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Brucelee
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 10:15 am: | 
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"Blue Jays have the best staff in the AL East. They will be quite a handful"
There are very few patsies in AL these days. I think highly of the Blue Jays. |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 10:16 am: |
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The Yankees first seven hitters will be"
Damon
Jeter
AROD
Sheffield
Giambi
Matsui
Cano
Man, who wants to pitch to these guys?
I forgot Posada and B. Williams as DH.
Any pitchers out there?
(Message edited by brucelee on December 22, 2005) |
Tramp
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 10:24 am: |
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brucelee- i believe the answer would be "pedro".
he'll do nicely against that lineup in the subway series.
further, remember that most elite athletes are 'funning' with interviewers, and for someone like pedro, for whom english is a second language, some latitude, on the listeners' part, is in order. |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 10:33 am: |
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"brucelee- i believe the answer would be "pedro".
he'll do nicely against that lineup in the subway series.
further, remember that most elite athletes are 'funning' with interviewers, and for someone like pedro, for whom english is a second language, some latitude, on the listeners' part, is in order."
Pedro is as good as they come. However, the Yankees have had their way with him on numerous ocassions so I think even he would rather face Tampa Bay.
Having said that, I think we can all agree Pedro is:
A GREAT pitcher
Smarter than Manny R.
However, my cat is smarter than Manny, so, that isn't saying much. |
Tramp
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 10:43 am: |
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facto nondisputo |
Madsx
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 03:18 pm: |
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From: Boston Dirt Dogs
"Good riddance, Johnny Damon, self-proclaimed American idiot.
"Though I suppose it was hardly unpredictable that the New York Yankees would overpay a star player as he heads into the decline phase of his career, I guess I thought Damon might be the one guy who could resist the siren call of Delilah.
"But no, just as Samson was seduced and betrayed by that treacherous woman, so, too, has Damon capitulated to the overtures of the dark side. Delilah had to coax Samson to sleep in her lap before she had a Philistine shave off his strength-inducing locks. Damon, presumably, will willingly submit to George Steinbrenner's shears as he joins Goliath — after helping slay that particular Philistine in 2004.
"Samson's hair had been a symbol of his covenant with God. Damon's hair had been a symbol of his covenant with good in its unending opposition to the Evil Empire. After being shorn, Samson awoke to find that both God and his strength had left him. Will Damon suffer the same fate? (For the sake of Red Sox Nation, he must.)
"Sapped of his strength, Samson was captured, blinded and sent to grind meal in the prison house at Gaza. Damon — blinded by Steinbrenner's millions and Scott Boras' wild exaggerations — has now also been captured, pulled in by the Death Star's tractor beam..."
-- Kevin Hench, continued at FOXSports.com |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 07:41 pm: |
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It is sad how fans do this. When Damon was a Red Sox, the Beantown crowd LOVED him. Woman threw underwear at him etc.
Now he moves on, and he is a bum.
Well, they did the same to a guy named Roger Clemons, who the Beantown guys said was washed up. If memory serves, he picked up three more Cy Young awards and maybe 120 more wins, a couple of WS rings etc.
Lets give Damon his due. Whether he is a RS or Yankee, the guy can play the game.
Did any of the authors of the crap above EVER get 197 hits in the majors in one season? Well, Damon did that last year, his second best year in hits in his career. I am a Yamkee fan but I got to tell you, everytime he came up against the Yankees I winced.
Seems like if he was over the hill, he wouldn't be having his second best season of his career.
Face it, these guys (Manny, Pedro, Damon, AROD etc.) are GREAT athletes. Notice the critics who write this crap "never played the game!" |
Tramp
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 08:30 pm: |
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WHOA! That sounds like one of my posts when folks ditch on some motorcycle racers.
I honestly hadn't thought of it that way concerning Johnny Damon
NICE point, Brucelee |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 09:45 pm: |
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Thanks. I tell you, sometimes I hear guys ragging on V. Rossi. That guy is so good it is scary and here some beer chugging slug is talking him down.
These folks are clueless. |
Madsx
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 10:05 pm: |
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Sox Strike Back at Empire!
Boston Steals Backup Catcher John Flaherty!
