| Author | Message | ||
     Jraice |
Are their any scenarios where some form of failure on the bike could cause the connection to the fuel pump to fail? Specifically, to cause the fuel pump to make ZERO sound during startup fuel pump priming. I have confirmed by removing the pump and turning the key that the noises I am hearing when it does fail are not the pump at all, so when the bike fails (today after 20 minutes of neighborhood riding) either the pump itself is not working properly, or some other failure mode is causing the pump to get no electricity, and thus not prime. I am going to try my secondary ECM although is there some function it that which could cause the pump to lose power? I just want to make sure there isn't some other cause for pump electrical power loss before forking out $360 for a replacement. | ||
| Froggy |
There is an issue with some of the 09's that they will blow the fuel pump fuse when you are low on fuel on a hot day. Does that sound like your issue? | ||
| Jraice |
Nope, fuse is good and bike works after awhile, but way longer than necessary to assume its heat related. The key is that the pump stops priming after the bike dies and remains like that for hours. Just now I tried to get the bike home after 4 hours of sitting down the street where it died the second time, and it worked long enough to get me home but then when I recycled the key it wasn't priming at all. I am thinking I should be able to use a voltmeter on the proper ports of the pumps 4 wire connector to see the voltage sent when the key is turned to prime the pumps, and if I see that its still happening when the bike is acting up that would confirm the problem lies within the pump. Really thinking it has to be the fuel pump itself but hard to say whats causing it and I'd like to further confirm before spending all that money. | ||
| Reepicheep |
There were wire chafing issues with some of the XB fuel pumps... but that should be visually obvious. I'd have to assume that fuel pump has a built in pressure regulator switch. So it sure seems plausible that the regulator part of it could fail and be intermittent. | ||
| Jraice |
Pumps been rebuilt, no chaffing (09 has protection over wiring, nearly impossible now). Could be pressure regulator but in that case I'm still going full new pump assembly route. The question is less about what could be wrong with the pump and more about what other problems could cause the pump to lose electrical power and/or not prime, in case something else could cause this and I have a fully functional pump. | ||
| Gowindward |
Check your relay for the fuel pump. Clean the contacts and apply some dielectric grease to them. | ||
| Jraice |
I'll check that but I have a hard time understanding why a relay would die after riding for awhile and then require a long sitting period before working again. I also swapped them around a bit and had the same problem. Cleaning them and putting some dielectric is probably a smart idea regardless though. | ||
| Iamarchangel |
Amazing, just amazing. Did you ever check battery and plugs? When you try to start, are you hearing clicks? | ||
| Panhead_dan |
When mine gave me trouble, I found the problem by jiggling wires and connection leading out from the pump. Turned out to be the very first connector. I was able to continue on to work that day and get home that night by doing the same thing a couple of times. Repaired the connector that night. | ||
| Jraice |
There is nothing to be gained by checking the plugs (although I am changing them this weekend). The problem occurs long before the starter is pressed. When the bike primes normally it fires right up and runs great, but other times when the key is turned it won't prime at all, zero sound from the fuel pump. Its very clearly a lack of fuel and not power or spark as when the pump primes it fires up first try, but when it doesn't, it'll just turn over all day, as is expected with no fuel flowing to the injectors. That very first connector is pretty heavy duty, not exactly sure what the problem there could be. I am going to attempt to use the service manual to find which of the 4 prongs sends power to the pump when it primes so I can measure the voltage when the key is turned to see if its sending the signal to the pump, and the pumps just not responding with any action. | ||
| Jraice |
Interesting development. Seems the problem is slowly getting worse, as now after 2 days of sitting it won't prime (and ultimately start). When I turn the key I hear other noises in the air box area, and one of them does not stop. The check engine light illuminates like it normally would during the priming stage, then goes out, then goes back on, all without ever having started the bike. What could that sound be? Injectors? Are their any codes that would get thrown if the injectors were not getting fuel or proper fuel pressure? | ||
| Jraice |
Just cleaned the main battery ground (was nasty, had no effect however). In the process of doing so I tried cycling the key and noticed the persistent sound continued even without the ECM connected. Obviously no check engine light without the ECM but I still got the sound. EDIT: Fuel pump ground has continuity. Fuel pump power (constant, even with bike off) is going to the connector, and when the bike is turned on the fuel pump output from ECM gives 11.5-12.5V to the connector. Problem must lie between connector and the pump. Connections looked good when I removed the pump so I am guessing its an internal failure. Still perplexed about the extended soft mumbling sound that I describe above which seems to trip the CEL 10-15 seconds after the priming cycle time. (Message edited by jraice on June 02, 2012) (Message edited by jraice on June 02, 2012) | ||
| Iamarchangel |
Okay, that's a bit more info. (Assuming all the steps you've skipped and assumed okay actually are…) Confirm you hear relays clicking when you turn the key. If yes, go to the next step. You'll have to follow Dan's advice. Set up the noise and wiggle the wires until it stops, that means you've found the right connector. If you can't get it that way, look at the more solidly fixed connectors. You're looking for a corroded ground wire (black) inside a connector. | ||
| Jraice |
Just placed my order with American Sport Bike for a new pump assembly. Checked that the bike was sending (or had continuity) the proper voltages to the fuel pump connector, then removed the pump to insure its side of the connector had continuity to the fair end of the wiring, which it did. Thus, the pumps getting the proper power but still remaining silent. If anyone wants to challenge me on that, my entire pump assembly is good as yours for $50! Quite optimistic this will be the end of my troubles. | ||
| Treefrog |
When I turn the key I hear other noises in the air box area, and one of them does not stop. The check engine light illuminates like it normally would during the priming stage, then goes out, then goes back on, all without ever having started the bike. That sounds like your exhaust servo has failed and is continuing to run. (mine stripped the plastic "catch" thing off of a gear and did the same thing}). Pull the codes. Mine showed 21. If that's the case, disconnect the connector to the servo. It will stop it from continuing to run, but the check engine light will stay on. | ||
| Jraice |
Hmm that does make sense, if it continues after I have a working fuel pump I'll dig into it and see whats going on. I do have a race ECM though and I was under the impression that it did not use the servo or care if it were disconnected. |
