? put in a word, eh? )
I thought that was Hill's job from 1992-2000, & if she had done a better one, maybe Bill wouldn't have needed temps. But that's just speculation, a persons private life is his own.
Rudy? I was hoping Condi. |
Cochise
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 03, 2007 - 12:51 am: |
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Condi huh? That would certainly kill a couple of birds with one stone....first black president, first woman president. |
Mortarmanmike120
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 03, 2007 - 06:06 am: |
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I'll never be able to eat peaches again... DAMN you Sean. |
Frankfast
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 03, 2007 - 06:50 am: |
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Rocket - I bet you wouldn't offer your services to Rice. Yuck! |
Rocketman
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 03, 2007 - 09:11 am: |
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Absolutely not Frank. A guy has to have some morals!
Rocket |
Frankfast
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 03, 2007 - 09:39 am: |
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Anyway I think she's a man in drag.
(Message edited by frankfast on January 03, 2007) |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 03, 2007 - 03:01 pm: |
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This is a family oriented web site. Please remember that.  |
Old_bird
| | Posted on Thursday, January 04, 2007 - 05:46 pm: |
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Sorry that I dropped my end of the conversation. Life and the wife kept me from the 'puter.
"Back to the 'green' thing. I think there is a more pressing problem with debating the experts opinions. Time to do so might be time not enough. That is another sensible reason, scare mongering aside, not to take the risk of working towards a cleaner environment sooner rather than later. At least starting now can only be a good thing. "
The problem is you got to be sure you are doing the right thing. Doing the wrong thing is at best wasting time and money, at worst it does damage.
"The mind boggles when you think of ALL the products we drain and flush down our household sinks and toilets. I wonder if there are huge vats of recycled washing up liquid and shampoos at the far end of the drain pipe."
It depends on the sewage system, which should be quite different from the storm system. A good sewage system the stuff gets filtered and treated. Yes, it is sludge but it is clean(?) sludge.
"Bird - get the Ducati. My 996 is soooo special. I had a cheeseburger and a beer last night. I'll hate myself tomorrow."
Bet you didn't hate yourself. 
My only real solution is to come up with enough $$ to buy both a Buell and a Duc. Oh, and a good bottle of single malt that is old enough to vote.
"Global Climate Hysteria is a means to take power & eliminate freedoms. By evil people."
+1 Did you see the polar bear lie? Gee there are a few less bears in one relatively small area therefore they must be threatened so that can be used to force CO2 reductions. Never mind the fact that there are substantially more polar bears today than 30 years ago and the main cause of death of polar bears is hunting. The eco-fascists are liars and manipulators. 
"I'm just longing for those years when the media was reporting on the amount of **** the Prez was getting"
I'm glad I was gone when that one was said. I'm sure I would have made an inappropriate comment also.
I say we all could use a ride or some single-malt. |
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