| Author | Message | ||
     Scott_in_ma |
I'm planning to spend some money in late summer/early fall of '03 and I've become very interested with tubular frame Buells. The ride I took on a '99 M2 really turned the interest into obsession. I'm 33 years old, an experienced rider, a mediocre vintage roadracer and a fairly competent mechanic. I value usefulness over flash and my current roadworthy bike is a BMW R100/7. I've also got a Norton featherbed framed ironhead Sportster under construction. Can someone tell me the non-cosmetic differences between the late '90s M2 models and the S2/S3 models? Did all Buells from this era use the same engine setup? I would like to avoid fuel injected models (irrational superstition) and wonder years/models in the Thunderbolt or Cyclone models might help me retain my beloved carburetor. I prefer what seems like a more utilitarian usefulness the Thunderbolt has, but I don't want to lose any power advantage the Cyclone may have. The X1 is too weird looking (sorry to offend anyone) and the seat on the S1 is way too silly to accommodate my wife. With this in mind, can anyone make any recommendations for the Thunderbolt, the Cyclone and various years of each? Thanks in advance! | ||
| Mikej |
In a nutshell: 1. Rider and bike geometry vary some between the models. 2. If you don't like the S1 seat for yourself (we'll come to your wife next) then you won't like the S2 seat or the carb'd S3 seat. 3. If you are thinking 2-up riding, and if you don't mind the skinny nose seats, then any of the S2/S3/M2's should work. But if your wife wants a backrest then shop for seat/backrest options first and work backwards to which bike you choose. All depends on how you place the priority. 4. Forks vary some, inverted or conventional, M2's are mostly conventional unless owner swapped. 5. Later models have lightened flywheels and flowed/upgraded heads, with a few other variations. Later S3's have fuel injection. 6. M2's have the flyscreen, S2's and S3's have the fairing on front, depending on if you prefer naked or faired. 7. Best bet is to try and ride each, then see which one fits your preferences best. All three are similar, and all three are different, and all three can be performance upgraded to comparable levels. | ||
| Psychobueller |
The M2 is the best all-around bike. The '99-'02 bikes had a nice wide seat, Thunderstorm heads, and a nice simple carb. The 97 & 98 S3 were also carburated, but have a different cam that moves power to the top of the rev range. The M2 uses the standard Sportster cams and makes fat midrange torque at the expense of a few peak ponies. | ||
| Drwend1 |
In the future I am considering performance upgrades for my new 2002 M2. Any thoughts about the Buell race kit for the M2? I like the fact that the package is designed to be used together so there is no mixing and matching necessary. What kind of power gains are typical on the M2 with the kit? The kit does not appear to come with a jet kit for the carb I assume that re-jetting is necessary? Is anyone aware of any problems with driving on the street after the kit is installed. Thanks | ||
| Stevedplumber |
I purchased a race kit off of ebay at a fraction of the cost. Battlefield Harley-Davidson (Gettysburg,Pa.)installed it for about 450.00. There was an increase in horsepower(about 8hp) and an increase in foot lbs. of torque (about 10). I did have to purchase the jet kit for the carb. The only problem with driving it on the street is keeping the front wheel down.LOL | ||
| Pfranklin |
I tested the XB9S at Americade this weekend, and I fell in love. Trading in the Sportster is a looking like a real possibility. I am concerned, however, on the difficulty of performing routine maintenance tasks. The spark plugs are nowhere to be found, much less changed as far as I can see, and the oil filter is crammed in there as well. How tough is it for the home mechanic to do the routine stuff on this bike? thanks Paul bookbinder 2001 XL883 | ||
| Steveford |
Maintenance will be a bit more involved than with your Sportster but it's not required very often. Armed with a shop manual, a bike lift and a decent assortment of tools, just about everything save the fuel injection can be tackled at home if you have some mechanical ability. Unload the Sportster and get the Buell and you won't regret it for a second. | ||
| Mr_bueller |
So I just went and bought a 99 X1. It had a Supertrapp but the rest was stock. I have put in a K/N filter and am now looking into getting a working breather kit, whatever would do the trick. I am also considering getting a race ECM. The engine looks OK, no oil bleeding anywhere and nothing hanging loose. Is there anything that I should look for, frame, suspension, transmission, engine? Any pointers would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance. //Ferris | ||
| Firemanjim |
Hey,Anders,welcome.Ya know we already have one Ferris Bueller around here.(And he's sorta one of the founding fathers) | ||
| Mr_bueller |
Sorry, just joking. Thanks for the welcome. Question still stands though. For a 99 X1, what shall I look for in terms of potential problem sources? //Anders | ||
| Mzoomora |
Along the same lines as Mr Bueller, I owned a 2001 X1, and was wondering what the main differences are between the 99 and 01? I know the shifter is different, and the rear shock, is there anything else I should know? Thanks, Mike. | ||
| Drwend1 |
