| Author | Message | ||
     Zimzamzoom |
Hi, Everybody New member here ... I ride a tiny little Sportster 883, but am VERY interested in all things Buell. I'm looking to compile some information on torque vs. horsepower for an article I'm writing. I've been a "lurker" for quite some time and this seemed like a good place to turn for some insight. Is there a discussion of this topic in the archives already somewhere (I couldn't find one)? Anybody know of any good articles on the internet? Anybody care to expound on the subject themselves? I'm willing to consider any and all information offered. Thanks!! | ||
| Dana P. |
Do you drive a Mazda?? | ||
| Bomber |
horse power = how fast you are moving when you hit the wall torque = how hard you hit the wall sorry, Zoom -- cheap shot, but I couldn't pass it by -- if you were to be a little more specific with your question, I'm sure you can get all the data your head can hold | ||
| Fullpower |
Horsepower= Torque x rpm/5252 | ||
| Ezblast |
Concur! ~ LOL | ||
| Rubberdown |
HP = how fast you can spin the top off the peanut butter jar. Tq.= how quick you can get it started spinning. | ||
| Sarodude |
Horsepower: What really matters - but not usually as a peak, useless, frequently published number. Torque: A colloquialism for Low RPM Horsepower. When most people use the term Torque, they are REALLY referring to how many horsies a motor makes at some nebulous point under the HP peak. True torque numbers are really only useful to engine builders, tuners, dyno operators, etc. To the vehicle operator, it's HP that does the work. There are people that like "Torqey" (or "Low RPM Horsepowerey" ) motors. Let's please just nip this in the bud, skip the technicals, and leave it at something easy to understand that's not inaccurate... -Saro | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
Also, (Horsepower x 746 = Watts) | ||
| Ducxl |
So,is the question one of either oversquare or undersquare? And which is more efficient? F1 runs oversquare right? Lighter reciprocating masses mean more efficient power delivery?I've got both varieties of twin,and i think for all out racing oversquare is right,but undersquare is more practical for the street. | ||
| Ducxl |
OOOHHHHH,"Rubberdown" got it right  | ||
| Cochise |
If you see an eighteen wheeler at a stoplight, when he takes off, his/her truck jumps, that's torque. When you see a car at a stoplight, when he/she takes off, their tires spin really fast and hard, that's horsepower. Not really the answer to the question, but better analogy than Peanut Butter. | ||
| Rubberdown |
What? Didn't like the P-nut butter jar analogy? Tch Tch Tch...lol. | ||
| Glitch |
Click Me! | ||
| Tom_b |
Torque is twisting motion usually measured in foot pounds. horsepower is amount of power an object produces at a certain rpm to produce speed once the object is moving. Torque and horsepower can be produced at any rpm range on any type of motor, be it electric or internal combustion and steam. You can't have twisting motion to get an object rolling with out torque of some kind. | ||
| Kdan |
Horsepower is nebulous. Torque gives me wood. It's not how fast you go, but how quick you go fast that matters. | ||
| Fullpower |
i had an 883 sportster too. now it is 1458 cc, and makes more torque than my XB12. if it is torque you want STROKE IT. | ||
| Jeremyh |
the simple formula for the simple minds: How does it fell sitting under your asZ. Really the only good measurement is the "seat of pants" rule of measure. In other words get what you like and if it feels good under your rump then keep riding it, if not get a new one. you want something that feels like its going to rip your arms off at the get go then i suggest the TQ bike like the Buell. You want something that has ungodly like acceleration and only requires one gear to reach 100mph then get an HP bike. you want something that has a bit of both, well buy a buell and strap the juice on it. P.S. I drive a Mazda and im proud of what they have accomplished with such a tiny motor. Hell if i had the cash and the know how i'd strap my new rotary motor in a motorcycle frame in a second. 200+ HP out a motor small than my I4, i'll take that any day. (Message edited by jeremyh on November 16, 2005) | ||
| Court |
You are kinda onto something. When my bike, that had not been started in 3 years until I roide it to homecoming at the last minute, got the NRHS, it was belting out an awesome 52HP. Know what? . . . I had a ball on the thing. It's coming back with "significant performance enhancements" and some more cubic inchables. . think it'll be 2.3 times as fun? Maybe. | ||
| Oldog |
Jeremyh: Suzuki did that (built a rotory bike) huge flop ZZZ Hp Vs Tq Tq = dive into a corner roll off the throttle, rolling open for exit. no muss fuss or bother HP franticly shift down entering the corner, franticly shift up on exit. | ||
| Ceejay |
Torque is what your machine does with the horsepower, usually through gears pulleys and what not and is more applicable to street. Instead of a peanut jar which aint bad, try a 3, 10, 21, 24 speed bicycle. The horse(power) is still the same-the person pedaling it, but depending on which gear you select you are better able to get up a hill or go faster down a hill, all in how you apply that horsepower-torque I think torque is more fun, but anymore when I get over 120-if I can even get there anymore all I can think about is what is going to jump out in front of me-cars, dogs, birds, etc...Going from 5 to 85 in two car lengths=fun | ||