(Message edited by madsx on December 22, 2005) |
Tramp
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 11:53 pm: |
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brucelee, that's exactly the sort of situation i was referring to. with biaggi, as well. |
Patrickh
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 08:04 am: |
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Roger ClemEns picked up 1 world series ring and no one in the Hub thought he was done when he left, Roger had a VERY bad relationship with a jack-a$$ GM named Dan Duquette. That caused his leaving town.
Pedro is still loved in Boston but his arm is going to fall off. If the Mets had gone deep into the playoffs Pedro would have worn out. Don't forget that he was shut down with 15 games left in the season because his velocity had fallen below 85MPH. (I'm a Mets fan too, living in NY has left some scars on me)
you're right, Johnny Damon is a dead to Boston. He is a rat fink traitor. scum of the earth. I realize this is an emotional reaction, but had Damon gone to any other team we would have lauded him as an all time Red Sox great. Derek Lowe got a standing ovation when he returned to Fenway. Roger did too when he pitched his last game in Fenway, as a Yankee, because it was not his CHOICE to leave the Sox for the Yanks (never mind the fact that he played for Toronto for 3 years in between.)
And now my pot shot at all Yankee fans (I can't resist given the tone of this thread)
IMO Yankee fans are not very knowledgeable of the game. I often like to ask Yankee fans a couple questions (I know this is a sick little hobby.)
Everybody always knows who is pitching tonight. I ask if they know who pitched LAST night and who will be pitching TOMORROW night. You should see how many can answer correctly.
Very few. You can't find a lot of "students of the game" among Yankee fans. Keep in mind now, I like NY, I work there.
I heard a great quote one time. "Yankee fans tend to be bullies or bankers, that is why I can't be counted among them." It's a quote from a business man in the 1930's...I wish I wrote down who it was. It was someone reasonably famous.
If you don't get
why Damon is dead to Boston
then you just don't get it. |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 10:38 am: |
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I lived in Boston for 20 yrs and I get it. The fans there have an insanity about the Yankees which I assume they get because they have lost to the Yankees at every turn save one.
I understand it but don't condone it.
However, just as it is not right to try to collectively judge 2M Red Sox fans, it is similarly wrong to judge all Yankee fans.
I am a Yankee fan who likes the RS. The field a quality team and their results are impressive.
However, it is a shame that the BOSOX fans infantile Yankee paranoia reaches such heights.
Hey, the guy wanted to make more money and the Yankees gave it to him. I am sure in the same boat, you would do the same thing.
Turned down a massive pay raise lately? |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 10:39 am: |
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"Sox Strike Back at Empire!
Boston Steals Backup Catcher John Flaherty"
John is a fine catcher but recently has forgotten how to hit. Hope he comes around! |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 11:07 am: |
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Interesting. For my money, Jim Rice was a fine ballplayer. I saw him hit many balls way out on to the Pike!
Monitoring the Hall's Future
December 23, 2005; Page W3
A friend of mine, a Red Sox fan, recently turned a discussion about the American League's Most Valuable Player race in an unexpected direction. Sox designated-hitter David Ortiz, he argued, is a future Hall of Famer. We'll get to the merits of that contention in a minute, but the claim raised a larger question: How well can you evaluate a player's Cooperstown chances midcareer?
As the year-end deadline approaches for members of the Baseball Writers' Association of America to submit their picks from this year's slate of Hall of Fame candidates, the fate of such borderline players as former Red Sox slugger Jim Rice hangs in the balance. So it seemed like a good time to fast-forward several years and discuss some active players who could be on the Hall of Fame bubble then. Barry Bonds, Alex Rodriguez -- they're gimmes. And a statistician's pet such as Jim Edmonds really has no shot.
AWAITING IMMORTALITY
See four potential Hall of Famers with impressive stat lines, each of them grouped with a more highly touted current player with less-impressive stats, and a current Hall of Famer, both of whom spent time playing a similar position.Where Cool Heads Prevail
Unlike an MVP vote, which is done just after the white heat of a pennant race, with the crack of clutch hits ringing in the voters ears, Hall of Fame balloting is cooler in the McLuhanesque sense -- with much more emphasis on big milestones -- 3,000 hits, 500 homers, 1,500 runs batted in -- on a player's statistical résumé.
