| Author | Message | ||
     Chuck |
Has anyone ever seen the crankshaft design in Honda's smaller v-twins? It has 2 throws that are somehow arranged to give the engine something closer to "perfect" balance. They've made 500, 650, 750, 800, and 1100 versions of this design. | ||
| José_Quiñones |
Boy this is great stuff! My suggestions are simple and would have adressed some major areas of improvement of the XL "platform" It baffles me that they have not gone the "O-ring" route like on the Twin Cam to replace rockerbox & base gaskets. They should have gotten rid of the primary chain and used the V-rod's gear drive and new transmission. That might have helped to make the motor more compact and lighter? They should have dumped the DDFI system and used the Softail FI, which all FI Harleys, including the V-Rod, now use. That would make it much simpler for the mechanics, they only really have to learn one system from now on. The Blast Heads/Breather setup is an improvement in engine breathing, but who wants to bet that these bikes will still puke into the intake when pushed hard? Fans & Oilcoolers: doesn't this just confirm that the current engines need these anyway? The last one is purely for aesthetics: WILL BUELL PLEASE PUT THE HENRY DUGA BUELL RACING BELLY PAN, color matched, on their bikes as a factory item? Or at least sell it to us mortals without an AMA racing licence? It would help to hide the muffler, and in the Firebolt, would hide the belt tensioner which looks horrible sitting there in plain view. Anon, Blake, Aaron, fire away! P.S. I still think that a four stroke version of the original RW750 engine would kick ass and fit BUELL's "Different in every sense" attitute. | ||
| Aaron |
Quite honestly, Jose', I don't know enough about any of these issues to intelligently comment. I do know, though, that they're claiming the gearbox is now a slick piece. When I look at this new bike, I see several neat things that are impressive, and honestly, I have some concerns. My gut feeling is that on balance, despite a few gripes, it'll be a bike I really like. But I'm not going to pass judgement until I know more about it. I haven't even ridden the damn thing yet, much less know how good the tranny or ddfi or breathing is. How do you know there's not something about this motor that makes it need an oil cooler and fan, where the others didn't? I have reason to believe there is. AW | ||
| Blake |
Yeah, like maybe a frame being wrapped around the engine? | ||
| todd |
Just to add some fuel to the fire, go to mid-usa.com and check out their "power house 114 rev-o-lution motor" That should spur some convertation. i for one like the sputhe motor. i like the super v idea also. think "overkill" motors by jim mcclure. Hell i even like fuelings new 3 cyclinder harley motor. Arlen Ness [gag] even has a overhead cam evolution motor that he was going to put into production.there r lots of other interesting homegrown motor ideas/projects out there. i have seen v-4 big twins etc, but the most interesting one i seen latly is a local guy grafting a couple whitney and pratt airplane cyclinder/heads onto a big twin lower end! i can't wait to see how that turns out. the mock up picture i seen looked pretty cool. The guy evidentley has way to much money and time on his hands. i got to many more to list right now. maybe tomorrow i can give u my idea of the "perfect" ahem 45 degrre sporty motor if i got to build it from the ground up. i got lots of opinions on this subject [just not alot of time] if anybody is interested in what a grouchy old neandrathal thinks. | ||
| Peter_T |
Aaron you said; "I mean, hey, if the bikes from one company don't have enough power for someone, and they believe they never will so long as they have "X" design attribute, why not just go buy something else? Why harp on the first company to build it a different way? I don't see the answer to that question anywhere." And thats why so many of us are walking away from Buell and the firebolt wont be bringing us back. Buell wants to be a niche market and selling only to the faithful then they have got it made. If they want to be a real competitor in the world market then they are on a hiding to nothing. Keep the faith Aaron because many of us lost it a long time ago. I'll go ride my 120hp V-twin which doesn't have to be compared to SV650's or 600's to make it look credible Pete | ||
| Aaron |
Peter, I think you're doing exactly the right thing. Instead of bitching and whining and moaning that they don't make what you want, you're moving on to something else. Seems logical. In terms of whether or not their current strategy is/will be successful, I figure they've got a whole lot smarter folks than me working on it. I definitely believe their reliability problems have hurt their sales, and general perception in the marketplace. I'm actually encouraged to see them delaying the launch of this thing until it's "ready". Seems like a step in the right direction, and something that's probably very difficult to do in the corporate environment. The pressure to ship can overwhelm the pressure to do a good job, I've seen that happen at many companies. AW | ||
| Jmartz |