| Spike |
Here's the best hp/tq article I've ever read: http://www.yawpower.com/tqvshp.html If you're into Mazdas be sure to check out the rest of the site. Even if you're not into Mazdas, the tech articles on airflow and port timing are quite interesting. | ||
| Ceejay |
correction-acceleration is more fun than top speed  | ||
| Phat_j |
torque is how much "work" a motor can do, hp is how fast it can do that work. | ||
| Gentleman_jon |
Thanks Spike . I agree that this is probably the best discussion of hp and torque I have ever read. | ||
| Jeremyh |
old dog, yes i know they did, but these are modern times and i demand a retry. Zoom Zoom and yes i drive both a mazda and a suzuki sorry guys i like the HP (hot ponies) and as far as the up shift down shift business, it has been blown way out of proportion. Honestly all i ever really use in the twisties is 2nd gear, why bother with any other when you don't need to.....frantic shifting LOL thats a little overkill unless you just cant ride that well to begin with. I know i know you torque junkies are going to rattle my can for a while but.......who cares. P.S.thanks spike but i have already spent way too much time on that website in the past 2 years. (Message edited by jeremyh on November 16, 2005) (Message edited by jeremyh on November 16, 2005) | ||
| Panic |
"So,is the question one of either oversquare or undersquare? And which is more efficient?" What??? | ||
| Panic |
In the colloquial sense, horsepower is torque at high RPM. (Message edited by panic on November 16, 2005) | ||
| Blake |
Mathematically speaking... Power = Torque x RPM Even a small Earth station satellite antenna will produce thousands of FT*LBs of torque about either of its rotational axes (elevation and azimuth). They do that via a small 1/2 HP electric motor and some serious speed reduction. So, while the motor produces 1/2 HP at around 2,000 RPM, by the time that power is mechanically transferred to the antenna axis it remains still close to 1/2 HP (neglecting parasitic losses) but at a speed of only 1/6 RPM. Same power, what is different? Speed (RPM) and torque. Power = RPM * Torque No RPM... no power. No Torque... no power. You need both. A turbine engine driving an attack helicopter or an M1-A1 Abrams main battle tank doesn't put out much torque. But they spin up to a very high speed and so produce lots of power. I big heavy machinery diesel engine only turns at around 1,000 rpm, but it produces ungodly amounts of torque and so produce lots of power. The tradeoff between a high revving engine and a high torque engine is not in the power they produce, but where that power is produced and the operational characteristics of each engine. Slower turning engines are more efficient (remember the big slow diesel engine). But more torque means they need bigger/heavier mechanical components like crankshafts and connecting rods and wrist pins and such. Peak HP is the domain of the high revving, short stroke engine. Great instant-on low-end power is the domain of the longer-stroke lower revving engine. HP = T * RPM Yeah, I left out the mathematical constant of 5252 for proper units resolution. So to be perfectly accurate... HP = T (in FT-LBs) * RPM / 5252 That doesn't change the relation between HP and Torque and RPM though, not at all. HP doesn't change, neglecting parasitic losses, from crankshaft to rear wheel. What changes is the RPM (engine vs. rear wheel) and the torque (crankshaft torque is multiplied by overall drive ratio for whatever gear is used.) Any questions?  | ||
| Court |
The Space Needle, in Seattle, is driven by a 1/2 horsepower motor. I know this, cause I read it in a story Court wrote about Buells in Seattle in 1996. Court P.S. - no horses, not even a 1/2 of one, were harmed in the composition of this post. | ||
| Ducxl |
Help,please...So how does piston speed apply in racing applications? Does that inhibit torque engines in racing applications? Why don't we see long stroke engines in racing applications? Honest questions...Seeking honest answers...I used to know a Jaguar "buff" who mocked us hot rod 350 guys' stating something of "lighter reciprocating assemblies.. | ||
| Panic |
Wait, I'll just summon up everything I've learned over the last 40 years and compress it into a quick answer for you... Better - read my article: http://victorylibrary.com/mopar/no-scale.htm | ||
| Fullpower |
anyone operating british rolling stock while mocking a hot rod 350 is wildly out of touch. a very reliable, daily grocery getter can easily be constructed around a 500 horsepower small block chevy... which will out last mile for mile ANY jaguar, mg, austin healy, or whichever british muscle you care to compare. | ||
| Bikertrash05 |
My dad's Caddy has a 300hp Northstar V8, my Buick has a 240hp Supercharged 3.8 V6. I can smoke him off the line, he needs the rpms to make power. I like torque. | ||
| Zimzamzoom |
Thanks, everybody! I knew that this group would be a valuable resource! | ||
| Johnnylunchbox |
This is a well-written and informatice piece: http://vettenet.org/torquehp.html |