So here are some stealth candidates who might not come to mind when you first think Cooperstown. In evaluating these players, we'll use our hitting stat, BOP (short for Bases Over Plate appearances).
Dodgers second baseman Jeff Kent.
• Jeff Kent: Jeff Kent? Yes, Jeff Kent. Mr. Kent, the 37-year-old second baseman for the Los Angeles Dodgers, is arguably the best-hitting second sacker of all time. He could end up with 400 homers and 1,500 runs batted in, and his .547 BOP is ahead of Hall of Famers Joe Morgan (.518) and Ryne Sandberg (.494). Craig Biggio of the Houston Astros is a favorite of baseball purists, but even though his .498 BOP is on a par with the elite at this position, he'll probably have to turn his 2,795 career hits into 3,000 to convince the voters. And since he's passed his 40th birthday that's no foregone conclusion.
• Todd Helton: How can there be any question about a guy with a .337 career average getting into the Hall of Fame? Well, Mr. Helton of the Colorado Rockies has two strikes against him. His late start -- his first full season in the majors was at age 24 -- means the now 32-year-old Mr. Helton won't put up huge career totals. Then, there's the Coors Field Factor. At home, Mr. Helton has put up Ruthian numbers (a .353 batting average this past season). On the road, he's merely mortal (.287 for the season). If he stays in Colorado, his stats will be tainted by that asterisk. If he leaves, he could be in for a late-career slide, like Frank Thomas of the Chicago White Sox.
• Gary Sheffield: In 1985, who'd have thought that Dwight Gooden would be an afterthought in the Hall of Fame voting? Conversely, today's fan may have trouble considering Mr. Sheffield of the New York Yankees (Mr. Gooden's nephew) as a legit HOF candidate. Sure, Mr. Sheffield has something of a bad reputation, but he also has 449 homers, 1,476 RBIs, and a .297 career average. Plus, his .591 BOP outpaces ex-Yankee outfielder Reggie Jackson (.552). Compare Mr. Sheffield's numbers with his cohort in the Yankee outfield, Bernie Williams. Highly paid and highly touted, Mr. Williams has numbers that aren't Cooperstown material -- his 275 homers, .298 average, 2,218 hits and 1,196 RBI at age 36 will likely leave him short of enshrinement.
• David Ortiz: Back to my friend. Every argument he made for Mr. Ortiz assumed that the level of his 2005 performance could go on for a decade. Don't bet on it. Mr. Ortiz's career will more likely follow the path of another Red Sox slugger, Mo Vaughn -- no one's Cooperstown candidate. Like Mr. Ortiz, Mr. Vaughn was a late bloomer who had a few great seasons in his late 20s, but after he turned 30 (Mr. Ortiz's 30th birthday was last month) his numbers sank. When I mentioned Mr. Ortiz's teammate Manny Ramirez as a potential Hall of Famer, my friend shrugged. In terms of image, Mr. Ramirez is everything that Mr. Ortiz isn't -- streaky and disruptive. But he's also one of baseball's best hitters. At age 33, Mr. Ramirez's 435 homers, 1,414 RBIs, 1,922 hits -- plus a .314 career average -- almost merits enshrinement now. So when it's time to commemorate this Red Sox team in Cooperstown, it won't be Big Papi's big smile, but Manny's funky hairdo, that's cast in bronze. |
Madsx
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 11:26 am: |
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Bruce, I here ya about Flaherty, but I just dont think they need him with Shoppach waiting to come up to back up Tek.
Yeah I'm bitter about Johnny cuz I think he just wanted to play in NY. He said he turned down more money from another team and the Sox offered him as many years as NY. So if its not about the money or time then it has to be location. Yes, it is his decision to play wherever he wants but, when he says thing like:
"There's no way I can go play for the Yankees, but I know they are going to come after me hard," Damon said. "It's definitely not the most important thing to go out there for the top dollar, which the Yankees are going to offer me. It's not what I need."
I guess a bigger spotlight was needed.
