| Author | Message | ||
     Xl1200r |
Did some searching on this, but didn't find any concrete results. Just bought a 2007 12R and I'm thinking about cutting the air box and only leaving the part over the top of filter for a seal (I've seen many pictures of this already). I have 2 questions - First - having not received my bike yet, would removing this much of the airbox pose any issues with the breather lines/servo motor on a 12? I've only seen it done on bikes with no servo. Second - I've read in a few places that this will take away some bottom end power. I'm going to using a TFi by the time I do this (and most likely a special ops pipe). From my previous experience, fattening up the mixture down low should give me my bottom end back, regardless of how open the intake is. Any help is appreciated, or if you can point me to a thread that covers this would be great as well. Thanks, Mark | ||
| Vagelis46 |
I own an 2004 XB12R that has the hole through the frame to get air to the filter box. I have experimented with the intake by installing K&N, removing the snorkel, installing the 2006 cover with holes/cuts and I can say this : The more air the bike breathes, the faster it gets throughout the rev range. When I installed the open airbox cover the improvement was BIG. But you have to see yourself. Just do each mod one at a time. Firstly install a K&N. Then cut the airbox. Do not forget to run the bike at steady rpm between 3000-4000rpm for 3-5 min to let it readjust the mixture. | ||
| Xl1200r |
That's kind of what I was expecting. The increased airflow would make more of a difference in the higher revs, but I coudln't see it hurting the lower revs - more just not helping as much. Thanks for the help man. | ||
| Hooligan620 |
I too plan on opening up the airbox on my 12R. Do I also need to cut holes in the intake cover? The intake cover being the colored plastic piece that covers the airbox. | ||
| Diablobrian |
Hooligan, you don't have to, but many are either cutting holes in the ring around the fuel fill or just removing it all together. I even went so far as to block off the air channel through the frame. I think that doing so feeds more cooling air to the rear cylinder since none gets diverted to the intake and the motor will pull in cooler air from above the engine. Of course I could be wrong. | ||
| Hooligan620 |
Any suggestions for blocking off the air channel in the frame? I've removed the black filler ring on the intake cover, laid out the hole pattern on the airbox cover and will cut tomorrow. | ||
| Xl1200r |
What about an Open Air Box mod vs. a 2007 air box? I hear the 07's are much more open than previous years - it is wirth cutting it up? Also, will I need to leave the cable and hose channels in tact for the servo and breathers? I don't care about too much intake noise, in fact, intake noise is just as good as exhuast noise in my book. | ||
| Vagelis46 |
What I finally did and I am 100% happy was : 1. Buy a KN and the new 07 airbox (or keep the one you have). What I found with the xb airbox is that sometimes it does not press the filter against the box properly, and some dirt can enter the engine. This happen because you cannot actualy see what is going on when you install the filter and the airbox cover. 2. Then I cut the airbox cover and left only the top plate with the cone and some plastic around that. All you have to do then is to press the top plate against the filter, to have 100% contact. I drilled some holes on the plastic arount the top plate, fitted tight-ups to press the plate against the filter, by fixing them against the existing hooks of the low airbox, using some metal wire, and that is it..... 3. This way the breather hoses stay in place and it takes about 15 min to do it. Results : TRUST ME you have a new bike. The bottom end pull is where you benefit most. Also top end is dramatically increased. And the sound......SUPER This way I do not think you need the race kit. | ||
| Rscxx |
I am also doing my airbox mods. Which filter are you buying? I see for choices the dark red one that is the K&N cleanable filter that needs to be oiled that used to be in the race kit, ww.americansportbike.com etc.. and the grey one that is now sold in the race parts site of the Buell website that is a washable one? ww.buell.com race parts etc.. Oh, and p.s., Whats that mean in the capital letters at the bottom of the page; YOU ARE A GROWN UP, ACT LIKE ONE Seriously, which is the better filter, is one coarser then the other? will one filter out more dirt then the other, but also restrict more air? or is there some other filter that is best? I am unable to post the message with the links in it | ||
| Xl1200r |
I just bought the new Buell Race filter that doesn't need to be oiled. I had a similar filter in my Sportster and had very good luck with it. Either filter is going to flow more air than the engine needs, so it's not a big deal either way, just depends on your prefference. I can't answer which one filters out more crap, but I think the best answer you're going to get is "They both do it good enough". For me, the lack of oiling made it a no brainer. I don't need that mess... | ||
| Al_lighton |
Maybe. My problem with the non-oilable race air filter is that I don't believe it can be properly cleaned. K&N filters use "impingement filtration", where the dirt is captured by the sticky oil. Once the sticky oil is all covered with dirt, filtration falls off, but flow doesn't. So it is important to clean them. I do it with each oil change. Releasing the oil with detergent releases the dirt as well, and fresh oil restores it's filtration capability. The stock and race filter both use "labyrinth filtration". The air snakes through the passages through the element, and dirt is snared on the sharp edges of the paper as it zig zags through the filter. As the passages start to clog up, filtration continues, but flow starts to drop. My problem with the Buell Race air filter is that I don't know how you can adequately clean it. You can't make the dirt go backwards through the labyrinth, and there isn't any way other than rinsing it to get the dirt out. I don't think you can ever get it as clean and unblocked as it starts when new, and after a few cleanings, I think its likely toast. If it was $25, maybe it would be an OK approach. But it's more than a K&N. I'd run a stock filter and throw it away each time before I'd run the race filter, but I use a K&N and deal with the oiling. It isn't that big a deal to clean it. Al | ||
