| Author | Message | ||
     99x1 |
"Shouldn't I see about 13.5 to 14 volts at the terminals while revving? And if so where should I start looking next?" I think you see almost 15 volts while rev'ing. There is only a couple of parts to the charging system - the regulator/rectifier, and the stator. Since the stator is just wire windings, it is most likely the regulator failed. The input to the regulator could be tested for voltage (AC), and the wiring at the regulator could be checked (stator connector, power wire, and ensure ground wire is making to chassis ground). Good luck; John | ||
| Joebuell |
What should the input at the regulator read? | ||
| Blake |
Joe, Alternator output should be within the range of 19 to 26 VAC (NOTE AC volts NOT DC volts!!!) per every 1,000 engine rpm. I STRONGLY recommend getting a service manual if you are trying to diagnose a charging system problem. | ||
| Joebuell |
Thanks guys. I'm trying to cheat my way outta getting the manual, but I'll break down (pun?) and buy one. We'll see what happens this weekend. Hopefully I'll find a lose connection or some other inexpensive fix. Joe | ||
| Pwest |
quick question. I have a 02 M2 with 4500mi, Im having an electrical problum. the bike runs great then dies, no spark to the plugs at all. ive got new plugs, plug wires, coil, and cam position sensor. is there any thing I should be looking for? I have checked the kick stand safty switch and the emergincy shut off switch. I took off the ground from the battery and cleaned & tightnd it back up. Before the bike dies the tac will jump a bit but im not sure if this happens every time. any help will help... PAT 02M2... | ||
| Blake |
Might be the ignition sensor (hall efffect sensor aka cam position sensor). When you say that you have "checked the kickstand safety switch" what exactly did you check? Did you short it? | ||
| Reepicheep |
Is there a clutch switch on these things? I can't remember, but on my old Yamaha that was a frequently failing part that would do the same thing as the side stand switch. On that bike the kill switch would also fail often and respond well to a good shot of WD-40. | ||
| Pwest |
I pulled apart the plug at the kickstand stuck a wire in both sides of the plug then taped it up and went for a ride, two blocks later I was pushing it home. I put in a new cam position sensor with no effect. PAT02M2 | ||
| Tims |
Hi Can anyone please tell me the correct procedure for testing the ignition sensor assemble on a 97 M2? Nothing in the manual. Thanks Tim | ||
| mark knittle |
I posted a month or so ago regaurding a X1 tps.After 3 rounds with the dealer they put a buell tech on it. he replaced the tps on the bike.It runs better BUT intermittenly misses and backfires.If I give it more throttle it gets worse. when I let off for a second or so the problem goes away for awhile.The dealer can't seem to find anything.They replaced the voltage regulator,plugs & wires.when I jump pins 1&2 in the data link There in no error code.The ignition coil resistonce is high on both primary&secondary.I cant find any loose wires. any ideas?? | ||
| Srv |
Hello All, I am in the process of building a Buell powered Dirt Tracker. Am running the Screamin' Eagle adjustable ignition sys ( 32942-02 )along with the coil ( 31653-97 ). What I'm needing some help with is the wiring procedure. This bike will be a total loss system. So how do I wire this silly thing ? Thanks, Steve in Illinois ( Springfield in only 26 days ) | ||
| Blake |
TimS, Look on Page 7-4. Start with "Rotor and Cam Position Sensor." Look at the bottom of page 7-7 "Intermittent Ignition Problem - Temperature" and the one immediately above for "Vibration". I'd probably start with the temperature testing, then go through vibration diagnostics, then the diagnostic flowchart starting on page 7-6. If everything else shows good... the sensors are cheap. Buy a new one and swap it. That is a royal pain though; the pigtail is barely long enough to reach the connector, no slack at all. Had me cussing whoever designed that part of the wiring on our Buells. Plus if your cam cover is not trimmed like mine, you may have more trouble threading the pigtail through it. You could make a jumper so that you can install the new sensor without routing it through the cam cover, just to try it out. I had one fail. Symptoms were that the bike wouldn't run at all. No spark. I checked the coil (it was okay) and swapped ignition modules, no change, so I bought a new sensor and installed it. The old one looked a little melty/drippy but nothing obvious. It may have become overheated. Good luck! Please let us know what you find. | ||
| Blake |