Yeah, things change I understand that but what happened to loyalty? I guess that changed too when free agency started. It is a business but there is something to be said for loyalty as well. And yes we do take this way too seriously in Boston. It is just a game in the end. But on the other hand there is nothing in sports like a Sox v. Yankee game in Fenway or the Bronx. Im looking foward to it already. And when that happens it means its riding weather again. |
Tramp
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 11:30 am: |
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Let's never forget the event that really capped the rivalry and started the curse. |
Madsx
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 11:42 am: |
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Thurman Munson slamming into Fisk at home? |
Madsx
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 11:42 am: |
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Tek and A-Rod? |
Madsx
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 11:43 am: |
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Pedro takin out the Gerbil? |
Madsx
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 11:43 am: |
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Bucky F-in Dent? |
Madsx
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 11:45 am: |
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Ohhh... You mean the Babe for No No Nanette! |
Tramp
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 11:49 am: |
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zimmer bumrushed pedro, pedro merely redirected his pamplonean mass.... |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 11:55 am: |
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There is nothing like a Yankee-Sox game. Baseball at its best.
And there is no loyalty in baseball on EITHER end. In the end, the game is a business to these guys.
As it should be I suppose. |
Madsx
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 11:56 am: |
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Agreed!
In regards to Zimm v. Pedro
(Message edited by madsx on December 23, 2005) |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 11:57 am: |
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"There's no way I can go play for the Yankees, but I know they are going to come after me hard," Damon said. "It's definitely not the most important thing to go out there for the top dollar, which the Yankees are going to offer me. It's not what I need"
I have to say that if the Yankees tossed an extra 12M at me, I would take it.
Then I would buy a house on Nantucket and visit Boston all the time.
But, that is just me! |
Tramp
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 12:11 pm: |
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Not me.
If I already had the cashish that the king of the idiots has, I'd have already walked away from the game altogether and spent the rest of my days between the austrian alps and western samoa.... |
Patrickh
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 02:03 pm: |
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My thoughts exactly.
If I'm making $100,000 and someone offers me a job for $300,000 that's "life changing" money
He could have been making 10 million and now he is making 12 million.
I think I'd rather keep my soul |
Madsx
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 02:27 pm: |
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Ahmen brothers! |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 02:40 pm: |
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"I think I'd rather keep my soul"
Arguably the silliest remark I have seen in sometime. |
Patrickh
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 02:46 pm: |
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"I lived in Boston for 20 yrs and I get it."
I concur |
Crusty
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 05:58 pm: |
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I support the Red Sox and any other team that beats the Yankees.
The Yankees Suck. |
Tramp
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 06:08 pm: |
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GO METS!!! |
Gschuette
| | Posted on Sunday, December 25, 2005 - 08:17 pm: |
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Hey Bruce I did play baseball in HS but that is not the issue. I realize I will never play pro so who cares.
If I were the St. Louis Cardinals GM then you could bet he would never be on my team. For me the most important tool a OFer can have is an accurate gun not a rubbery sling shot. He is a good hitter no doubt but there are other outfielders out there who mix defense and offense better at a lesser price. He would not be "worth" what he is "worth" now if he didn't become a superstar with the fairly tale Red Sox. Every person who played on the 04 team will now get a IMO unfair amount of money next time they go to renegotiate a contract. Their agent will pull the "he did this in the 04 World Champion season" and any team will then start to up their offers. |
Tramp
| | Posted on Sunday, December 25, 2005 - 08:20 pm: |
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i never played baseball outside of my buddies' backlawns when i was little guy.
Sometimes I wish i'd had. |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Monday, December 26, 2005 - 10:43 am: |
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I never get into arguments about how much a ballplayer is "worth" as this cannot be determined other than by what he is earning.
Obviously, the Yankees think Damon is worth more to them than the Red Sox do. In that context, there is nothing to say about it.
I don't have an opinion about Damon's arm but I do know he is plenty fast out there and can get to the ball most times. Moreover, it is doubtful he will play center in NY, Matsui is said to be moving over there.
So, Damon's arm in right field will be more than fine, as it is pretty shallow in NY.
We shall see, shaping up to be an interesting season. The key for the Yankees is if there starters stay healthy. If they do, it will be bad news for the rest of the league. |
Gschuette
| | Posted on Monday, December 26, 2005 - 02:53 pm: |
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If he plays right then he would be decent. I just love having Edmonds on my team. Flashy plays and a cannon for an arm. |
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