| Author | Message | ||
     Austinxb12s |
I just purchased a USED EBR Racing Race ECM for a 2004-2007 Buell XB w/ Drummer exhaust and K&N filter. The ECM serial number was confirmed by recently by a phone call to EBR Racing. I have a 2005 XB12S with Drummer exhaust, K&N filter, breather re-route and no other engine/performance modifications. My problem arose when I attempted to install the EBR ECM and perform the required TPS reset (with ECMSPY) the engine would fire and immediately die. I attempted a TPS reset several times and confirmed by pulling the complete air box to make sure the butterfly was closed before resetting the TPS. Several tries and same result...start for a few seconds and then die. Sometimes I would get a nice backfire too. After a few hours of web searching and head scratching I decided to put my old stock ECM in and give it a try...fired right up first time and runs nicely like it always did! Perhaps the bike needed to be warm before performing the TPS reset so I let the bike warm past operating temp and quickly swapped out ECM's one final time and the EBR ECM did the same thing...start up and die a few seconds later. I know you shouldn't rev the engine but I did a few times and it would run until I let off the throttle and then would immediately die. Frustrated, I scoured this forum and all other available web forums and came up with that I either purchased a bricked "new to me" EBR ECM, or that I did the bricking somehow with ECMSPY (which I don't think is likely), or something else is happening that I haven't figured out. I really hope I am missing something simple and I am open to any advice before I try to ship back to EBR to have them reflash. I hope I did not waste my money on this ECM--I know that Kevin says that the Drummer was designed to run with a K&N filter without ECM modification. Any help is greatly appreciated! | ||
| Austinxb12s |
I just spoke with Danny at EBR and he told me I MUST take the bike to Harley for a TPS reset. He said that ECMSPY will eventually mess the ECM up. I HATE the Harley dealers in my area and don't want to do this. Unless someone has some saving advice I think I will post this EBR Racing ECM for a Drummer 04-07 pipe in the for sale section this evening for $150 shipped.... | ||
| Andrejs2112 |
I am in the exact same position. MIne does the same thing. Idles like shite after a TPS reset. Idles fine when warm. I have to babysit it at start up. I am 75 miles from the stealership. I doubt that they even know what a TPS rest is. I keep trying to get it to work but to no avail. I highly doubt that ECMSpy is the problem. I have sent an email to EBR but it takes forever to get a response. (Message edited by andrejs2112 on June 30, 2012) | ||
| Froggy |
Yea ECMspy is not compatible with the EBR Race ECM, but your symptoms sound exactly the same of those when the TPS is not correctly reset. (Message edited by Froggy on July 01, 2012) | ||
| Austinxb12s |
Thanks Froggy. I have bitten the bullet and have made an appointment on Tuesday at the Harley stealership to have the TPS Reset. From there I will decide whether or not I want to keep the race ECM. | ||
| D_adams |
http://xoptiinside.com/yahoo_site_admin/assets/doc s/Using_Tunerpro_RT.15590439.pdf Says you can reset the tps (pre-2007) with tunerpro rt. I haven't tried it myself, but I'm assuming it works. Mike shows a full writeup on how to do it. | ||
| Firemanjim |
No idea why ECM Spy would mess up any ecm if you are just resetting TPS, sounds like it is not tuned well in the idle area. What are you setting tps at?They all like slightly different setting to run right, tried setting it higher? And you should be able to feel the throttle blade almost stick in closed position if you are doing it correctly | ||
| Blackm2 |
Lloyd you might try posting something to the Hellbuellies site. http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/hellbuellies/m essages One or two of them used to work for Central HD. May have some more insight for you? | ||
| Andrejs2112 |
Is there something to resetting the TPS that isn't in the manual? Seems pretty straightforward, but obviously some of us are missing something. | ||
| Xoptimizedrsx |
IF your on a DDFI2 ecm (ECMSPY) is compatible. I use Tunerpro RT with my new ADX to reset the tps. It uses the code data string to do it which is an ecm function not a cell written location. What you doing is correct on the TPS reset. it is dieing because the AFV has not learned your bikes needs. Once the AFV has learned it will idle. open the Afv area below the reset tps. See what value you have. If at 100. set it to 110 and test. If still no good set it to 90 and test. Dieing can be rich or lean due to the AFV needs to learn. Once set see if you can keep the bike running with added throttle. if so then note what AFV your old ecm has and copy that to the new ecm and test. if still bad. take old ecm with you and laptop. set tps on new ecm and get it started. dont let it die even if you have to stay on the throttle. now ride it holding 2200 to 4000 rpm only not below or above. this is the closed loop zone where the tps/rpm does instant ego correction (collects data to learn AFV) Once the afv is learned it will idle. if the idle is still bad. read live while running with the yellow cross hair on the rpm cells in the map. Here is how to adjust after reset and a 30 min ride. If rpm is to high dont worry about the degree. USE RPM. either add to or back off to get the 1000 rpm (900 lowest. set and leave it. If it is still off. vs the learned AFV. Do this. use those cross hairs on live data. and see what the EGO value is reading on a fully warm bike. if EGO is above 100 add fuel to the cell your cross hairs is in on the front and rear fuel. then burn in (can be burnt while running on fuel maps. dont toggle yet. just go back to live data and see what the EGO is now. either add to or take out. If EGO is below 100 take fuel out. Xopti Trick. Turn TPS up to next rpm block. read EGO and adjust. do this for the first three blocks on rpm. 1000,1150 And 1300 (if you have those numbers.) Once adjusted back tps back down to 1000 rpm. Now when you hook to the ecm what firmware name does it have. If any of these ECMSPY will do it correctly. BUEGC Tubeframe, 1999-2002 BUEJA Tubeframe, 1999-2002 BUEKA Tubeframe, 1999-2002 BUECB XB9, 2002-2003 BUEGB XB9 & XB12, 2004 BUEIB XB9 & XB12, 2004- 2007 All other ECM will get adjusted either by Tunerpro Rt or on the throttle. Tunerpro used the Code sent to the ecm then the ecm follows its programming to do the reset. sorry for the book but hope it helps. written very late at night ... omit spelling errors lol Xopti (Message edited by xoptimizedrsx on July 07, 2012) | ||