Mark, Sounds to me like they have not yet found the problem. Maybe bad injectors? A weak fuel pump? Faulty O2 sensor? I am no expert. I would strongly urge you to relentlessly yet courteously express your extreme frustration to a competent dealership/service manager. They need to solve your bike's problem. | ||
| Boese |
Buell Pro Series plugs part number 32822-01Y Plug No HDB12P who can tell me heat value of these? as in 6 - waermegrad ( for the old ones ) and 10 - waermegrad ( for the new ones ) What are these Pro Series ones ? boese | ||
| Sickquad |
Ok, now a voltage regulator problem. I had to move my VR since I changed the exhaust. I bought the bracket from Buell. And because of the grounding problem I have heard of I ran a wire from the tapped hole in the back of the casting of the VR to a motor bolt. Now my battery is not charging. This means that either I cannot ground to the motor, or the VR does not ground from the back casting. Any ideas? I did not scrape the paint off of the VR mount like the instructions told me to. I figured a wire would be much better. It is a 10 gauge wire so it should be more than enough. Anyone with some experience with this? Thanks Chris | ||
| Reepicheep |
How did you anchor the wire to the tapped hole? Check that connection. I did both, cleaned the paint on bike and VR at point of contact, and also ran a wire (mashed between the head of the bolt and a stripped VR surface). It would be easy enough to check with a meter for a good ground I suppose. Also make sure you got all the connectors back snug if you removed any of those. Also check the coincidental, make sure your battery terminals are snug, mine work loose over time. | ||
| Bluzm2 |
Chris, Check the connection down by the oil pump. There is two connectors, one with a double wire from the alternator carrying the AC, the second is a single wire connector that goes back to the battery. Mine popped loose a few weeks back resulting in a dead battery. I used 3 tie wraps to keep the connector together. 1 around each wire behind the connector and 1 between the two of them to keep it from coming apart again. Brad | ||
| Sickquad |
Bluzm2, you are right. The single connector coming from the VR is not connnected to anything. The double connection is fine and is wrapped with a zip tie. Now I cannot find the other connection for the wire which is not connected to anything. I think the shock is going to have to be lowered for me to do some investigating. Is it ok for me to run the ground wire which I made to a motor bolt or do I have to go to the frame with it? I always seem to have electrical problems with my bikes. I'm starting to think it is user error. Thanks Chris | ||
| Cyclone1 |
Hey Mark, I had a 98 S(don't recall which model it was) doing the same thing, and it ended up being a sidestand switch that was intermittant. I made a jumper wire connecting the wires of the plug together, bypassing the switch FOR TEST PURPOSES ONLY and it straightened right up. So it "could" be either that, or the clutch switch I would think... Also, they told us at school, that the two things that HAVE to be done with a driveability problem is to properly adjust the timing, then the TPS. Did they do both adjustments? Hope I could help....  | ||
| Knickers |
Ok, I need a reality check. I've been trying to track down an intermittent misfire where the engine will run on 1 cylinder for a few seconds before clearing up. I was checking the coil, primary resistance 1.2 Ohm (0.5-0.7 is the spec in the manual), secondary showed open!? It should be 5.5-7.5K Ohm. Seems to me the coil is totaled, but if that's the case how is it my misfire is only intermittent? Did I screw up the measurement or should I just shut up and go buy a new coil? Kurt | ||
| 99x1 |
"I was checking the coil"... Assuming your bike is fuel injected - There are two coils inside the case (which is plastic and not grounded). Check from the outside pins to the center pin for the primary(s), and from each spark plug cable tower to the center pin of the primary connector. If the primary was open or shorted - the ECM would post an error code. Mine (99 X1 running OK) reads: Front spark cable tower to primary center pin: 6.13K Rear spark cable tower to primary center pin: 6.12K From front tower to back tower: 12.26K From outside primary pin to center pin: 0.8 ohms. From outside pin to outside pin: 1.6 ohms. Short spark plug cable:2.5K Long plug cable: 6.2K With everything reassembled, pulling caps off spark plugs and reading between cables: 20.9K. Good Luck; John | ||
| Blake |
I'm confused too. Maybe try again, double checking the procedure... ignition on... etc.. Check all battery connections. Check/replace spark plugs. Check plug wires. At what speed/throttle position and when (hot/cold/anytime) does the miss occur? | ||
