| Author | Message | ||
     Slowride |
Ok, I went for a ride on Sunday from Dallas into Oklahoma. I stopped at an EXON on the way (still in Texas) and filled up with 93 go juice. Within about 2 miles of the fill up my bike started to have some hesitation and then pop and backfire on deceleration. Up until this fill up the bike has had no issue. Just a bit of history, 1 month ago I put in Autolite platinum spark plugs and Crane 8mm race wires. I continue to ride the next 75 miles into OK and didn’t experience any major hesitation unless I was engine braking or kept it close to 4k shifting gears. I stopped and found a wal-mart and put in a can of berrymans to see if the gas was bad. This didn’t help either. I then rode another 30 or so mile with a riding partner I was meeting up there and he suggested putting some HEAT in the tank; possibly a water issue. So I did and nothing changed. I proceeded to drive the back to Dallas and I ran it till the reserve started to run out. I immediately pulled into another station and filled up with premium. I rode about a mile home and the bike was doing the same thing. I skipped a day on Monday and rode it in today. I put about 30 miles on it and it is still missing and popping on occasion. I sprinted the bike up to 120mph on the toll way and it pulled all the way up to it, but as soon as I let off I started getting the popping and hesitation. So my dilemma is, I use this as my daily commute ride, I want to get this fixed. Give me a place to start. PLEASE! | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
It might not be a gas issue, just a coincidence. If you just put plugs and wires in, I would check for those little aluminum nuts at the top of the plugs. I usually mash mine a bit with a pair of pliers before putting them on to keep them from rattling loose. | ||
| Wyckedflesh |
Start simple, replace the plugs they are cheap. Also, drain the fuel from the tank completely and put in fresh gas, even if you left in 1/4 of a gallon of bad/mixed value fuel, its enough to contaminate the new tank you just put in. If you can't drain it, then try to run it as far into the reserve as you feel comfortable. | ||
| Choptop |
O2 sensor. | ||
| Road_thing |
Water is heavier than gas. Guess where the water lives when it gets in your tank? If there's a way to drain it completely, that's what I'd recommend. After checking the plugs and wires, of course! rt | ||
| Slowride |
Thanks for the advice, I am assuming the HEAT didn't get all the water out? Would it? Also the bike is an 2000 M2. It has Carb. so I don't think I would have an O2 Sensor. The Plugs were like $14 jobies from J&P, I would hate to think I wasted my money, but Oh Well you got to start somewhere. I am riding it home from work in about an hour I will start digging into it and shoot back accordingly. Once again, Thank You, | ||
| Fullpower |
drain the float bowl, remove and clean the pilot and main jets. use compressed air. might consider putting the old spark plugs in too, they may well be better than the stuff J&P sold ya. | ||
| Jerseyguy |
I have debugged, fixed and got running literally thousands of industrial machines over the last 35 years as an engineer. My guys call this "Haynes Law": "If a machine was working and now its not, the last thing you did to it before it stopped working (no mater how unrelated to the problem it seems), is what's wrong". It seems trivial, but it's true damned near every time. | ||
| Slowride |
Fullpower, I am detecting a little J&P attitude going here.... LOL! I have had pretty good success and only buy products I know about first hand. You have anything I should know about concerning J&P. I made it home last night and back to work with only minor backfiring under deceleration. I still think it has to do with the gas, but I will take into account Jerseyguy's 35 years of experience and swap out my plugs. Unfortunately I threw the old wires away as they were all chewed up. | ||
| Cyclonecharlie |
Check your plug wire's were they go into the coil. Make sure they have the right ends on them and they are tight. And make sure the coils not eat-out where the plug wire's go. Also check your exhaust studs (loose or missing nuts). Trash in the carb is going to be your best bet,but if you don't find anything check those. You might want to pull the carb off and check for trash in the needle and seat(if it's flooding it will act like that).Good luck........Charlie | ||
| Slowride |
Update! I was on my way home tonight running about 80 and I tapped the throttle to go around a car and BAM! The bike started sputtering and making wierd noises. I looked down and notice my guages pegging and blinking on and off. The tach was surging to 9 grand and the speedo would peg and the odometer would blink on and off. I managed to get the bike to a stop in a parking lot and the bike was running fine, but if I rev it up to 3500 - 4500 it would start sputtering and all the electrical would flip out. I shut the bike off and called the girlfriend. As I waited a nice thunderstorm rolled in and started blowing and lightening striking all around. I thought I had pissed off the almighty. I sat there for a minute and decided to find cover. I tried to start the bike, but now nothing! Nadda! Kaput! I pushed the bike with the key on and as I got it up faster with the bike in nuetrual i could see the N and Oil light barely coming on. I jumped on the bike and popped the clutch nothing, Just slid to a stop. ARRRRRRGGGGG! What is it? Coil Regulator Alternator PLEASE Help! | ||
| Reepicheep |
2000 M2 huh? A *fine* bike. Start with the battery terminals, that is the easiest check and would not be uncommon. See if they are loose, pull them and clean them, and hook them back up. Check the ground strap while you are at it. Then, if you are going to let it sit anyway and you have a trickle charger, charge it up. If it won't take a charge and spin up in the morning, the battery is probably toast. If it will spin up in the morning, we can then start tracing the currrent either back to front (start at the battery and work backwards) or front to back (my preference, start at the stator output and work forward). (Message edited by reepicheep on September 28, 2005) | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
Those glass mat batteries die in an odd way too. they seem to open up inside so that a charger will not register any current going in and a voltmeter will measure 12.5V with no load. Turn on the light and blam! no voltage on the battery. My first battery died in this way as did Chase's during a ride up here. | ||