Buellers HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am pissed as hell at my local HD/Buell dealer. Here is the story. I brought in my new 2002 Cyclone for its first service and the tech laid my bike down on the test ride. The counter guy told me that the tech told him that he caught the clutch lever on something and the ball end broke off. I was of course suspicious. When I went out to look at the broken clutch lever still on the bike and I noticed that the shift lever was bent to shit. I told the counter guy right there that the bike had been laid down by somebody. I of course demanded to speak to the owner and/or general manager of the dealership. All the management including the owner were at a trade show in Vegas. A different tech and I went over the bike. The only damage I found was the previously mentioned clutch lever, bent shifter and a slightly scuffed mirror. I could detect no scratches or damage to the pegs, grips, frame, engine,or plastic. I will of course be going over it with a fine tooth comb. I am concerned about potential future problems with the transmission given the bent shift lever. After they replaced the three parts that they cannibalized off the showroom floor, I took the bike for a test ride and it seemed to handle, run and shift ok. I am not a mechanic. In what areas should I or better yet the dealer be looking for potential problems related to the accident. Given the limited amount of obvious damage it must have been a very slow speed accident or the dolt forgot to put the kickstand down. Any advice would be appreciated. Drwend1 | ||
| Tripper |
Ride it and don't worry. Nothing falls over and is as tough as a Buell. You have done all you can do to determine any hidden damage. I think your OK. | ||
| Hans |
Agree fully with Tripper. The bike has been just softly landed when you see no deep scratches. The only silent complication can be a stuck tank vent valve. Light air pressure at the tank nipple will resolve that. You will notice a slight "woosh" then, when you open the gas tank shortly after a ride and the gas has been warmed up by the, still hot, cylinders under it. Of course you can blow on the nipple or suck, what you prefer, to test the valve. Hans | ||
| Lowelltroll |
Hi all, I bought a '00 Cyclone back in August with 2300 miles on it. It's had the shock recall done. Is there anything else I should be aware of? Thanks, Lloyd | ||
| Reepicheep |
Oh geesh. Theres a loaded question. There is an updated front exhaust mount system that will save you no end of grief. It will run about $95, is overpriced, and is worth every last penny given the pain involved in the alternative. Your rocker boxes will leak, probably at about 4000 miles (front) and 7500 miles (rear). The new metal gaskets solve the problem, and kits are sold as a set. Your primary chain tensioner will split soon enough. Next time you are going to change the primary oil, just pull the whole primary cover and replace the tensioner ($15 part or something). Get the new metal primary gasket as well, it goes on much easier and holds a lot better. If your speedo sensor blows (speedo stops working) email me. Rejet the carb, there is a whole 'nother section here devoted to that. You probably already have a plenty big main jet (a 200), but your low speed jet needs to be a 45 (I think, double check me). A dyno tune is the right way to do it, but a 45 slow jet and 2.5 turns out on the (mixture screw? Whatsit called?) will get you in the ball park. Make sure the spark plugs are the newer 10r12's. Forcewinders look cool and sound cool, make sure the vent is ground out if you get one. Just route the breathers down and around the front of the engine, and out under the bike around the rear shock eye. A filter on it will make you feel better, but is probably not necessary. The Supertrapp / Buell Race IDS can is a great exhaust at a fair price. The D&D is similar, but REALLLY FREAKING LOUD. Find your oil levels "happy place". It is probably right at the bottom mark on the dipstick. Put more in then that, and she will hose you down through the breathers until it reaches the "right" level. Run full synthetic oil in both the engine and primary. The updated Buell shifter parts are affordable and help shifting. The Banke parts are even nicer, but very pricey, though my banke shifter has survived two lowsides now and been able to be pounded and filed back into shape... Run your belt "sloppy loose". Like you can sit on the bike, and reach down, and push the belt to touch the swingarm top and bottom without much force. I followed the manual for belt tension adjustment, and got a rebuilt 5th gear drive assembly for my troubles thank-you-very-much. Napolean bar end mirrors (www.sporttwin.com) look great, are strong as can be, and give a fantastic rear view. At 10,000 miles or so, drop your oil pump (not a bad job) and use a dental mirror to inspect your oil pump drive gear. If it is badly worn, replace it before it breaks (have to pull the cam cover and rocker boxes). All this stuff is not as bad as it sounds... its all pretty fun work. And it would have saved me a boatload of grief. And don't freak out... even with the grief I have had, I would not have traded my 2000 cyclone ownership experience for anything. It's a magic bike. | ||
| Lowelltroll |
Thanks for the input. I bought a Mikuni off of ebay, and the S.E. air cleaner/hamcan for one of my Winter projects. Will make sure to replace chain tensioner before Spring, too. Already got 3 quarts of the synthetic sitting on the shelf. I'll check into the exhaust mount as well, as the first owner has already welded the V&H muffler to the head pipes. Again, thanks | ||
| Lowelltroll |
Hi, have you got part numbers for gaskets and new tensioner? Always makes the parts guy happy if I have them. | ||