| Xoptimizedrsx |
MINI recap from above post I have one bike that idles at 1000 rpm which uses 3.7 degree and the other bike idles at 1000 rpm which uses 6.3 degree. The 5.1 in the manuals is just a reference point to get you started. set to the 5.1 get it started. ride. let afv adjust. adjust to hot/warm bike after 15 min ride 2200 to 4000. then adjust the TPS to 1000 rpm. You now have a matched afv set. Now fetch this eeprom. Then save it in two locations and use this saved file as your backup and your tuning file because it holds the exact tps values based on a HEX value in the eeprom file) (Message edited by xoptimizedrsx on July 07, 2012) | ||
| Austinxb12s |
Xopti, thanks for your advice! I'm now thinking about using your Drummer specific maps that I saw on your website...how hard is it to copy these maps to my stock ECM using ECMSPY? Should I expect as good or better results than the properly flashed EBR Race Only ECM? (Message edited by austinxb12s on July 08, 2012) | ||
| Arcticktm |
Still seems like you should not overlook the possibility that your previous attempts at a TPS reset did not work. I have the VDST tool (CD and cable)from American Sport Bike. Yes, it cost me $190 several years ago, but I didn't have to be a calibration engineer to learn to use it properly (and I actually used to be one of those for diesel engine company). Your description is exactly like my '06 XB12X behaved when I first installed my EBR ECM ("stock" engine trim, as I only have a K&N as mods with an '07 airbox lid). That was because in my haste I totally forgot to do a TPS reset. Did the reset (after also checking the values in my OEM ECM to see if they were close) and all was well. Did not have to manually manipulate the AFV from what I recall (it was over 1 year ago). Just something to think about before you git rid of your new ECM. I needed my EBR ECM because my stock ECM was behaving erratically (throwing a code and a MIL occasionally). | ||
| Austinxb12s |
Update: EBR reflashed my Drummer specific ecm and it should be at my doorstep on Monday. Asked them to look for damage or corruption but they ignored my specific email request of their findings. Guess I will take it to HD for one last TPS reset before I decide to sell or not. If I sell I'm going to ask Xopti for help tuning my stock ECM if he will take my $!!! | ||
| Austinxb12s |
Update: had TPS reset done by Harley after getting ECM reflashed by EBR. Bike ran fairly well on 40 minute ride back home but today it seems to be hesitating around 3000 rpms and idle is rough. I kept the bike between 3000 and 3700 RPM for the ride home and shorter ride today except of course when hit red lights. My question is will the bike continue to learn and improve performance? The dealer set idle really low (800 rpm) and after the first ride I increased it to 1000 but this actually seemed to cause the stumbling when shifting gears? Anyone have any advice? Can I look at the AFV and other information with ecmspy or will even hooking it up just to view cause problems! I may just be being impatient so someone please give me some hope and advice before I get rid of the EBR ecm and just go back to the stock one! | ||
| Greg_e |
Since you have the cable, you should try TunerPro RT since it does work with that newer ECM. Or switch back to your old ECM and start datalogging and tuning. | ||
| Spanktor |
What was the outcome of all this? I could use the info. I am going to install KN, EBR Race ECM, and Drummer SS this weekend. I don't want to rely on the dealer for the TPS reset now or in the future. EBR should have a little program app to do this for their customer base in my opinion. Not cool forcing us to go to the same pricks who mistreated Buell like they did. | ||
| Sifo |
Not cool forcing us to go to the same pricks who mistreated Buell like they did. I have to agree. I'm pretty happy with the tune I did on my '06 XB12, but have often wondered how much better it could be from someone with better tools and knowledge. After finding out that the EBR ECMs don't play well with ECMspy for routine things like TPS resets I chose not to be tied to a dealer. It's been about 30K miles without dealer "support" and have enjoyed owning the Buell far more than when it was under warranty for the first 20K miles. One of the first things I consider when looking at a bike is how tied to the dealer am I going to be. Next I ask if there's a good dealer near by. Being tied to the local HD dealers I have would likely have me selling my Buell. They just take the enjoyment right out of it. | ||
| Spanktor |
Well I guess I'll hijack this thread real quick and give my update. I followed Drummer's instruction paper and installed the SS pipe, EBR ecm, and K&N filter without any significant problems. Just for reference I started it up and it idled and died as expected. So I followed Xopti's information trail and executed his instructions on his PDF word for word. The bike runs flawless! If you are out there, thanks Xopti! You're a badass! I had no luck finding a donation button on your site. Help me out bro! This is my second Buell and I love these bikes but they would only be half as cool if it wasn't for the brother/sister-hood keeping the brand alive and strong. Harley shut him down but we keep riding. Thanks again for all who give their knowledge freely here. If anyone stumbles on this page with similar issues and needs a hand or if your in MI give me a PM. And yes if you have a Buell then you need a Drummer. That's just my opinion though. |