| Dave |
Plenty of electrical charging system diagnostic tips in the KV. Search for stator and voltage regulator. DAve | ||
| Slowride |
OK, called the service dept of my local HD shops. LOL, No one would even touch this with their own .02. They asked I just bring the bike in. So thats not happening! I did get the price on the Reg and Coil. Initial inspection shows no issues with the coil or wires or plugs. I have the batt on charge and will start the voltmeter trace tonight. It just really sucks driving in Dallas traffic in my truck. I want to shoot in and out of gaps like I do on the Buell. Did I mention is sucks driving my 6700lbs avalanche to and from work, Not to mention the $78 in cheep 89 octane fuel per week. I think I am getting chills and sweating, I think I can, I think I can, I can drive this cage. I think I can, I think I can. | ||
| Buellzebub |
i had something similar happen to my first S1... long story short it was a broken power (or maybe ground, it was long ago)wire going to the ignition circuit. the wire APPEARED normal but when the bike warmed up the resulting intermittant gap in the broken wire caused the symtoms you listed to occur. it was very frustrating hope this helps | ||
| Jackbequick |
Slowide - Here is our official charging system trouble shooting guide from the KV - it was the work of Reepicheep and will give you the info and values needed to troubleshoot the major components of the system. Pretty easy to do also. Jack | ||
| Slowride |
Thanks guys for all your help. I have an Update! Using the various links on the KVM and my Buell manual, I was able to start troubleshooting the electrical system. I found out very quickly that my Battery was pretty well toast. I charged overnight and started tinkering with the electrical and almost instantly lost power. After taking the batt. off, I checked and sure enough it was dead. I purchased a new batt. and off we went again. The M2 would fire up and run, but really badly. I started next by pulling the plugs. The front was in perfect shape, but the back was all carboned up, black and all. These plugs had only been in the bike 3 weeks. So I pulled the coil and checked the resistance per the manual. It said I should have 2.8 - 3.5 ohms across the primary windings (paraphrasing here)and the coil showed nothing but a short. WoW, how could the bike even fire if it was shorted out. So I pulled a friend of mine over that is a certified mech. and had him do the test and he got the same results with out using the book as his guide. Wheew! It was nice to be validated. I pretty much stopped right there with the troubleshooting and now I have a question for you guys. The Buell is a hopped up Harley motor right? So I have put hotter plugs in, Crane Firewires on and it came with a Buell Race Ing. mod. from the previous owner. Why would I run the stock coil? Should I? Which coil would be best.... Revtech 40,000 volts $62 Crane 40,000 volts $89 or something else? | ||
| Reepicheep |
Aaron did some dyno testing with single fire versus dual fire, and (to his suprise) was able to see a difference on a dyno. That being said, the difference was something you would probably never feel or measure on the road. So I would get whatever coil I could find that is available, reliable, and cheap (in that order). | ||
| Jackbequick |
The Buell is a Harley motor but not really hopped up. The Buells and Sportsters start out pretty much even, especially on the older tubers. I have a 2000 M2 also, let me compliment you on your choice of bikes. First Buell, I've only had it 7-8 months, and like it very much. In the electrical & ignition section of the KV there is some info on plugs. At some point prior to 2000 H-D/Buell changed to cooler plugs for all bikes using this motor. It went from 6R12 (too hot) to 10R12 (cooler) on the H-D scale. The hotter plugs can damage pistons I'm told. So if your plugs are about the right heat range and the plug wires Ohm out somewhere near the stock ones (250 to 584 Ohms per inch of length, interpolated from the service manual) everything should be on track there. As far as the coil, it would be nice to find someone here that has tried one of the others, but it might be worth a try, especially if it is warrantied. I bought a Buell OEM voltage regulator earlier this year but if I need any other major electrical parts (stator, starter, another VR, etc.) I think I'll give one of the aftermarket brands a try based on the lower cost and lifetime warranty some pieces come with. Accel, Crane, etc., offer a light at the end of the tunnel for electrical parts when/if the OEM supplies dry up. I have a feeling the tubers will be around for some years to come, and we're just starting to explore some of the long term parts sources. Jack P.S. - As I was posting that I see that Reep thinks it is a good idea too, that makes it official! (Message edited by jackbequick on October 05, 2005) | ||
| Bomber |
very little majik to be had in ignition componants, especially in a relatively stock mill -- shy high comperssion and other factors WILL allow high-energy ignition parts to help your mill make power, but with stock internals, as Reep, our valiant mouse sez, availability, price and mountability are all more important -- the stock part has little, if any, advantage over aftermarket other than availability (from one of our sponsors) and the fact that you know you'll have no installation surprises -- both these items are worth considering, though lots of snake oil available to the buyer in ignition stuff -- if your snake is too dry, they may be worth checking into ;-} | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
Make sure that the primary resistance is the same as stock, otherwise your ecm might fry or something. | ||
| Slowride |
Ok, final update on this thread. I replaced the coil with a stock part that was available at my Allen, TX HD dealer. (PS, I was informed that they were going to be buying into the whole BUELL thing again. We got new owners they said. They had a new ULY sitting on the floor.) I can only hope! I put the coil on and checked the plugs all looked good. I fired it up and it ran good for about 5 min and then started caughing and spitting at me again. So, I Picked up some new plugs and tried her again. She came to life! Tally of destruction.... 1 Coil Shorted across pri winding 1 dead battery 2 dead Plugs Coil Deaths are nasty things. Thanks for all the help. I will see you on the road. Slowride |