| Knickers |
Ok, I double checked my numbers: Center pin to front tower 5.85K Ohm Center pin to rear tower open Front tower to rear tower open Center pin to front primary 0.7 Ohm Center pin to rear primary 0.7 Ohm Front to rear primary's 1.3 Ohm Spark plug wires are within spec. The miss happens when the bike is hot, usually at less than 3000 rpm. It happens a lot when taking off from a light. If the ECM can only pick up an open/short failure in the primary coil that would explain having no coil codes, but the manual isn't clear if it will pop a code for a secondary failure. Why this bike ever runs on two cylinders is beyond me. I guess I gotta just follow the manual and replace the coil. | ||
| 99x1 |
"Why this bike ever runs on two cylinders is beyond me" Interesting, the open in the rear secondary must be arcing over, effectively acting like a big spark plug gap (two gaps in series?). The ECM looks at the rise time of the primary current, and if it is out of spec, it will show a code - but faults in the secondary circuit won't flag an error (unless they affect the primary). | ||
| Knickers |
Interesting, I never considered arcing within the coil, but that would explain it. Might also explain the hot/cold thing if the open gap in the coil grows with temperature to the point where there's not enough voltage to jump two gaps. On another note, I spent a lot of time chasing down fuel as cause for this misfire because during one of the misfire episodes I ran at WOT on 1 cylinder for about 5 seconds then quickly killed the engine and pulled the plug, it was dry. And, when the engine would clear up and run on 2 again I never got the big bang of unburned fuel vapor lighting off in the header. I used to scare dogs chasing my old yamaha by hitting the kill switch for a second to load the exhaust with unburned fuel. A nice trick that's lacking in a fuelie bike. New coil going on tonight. If'n the rain clears I should have an answer. Kurt | ||
| Knickers |
New Coil seems to have done the trick. Starts easier, no sputtering when cold, no cylinder cut out when hot. Everythings fixed up for Battletrax this weekend.  | ||
| Eastexsteve |
Speaking of spark plugs, I picked up a Walmart plug catalog today and noticed that they show a Champion Power Sports plug #8809 as being for late model Buells. I wonder if this is a proper replacement for a 10R12. If this is the proper heat range plug, Walmart has them for $2.95 each. Anybody able to cross this number over? | ||
| Artful |
Has anyone tried the new bosch 4 prong spark plugs, what part number, any input? Thanks Artful..... | ||
| Eastexsteve |
Check this out! I decided to try a set of Champion Power Sport 8809 plugs in my 2001 Cyclone. They are a small diameter center electrode with other bells and whistles. Walmart had them for 2.95 each. My reference book shows them to be equal to a Champion RA4HC in heat, and possibly cooler than the NGK DPR9EA-9. I gapped them at .40, put them in, and went for a 50 mi. highway ride. I noticed that I could put my hand on the rear cylinder for a few seconds without burning the crap out of myself. I was not able to do this with the old 10R12 plugs. And, the bike was running extremely well. However, this might have been because it was time to change plugs. However, when I arrived at my destination, something strange happened. I was sitting at a light idling, when the bike started running rough. On the way home I noticed a loss of power. When I got home, I pulled the plugs and this is what I saw. The plug on the right came from the rear cylinder and appears to be running a bit cool. That's OK for me because I live in East Texas and it gets hot down here in the summer. However, the plug on the left came from the front cylinder and it appears that the center insulator has cracked and slid down the center electrode coming to rest on the ground electrode. You can tilt the plug up and down and the insulator will slide up and down the center electrode shaft. I am motivated to replace the bad plug and keep going because these plugs did seem to run extremely well. However, I am hesitant to do so in case this is an indication of Champions quality.  | ||
| Blake |
Steve, If your engine doesn't get hot, something is very wrong. What is wrong with using the 10R12 plugs and what gave you the impression that the above plugs are an acceptable substitute for them? Are they the equivalent platinum plug? The smaller elctrode would indicate a platinum plug, and that is okay if all else is equal. If not, I wouldn't use them. Blake (fellow E TX Bueller) |
