| Author | Message | ||
     Stealthxb  |
I have been wanting to JetHot coat my headers, but after seeing Wardog3187's I am going to wrap them instead. I have a few questions: 1. Should I use the 1" or 2" wrap? 2. Should I use the 8" or 14" locking ties? http://www.eastwood.com/shopping/search/searchresultsmain.jsp?fresh=1&searchType =advanced&iMainCat=0&iSubCat=0&attribute14=0&attribute15=0&attribute16=0&RS=1&ke yword=exhaust+wrap | ||
| Madbandito  |
Just my 2 cents. Speaking only from experience with automotive headers, wrapping the headers will cause too much heat to be trapped in the tubes. Over a period of time this causes the tubes to fail from lack (?) of thermal transfer. I've seen several cases on race cars where the wrap was applied and at the end of the season you could crush the tubes with your hand like a beer can. I'm not a metallurgist so don't ask me to explain said process. The stuff will void the warranty for headers used in auto applications. It apparently works just like it says it does., keeping the heat in and thus the scavenging effect from increased exhaust velocity helps the intake charge, blah,blah... But it does look rather naff on the XB's. If the problems do not apply to bikes for whatever reason, then please do not hesitate to chime in, cause I'd love to be wrong on this one... | ||
| Robxb  |
I'd like to know also. I'm going to do the same thing, I'm planning on wrapping mine when I put on my new pipe sometime this week. | ||
| Stealthxb |
Glitch mentioned this same concern when we discussed this topic last week. He said that is why ceramic coating is great because they coat the inside too. I am gonna give it a shot anyway. It's looks mean, it's not too expensive, no down time and hopefully it will hold me over until I can afford this bad boy in stainless:  | ||
| Glitch  |
It just worries me too much to try it for a long time. If you're gonna use the wrap just long enough to test, you'll probably be OK. For something permanent, go with the ceramic coating. If you MUST have the look...do ceramic coating, then wrap 'em up. IIRC, Blake uses/used the wrap, maybe he'll chime in. | ||
| Stealthxb |
Glitch... When you gonna do your ceramic coating? | ||
| Buell_boy_beau |
bandito, your correct. heat wrap is ment to cover parts that can be sensitive to heat expelled by headers. wraping headers/exhaust for long periods will cause them to "crystalize", where constant heat will change the pore structure.you could tap cristalized steel lightly with hammer & they'll fall to bits.stainless will last longer & more than likely crack.short term use won't do much damage.so for the period you own you bike(2-3 years? like most!) that wouldn't affect you. beau | ||
| Glitch |
When you gonna do your ceramic coating? It's next in line to the TFI. I'll have it done at the same time I powder coat the wheels. so for the period you own you bike(2-3 years? like most!)  I've had mine for two years this April, so far I've almost 30thousand miles, I've no intention of getting rid of the bike, I'll bet Stealth is feeling the same way. | ||
| Blackbelt  |
just thought i would chime in here. I know that when i had to re-coat my X-1's header (due to accident) it cost me just under $100.00 bucks at a local coaters... just thought i would chime in... | ||
| Buell_boy_beau |
chime in ? are you a door bell? hee hee.not selling mine either but, people sell bikes.something new comes out, another buell, like the xb series did! | ||
| Rosko |
I wrapped the header on my '99 X1 back in Jan. 2000....I've since sold it, but the guy that bought it still has the header wrapped and it is holding up just fine....The reason that stock car header crumble after a season is that they are steel and are subject to rust...the S.S. headers we use WILL BE JUST FINE....headers do no get any hotter than they do when welding and that part doesn't "crystalize"....(that's a new one) | ||
| Madbandito |
Toldja I wasn't sure of the terminology. But I don't believe that rust is the only cause of the self destruction of header tubes. There is something about thermal cycles and heat dissipation and/or retention (Noting that I got a "D" in college physics)that structurally weakens the metal. I know that use on titanium pipes fer sure is a big no-no per the Yosh guys. FWIW I will call a couple of Exhaust Tech guys tomorrow and see if I can get their take on this, if only for my own edification.  But it still looks right on these machines. | ||
| Buell_boy_beau |
madbandito,i am an exhaust tech,11 years.i deal with drag racers,etc..maybe you did get a "D" but your on the right track.rosko, if you re-read my post you will read i mentioned stainless lasts longer.S.S.does still oxidise, just takes longer.crystalising is a type of oxidising in conjunction with heat & contamination e.g. carbon & gasses that pass through the header. & because stainless grows with heat,after many years of expansion & contraction, it contaminates in the pores of the stainless & the grain doesn't alingn back the same.thats crystalisation.argon gas protects the stainless from contamination in welding. dude, i'm not being a know-all, i just know about this cause thats how i make a living.  thats what this site is about aint it, help out fellow buellers! peace. | ||
| Robxb |
Is there any truth behind ceramic coated headers cracking ?? I heard that from a few people that say they might. Now I'm confused !! do I spend about $60.00 to wrap the pipes or a bit over $100.00 to get them coated ????? | ||
| Blake |
I really like my wrapped header pipe. It's been wrapped since 2001 and has done track days and miles and miles. There is no issue to worry about with a stainless steel header. Though their intentions may be good, people who don't know what they are talking about, often don't know what they are talking about. (Message edited by blake on December 29, 2004) | ||
| Stealthxb |