Peter: I reflect your feelings. Reliability aside (This has never been an issue for me as I am my own mechanic) the current Buell line is basically an old style motor in a state of the art chassis. Performance is pretty good but the top end is lackluster. The new bike is a step in the right direction and will have better performance than any model in the current lineup. Unfortunately 75 - 80 rwhp is insufficient to get me very excited. I have begun looking at alternatives but it has been hard for me to find that combination of style and performance that enticed me to buy my S1. I will likely keep riding the old and tired dirty bird till next year. In 2003 maybe Buell will give us the XBr10 with a bit more power to make those of use looking for more performance happy. Jose | ||
| Rocketman |
I don't think Buell have lost a lot of its customers because of the problems some of us have encountered. Sure, there's a few, but on the large scale it will only be a small percentage. What this new bike will do is bring in a lot more non Buell owners which will maintain if not improve upon Buell's previous sales targets. Personaly, I don't see how any bike that looks as good as the Firebolt and has all those bristling new ideas, and its geometery, can fail. When I look at the 'Bolt I see a Buell built more conventional towards the Japanese style department, which I think will "steal" sales away from the Japanese mid range "streetfighter" fashioned machines, and this will cement Buell's foot hold in the door of mass production. When those 'Bolts hit the streets I imagine they're gonna create a new way of thinking amongst the motorcycling fraternity, because it is gonna be a hoot to ride, and people will form a line to buy 'em. What gets me though is Buell's b u l l s h i t about world beating performance. In my book they just aren't capable, perhaps through financial commitment, to give us a Buell that will do over 150mph. Put it this way, it isn't about top speed at all, but to lead us to belive we don't need those very high speeds is making a choice for us, and as far as I'm concerned there's no good reason in the world why a ultra modern sportsbike or Sportsfighter with a large capacity engine shouldn't be able to crack 150 outta the box. To me it's a cop-out if for no other reason I can't go down the pub and brag about how freekin' fast my old (or new) tractor engined Buell is. After all, I've not seen a Buell yet that I didn't think was capable of travelling at seriously high speeds any worse than the opositions offerings of two wheelers. Hell, if the S1 could do 170 mph, I doubt the race reps would have as much appeal as they've had for so long. Not everyone wants to dress up like Mick Doohan when they swing a leg over a motorcycle but that doesn't mean they don't want to see 170mph on the clock. Anyway, where the 'Bolt is concerned, I think it's a step towards the conventional, at least style wise, but I'll reserve judgement until I've seen it in the flesh, and ridden it, but it isn't a hooligan like an S1, period, and that's the kinda ride I want to do ROCKET speeds on. After all, who would want to date a gorgeous woman if she was crap in bed and as thick as two short planks (All of you with "trophy" wifes, please delete that last comment  ) Rocket in England | ||
| Jmartz |
Rocket: I agree with you on the top speed issue, and I certainly don't care to be going 150 mph, but 92 crank HP even with a redline of 7200 is just not even going to accelerate competitively with the middleweight group, all of which are planting 100 HP on the pavement. Good handling, even exceptional handling and braking are fabulous things to have in a motorcycle but with less than 100 rwhp they are just not fun when you crack the throttle. I frequently run in the north Georgia mountains with 600's and while I can ride their rear wheels in the curves the moment the road becomes straight they quickly put distance from me. For my next bike I will have to put charcter and my ever faithful dedication to this brand (and HD) aside in favor of at the very least 120 rwhp. I want to be able to outaccelerate my city's 85 mph freeway traffic from a standstill at the on ramp. Jose | ||
| José_Quiñones |
 Looks much nicer if you ask me. Hey Buell, could you put this in the P&A catalog, PLEAAASE! | ||
| José_Quiñones |
Oil cooler: I believe this bike, like the blast, has piston cooling oil jets, which might explain the need for the oil cooler. The Fan: Like Blake mentions, the frame is wrapped pretty tightly around the rear cilynder, which might explain why the fans are in the tail. Oh where art thou, anon? | ||
| Aaron |
Jose': yes. | ||
| Rocketman |
Jose : That's it, you got it. Why the hell should we constantly sing the praises of our tractor engined beauties when the manufacturer won't give us something capable of beating a Japanese 600. Don't ya just get sick of snapping at their rear wheels only to be blown in to the weeds when we hit the open road. After all, most middleweight sportsbikes surpass 150 with ease, not that you ever see anyone riding 'em that fast, but at least they can if they want, which is something we can't on our Buell's, more's the pity. Rocket in England | ||
| Tripper |
Rocket my burly friend: Been there, Done that (150mph daily), am on to better things. Can't wait to test ride the Firebolt. Tonight my wife got her first long ride on the Buell. To celebrate our anniversary I took her to all the haunts we go to when me & the buds go riding, including blasting down the highway with 20 sqidley metrics. We didn't arrive last. Damned if I can get that stupid grin off her face. |