| Altima02 |
I have an 03. Would doing the open airbox/07 airbox mod have much benefit if I don't cut any holes in the outer, colored airbox cover? Im sure it would gain more if I did drill holes in the black filler ring, but Im just wondering if the open airbox alone, with air coming through the frame, would be a good gain in itself. Thanks | ||
| Xl1200r |
Al - Well taken... Since my last post, I tried to clean and sell the Screamin' Eagle air cleaner I had for my Sportster which used the same type of filter material as the current Buell Race filter. I couldn't get it cleaned to my satisfaction, and noticed an alarming number of holes in the filter medium - far too many considering it was only on the bike for 5000 miles. I just read your ppost about an hour ago - I immediaty grabbed my Race filter, drove back to the dealer and exchanged it for a K&N. And the best part it I bought the Race filter for 15% off. After I exhancged it for the K&N at FULL PRICE, I still got $8 back! Can't beat that. | ||
| Bails |
Personally I can't see why one would use K & N. Perhaps this would be of interest,although this test is not my reason for not using. simply put more air flow with less filter surface filter area must means more engine damage. www.duramax-diesel.com/spicer/index.htm | ||
| Xl1200r |
Bails, you're point is well taken. I have seen that very report before. Some of the individual graphs tend to look a little disturbing, but then I always go back to the "Overall Effencieny" graph at the top. While K&N is dead last, there is only 3% effenciency seperating the leader from the loser. I have to believe that a properly oiled K&N will flow less dirt than a freshly cleaned Buell Race filter with holes in it. | ||
| Xl1200r |
I also notice in the test he makes a claim at the bottom stating that the stock paper filter will make all the horesepower the enginr has to give for the trucks they were testing it on, yet there isn't a single Dyno to illustrate this. I have used K&Ns in my previous bike as well as in a car I used to own. Those filters would look dirty as all hell after not too long and required cleaning. At the same time, I have had paper filters in a ton of vehicles and have RARELY replaced them because they stayed so clean for so long. Where did all the dirt go??? | ||
| Bails |
I have also purchased a K & N, but after a little use and examination of the the filter I observed the following: 1) K & N had less surface area than the paper filter. 2) If K & N was to flow faster (as Claimed ) with less surface area then only way possible is less restriction, or if you like bugger holes, which equates to more dirt. 3)After the placebo Effect left performance seemed the same as the Paper filter. 4)Very few Dyno tests ever showed results of just swapping the filter,the filter came with other mods. So for me I'll use a good paper until I see the evidence that a K & N on its own will filter better and flow better. | ||
| Xl1200r |
1) K & N had less surface area than the paper filter. This may be true, but wouldn't a K&N have a thicker medium than a paper filter? 2) If K & N was to flow faster (as Claimed ) with less surface area then only way possible is less restriction, or if you like bugger holes, which equates to more dirt. I think this would work with the fact that the medium is thicker, and that K&N is filter with the sticky oil and not merely by just grabbing the dust. If you look at the test you provided, it does show the K&N filter less, but again, there was only a 3% spread across all tested filters. 3)After the placebo Effect left performance seemed the same as the Paper filter. I believe the tests posted showed that K&N was at least among the best flowing of all the filters. More air allows more fuel with a proper mixture. More fuel in and out of the engine = more power. 4)Very few Dyno tests ever showed results of just swapping the filter,the filter came with other mods. This I agree with. However, the science behind it makes sense. This is all just my speculation. I would tend to agree that the stock paper filter probably flows enough for the engine as is, but I'd get the K&N just for the lifetime cost of it.} | ||
| Bails |
Thicker it may be, but the filtering happens at the surface, If you were to magnify then you would see a whole lot of holes,these holes allow particles smaller to flow through and trap the larger one,as a matter of fact as they trap and the filter becomes dirty,so to speak,the holes become smaller because they are blocked to a smaller size by the filtered material.So if you have more surface area you have more holes and greater air flow potential,this is why filters are accordion shaped to give more surface area. Hence if you have less surface area and greater air flow , you must have larger holes, more grit gets through, and also quicker to clog. | ||
| Vagelis46 |
Good points people, but these are the facts regarding the KN, stock filter, AND OPEN AIRBOX, regarding engine performance : With KN installed my XB12R is faster ! With open airbox my XB12R goes faster ! Regarding engine damage from dirt entering the engine when using KN.......well the HD engine will collapse from other reasons (e.g. worm gear driving the oil pump, vibes, high running temp), before the dirt will do much damage! | ||
| Cavi |
also, if the K&N is geting oiled the oil is helping the catching of dirt, and causing very little restriction | ||
| Desmo900 |
I have not installed a K&N in my 07 buell, but I did put one in my '94 Ducati 900ss. After doing so, the engine was running much faster at Idle and I had to lower the setting. Same thing happened with a K&N in my '78 International Scout. So I would have to say that this style of filter does indeed flow more air than the stock filter. For my Uly I plan on doing Oil analysis with each oil change, and will be switching from stock filter to the K&N. So we will see if the K&N filters good enough or not. |