I have a few questions: 1. Should I use the 1" or 2" wrap? 2. Should I use the 8" or 14" locking ties? | ||
| Glitch |
Sorry Stealth. I would go with the 1" wrap. It'll be easier to deal with. Probably look better too. If you get the 8" locking ties, you have a chance to not having enough length to go all way round. If you get the 14" the worst thing that could happen is you may have to trim off a little. It's better to have too much and not need it... Sounds to me like this'll work just fine. | ||
| Buellman39 |
I'll have to agree with blake I do not think it will affect stainless steal. | ||
| Bud  |
i had my header wrapped, did you ever ride it in the rain ?? no fun there.. ps the stock header from a xb will rust ( it scared me when i removed the wrapping) just my 2 cents | ||
| Glitch |
Mine's already got some rust spots. That's why I started looking at ceramic coating. I love the look of the gold and purple of the original pipe. But, that went away several miles ago. | ||
| Blake |
Travis (Stealthxb, I used the generic 2" header wrap that my local auto parts store carried. I applied it using a 1" overlap so that I got a two layer covering over the entire header. It was a bit difficult maintaining that around the bendy portions, but it worked out fine, is lasting fine, and works great. It really cut down on the heat, something that the Jet Hot Coating did little of. Bud, Rode it in the rain plenty, and it sits outside. Sorry to disappoint you. The header wrap works well. Yes, if/when you ever decide to remove it, don't be surprised to find a less than beautiful finish. That effect does not require the application of header wrap. No, merely expose the header to hot engine exhaust and the effects of moisture and you will find the surface finish degrading in a hurry. If you are concerned about the effects of header wrap but still wish to use it, there is a simple solution; before wrapping, apply a protective surface coating inside and out, like the Jet Hot stuff or equivalent. | ||
| Glitch |
Thanks Blake. I know your bike hasn't been exactly pampered, so a "test" on your bike is good enough for me. When you put it on, was the material difficult to work with, or did it act pretty much like fabric? | ||
| Stealthxb |
Thanks ya'll Yes I ride in the rain and as far as I know this bike is a keeper. No plans of letting it go anytime soon...if ever! I think I will make the perfect test subject. Glitch... sounds like we have a project for the FBPC in the upcoming weeks. I will keep everyone informed of how it goes. | ||
| Blake |
It was easy to work with considering how picky I was in getting it to go on with good aesthetically looking results. I ended up with a few wrinkles, but they are hidden from view. Unless you do the 100% overlap like I did, that won't be a problem. I used hose clamps and/or safety wire to secure the ends. An 8" tie wrap should be plenty long at the cylinder head ends but might fall short at the collector. | ||
| Glitch |
Eastwood has a couple of kits. They're supposed to be enough to do a set of car headers, should be enough for the both of us, with some left over maybe. We can go in on one of the kits and do it on the cheap. sounds like we have a project for the FBPC in the upcoming weeks. In a nice warm garage to boot! Thanks again Blake! | ||
| Blake |
I used a 50 FT car header kit and had maybe 14 FT left over. But again, I used a 1" overlap for complete double coverage instead of the recommended 1/4" overlap. And that was on a tube framer race header. | ||
| Bud |
Blake, You don’t ware glasses I presume, When I had to stop for a traffic light, on rainy day’s I was almost covered in a mist off steam From my header wrapping ,that my sinuses where completely cleaned out , and my glasses where fogged very bad gr,B | ||
| Blake |
That's happened to me. No I don't wear glasses. Depending on the circumstances the steam can get pretty good and thick. The people in nearby cars will give you some odd looks, probably thinking the engine is blowing up. Right then is when you light up the rear tire into a really good smoke show.  | ||
| Dj_rider  |
i got mine coated inside and out, and i likes it alot  | ||
| Lpowel02  |
how thick is the wrap? (not wide, thick...) Would you need a tie/clamp at the cylinder end? Or could you start a couple inches from the cylinder, wrap once or twice around up to the cylinder, then start wrapping down to cover/secure the end? I've never used exhaust wrap, but I'm liking the idea more...would doing this way hold it securely? If it did, the thickness would be an aesthetic concern since it could make a bulge at the cylinder...has anyone ever tried? | ||
| Blake |
You need a firm clamp at each end, meaning at four locations... each header, the end of one head pipe entering the collector, and at the end of the collector. You'll use two pieces of wrap. Wrap your choice for the single pipe ending near the collector first. Cover that with the wrap for the other header and extend it through to the end of the collector. The wrap is about as thick as heavy duty burlap. If you were to leave any end unfixed/unclamped it would work its way loose. Count on it. It takes about ten seconds to put a worm drive hose clamp around the pipe/wrap. Would be REALLY silly to not afix the free ends of the wrap. | ||
| Lpowel02 |
thanks Blake...that makes sense...if it's that thick, then you're right, it would work its way loose pretty quick. I'll make sure to clamp it | ||
| Mr_cuell |
I fired up my bike yesterday and the Sharkskinz were getting really hot and flexible up by the headers, so I e-mailed Micron to get their take on exhaust wraps. I am thinking I will wrap whatever pipe I end up using - here is Microns response, at least in regards to their pipes - (Hope it is not beating a dead horse, but it is nice to get a manufacturers word on it) "Jon: No, the headers are high grade stainless so they can take it... :-)" |