| Doncasto |
Lowelltroll: It is in CLICK HERE Although the page is built for T'Bolts, much of information also applies to your 'Clone - the tensioner is the same, gasket should be accessible as supercede to 34955-89A. Also, oil seal 37101-84 is usually needed. Don | ||
| Lowelltroll |
Thanks Don, Much useful info there for me. Ordered the tensioner etc. from CHD yesterday. Lloyd | ||
| Drwend1 |
Hello again I am happy to report that so far there have been no lasting problems as a result of the shop who shall remain nameless dropping my bike. I have just picked up a new wileyco ss exhaust for my 2002 M2L (great price and lifetime warranty). I was considering a rejet and a K&N filter in the stock airbox. Is this a good combination or is it worth popping for a new airbox. If so any opinions concerning the buell pro series vs. the force (original or newer type)and that company that begins with a k that I cannot remember but has the cool butterfly valves? DRWEND1 | ||
| Tdshepard |
I am having a hard time deciding if I should buy a pre 99 Cyclone or a newer model. I realize the seat is uncomfortable and the exhaust pipe is too close but are there some other "show stoppers" that would make me hold off on a 96-97 cyclone?Was there a big difference in weight or some reason I could't modify an older model with xb heads? I have a very short commute and want to build a mean lean Cyclone.Thanks! | ||
| Reepicheep |
I have a 2000 M2, and love it... but those pre 99 bikes look SOOOO much better (IMHO). Basically a slightly friendlier S1. I do like the fact that I can hop on my comfy 2k M2 and ride all day, or whip through some twisties equally well. But BOY do those pre 99 M2's look good. Did I mention how nice those pre 99 M2's look? Based on your description, go with a pre 99 M2, probably out the door for $3500 or less, let the Nallin or Cycle Rama folks do about $2000 in magic to the thing, and have a KILLER bike for about the price of a new SV650 (which is a fine bike... but *just* a fine bike). Anything short of an '02 will need a pass to update stuff anyway (exhaust hanger, shifter, primary tensioner, metal gaskets, check oil pump drive gear, etc... etc...). Nothing that is a bad job. | ||
| Tdshepard |
That's kind of what I am thinking. I have a road bike and just want a street tracker for blasting to work or an occasional sunday ride through the twisties. I always think building the bike is at least half the fun. Is there any reason XB heads can't be adapted to that early frame? | ||
| Reepicheep |
I think the only issue with the XB heads on a tube framer is the front mount. You probably want the XB cams to go with the XB heads. Check the knowledge vault, Aaron (Nallin) had put together a very nice billet replacement front mount to let the XB heads bolt right up, and just posted a dyno of that setup on a 99 m2. You would also have to reroute some breather tubing, but you end up doing that on a tube framer anyway. | ||
| Rick_a |
You can use the old rocker boxes and breather setup...you just have to do some drilling/tapping. That and if you have a Thunderstorm you also have to go with flat top pistons. | ||
| Cliffb |
Well Folks, I’ve had my 2001 M2L for almost 2 weeks now. I thought I was getting a standard M2 and only discovered it was a low after purchase. In truth, I would have never known if I had not looked at the VIN. I put a standard seat on it. I’m 6-1 and I don’t feel cramped. The bike has the stock breadbox air cleaner with a K&N air filter. I hate the looks and will probably get the Buell Race AC setup. The carb has had the idle mixture screw cover removed. It’s probably had the jets changed but I haven’t had it apart to check sizes. There was a Supertrapp muffler installed. The inlet was broke, so I bought and installed a used stock muffler. I actually like the quieter stock muffler. From what I’ve read here, I have not given up much, if anything, in the way of power. The rear cylinder lower rocker box is starting to weep oil. New gasket set is on order. Future plans, I want to clean up the bike by removing the heat shield and the CA charcoal canister. Any downside to doing so? I also have a set of 2000 and later W grind (Sport) cams I may install. I’m getting lots of great info from the BBS. Thanks Cliff | ||
| Henrik |
Heat shield actually works - not much, but a bit - as judged by perceived inner thigh temp  Stock muffler may cost you a dip in the torque curve in the midrange. Henrik | ||
| Cerbero |
hi all... i'm the proud owner of a 97 M2. i bought it used 2 years ago and have been riding it for about 6 months (it went into storage shortly after i bought it... but was recently released for good behaviour). this bike is my only vehicle. i ride it every day and twice on the weekends... unfortunately, it spends most of its time in city traffic. in the 6 months i've been riding it i've put nearly 6K miles on it (bringing the total up to 14K), and with the exception of a stripped drive sprocket, it hasn't given me any real trouble... i know buells aren't known for their reliability, and i don't really expect it to behave like my last bike (a 1976 bmw R90/6)... but realistically; how many good miles can i get out of this thing before it needs to be put down? i look forward to the replies, anecdotal or otherwise. ...c | ||
| Blake |
The beauty is that with a little maintenance, a Buell can live on for a very long time. Even then, repair of a bottom end or transmission is not prohibitive. When it comes time for that you can have some performance work done as well. I don't plan on ever parting with my '97 Cyclone. |
