| Author | Message | ||
     Jake318 |
Hello all As I was talking to Andy about the 1420cc project I stated that most people , because they never raced, do not realize that the Firebolt stroker engine with 134/135 hp comming on at only 2500/3000RPM out accelerates my Ducati 1198 with 145/150 or KAWASAKI ZX10R with 150/160 on the bottom end . (CYCLE WORLD FUDGES NUMBERS AS WE ALL KNOW LOL) ANDY then said to me: Do you think your friends would LIKE AN...ECONOMY BUILD. iNSTEAD OF GOING 1420CC And buying cylinders pistons ect . take the exsisting 1200 cc motor shave the heads to raise comresssion, with free flowing b-1 or b-2 heads big valves , springs and cams. It might not have the maximum horsepower that you have but your looking at about 115hp at the rear wheel . That would still make the firebolt fly!! and cost alot less being you dont have to get the biggest best exhaust , headers, internals ect . For a comparison I also have: a 1125R with HPE race exhaust from germany with drid /twins tuned ECU and K&N performance intake. A 2002 Buell Cyclone M2 1200cc with the economy performance package =big valves worked heads ( not full B2 though) Plained heads to raise compression to 12.5:1 and sidewinder intake , mikuni tuned carb and Kooks? performance exhaust . Even though the heavier Cyclone(heavier than firebolt) has 102 hp , being the power comes in at a low RPM , comming off corners the cyclone and the 1125R run neck and neck till about 3rd gear where 1125R pulls away . looking at this example its a pretty safe bet that a firebolt with the economy performance package putting out roughly 115hp would not beat an 1125R but run head to head with it . I wanted to ask your opinion on this . YES I love my best of the best material 1420cc road/drag racer but times are Tough for everyone and Andy had a good point with a dam fast/ cheaper option . PS in ANY case dont be penny wise and dollar foolish. Upgrade the Cooling with the Forced air oil cooler. Also the BEST way to track temp is Dakota digital head temperature gauge(instant/constant knowlage of temp) OR AL at American sportbike has a oil temp dipstick gauge you screw into swing arm. YOU CAN up your performance without decreasing the motors life . IF you make sure you have proper lubrication and Engine cooling ... Think about it ? have you EVER heard of a COOL engine blowing up? | ||
| Speedfreaks101 |
The main issue with bumping the compression is that we run into a fuel issue. Our engines are already running hot as you know and then we are going to increase the heat. If it is a race bike then it is a non issue. We just install a bigger oil cooler, ram air duct, tune the piss out of it then run "good gas". On the other hand most guys buy these great bikes for low maint street machines and there lies the problem. I live in Texas and ride to Arkansas & Oklahoma often. In Tx you can get 93 octane at every pump in town but in the areas where you actually want to ride in AR & OK (especially OK) it is difficult to get 91 octane, many times you can only get 89. So then the excess power (if there is such a thing) makes more & more heat and you run into a detonation and pre ignition issue. Tuning the bike for added compression, 100 degree temps and under 90 octane is a tall order. I am not trying to be negative because I am once again looking for the best software to tune my 08 so that I can cool this damn thing down & make some more power with my planned mods. I look forward to see any future plans you come up with. BTW what exhaust do you have on your XB? | ||
| Jramsey |
Buy a 'Busa, it'll put down 125 at the RW runnin' on rat piss. | ||
| Jake318 |
I just traded in a ZX14 on a Triumph Sprint ST but thats not the idea | ||
| California69gs |
how much is an "economy" kit? | ||
| Jake318 |
Calififornia i dont know . Andy knows that stuff It was just a suggestion, knowing its cheaper than buying the 1420cc cylinders, pistons ect . My heart has been giving me problems so my energy level has tanked , hard to get the mail right now . We just did the 1420cc package with the new injectors available at Erik Buell Racing . The economy package would be 1200cc not as much HP but definatly cheaper for those not wanting MAX HP available but still fast . | ||
| California69gs |
I might be interested in both down the road. I didn't buy the 1125 because, put simply, I didn't fit. I loved the looks of the CR, I mean LOVED it. At 5'4" and a stocky build, it wasn't comfortable. My SCG on the other hand, fits me "almost" like a glove. Most certainly it's the best fitting sportbike for me. I've done some of the more common mods to the bike but even with my custom tune after the parts I'm still lacking in power. I drive all day in town 80% of the time so I don't think a straight up race kit would be best for me. Just the same I'd love to have 115 horses at the wheel. I'm sitting just over 80 with my custom tune right now. | ||
| Twinv |
What would be the cost for this economy perf package and how much for the full blown 1420 cc package installed ? | ||
| Brightbuell |
Yes how much installed for the economy package installed and can you please give an itemized list of everything? Im excited about this. I would love 115 hp. I could live with that for the rest of my life. | ||
| Jake318 |
Bright i have to talk to Andy but your looking at about 6-7k for full blown package and 3k for an economy package. I dont know all the prices on each part but he puts in all Top shelf components high lift cams ,Racing valves, racing springs, Adjustable pushrods , racing rockers ECT ECT Tuning a Buell is a Ball buster ( The SELF THINKING ECU is the one ..NEW IDEA.. Erik fouled up on) THATS the major hurtle in a BUELL and where you need a PROFESSIONAL. the dealers who you would think would have Maps ect DONT and are CLUELESS. Simons Competition is in Pa though ? Both you guys are in the midwest arnt you ? Who is closest to you guys ? as far as REAL builders .. look on the retailers board on this site. DONT send anyone your engine and then put it back into the bike yourself . No offence but you NEED a professional builder to tune the Bike . | ||
| Jake318 |
What sucks is looking at where you guys live . In the middle of the USA , I cant think of a good shop you can take the bike to? FIRS thing you guys have to do is look up bike haulng companies . I GOT SCREWED BY DEALERS NOT KNOWING ANDY WAS IN MY AREA(PHILA) . I WOULD HAVE SAVED A TON OF TIME AND MONEY SKIPPING THE DEALER AND GOING STRAIT TO SIMONS COMPETITION . EVEN IF SIMONS DIDNT EXSIST I WOULD HAVE SAVED TIME AND MONEY SENDING BIKE TO SAY CYCLE RAMA IN FLORIDA USING HAULING COMPANY . | ||
| Jake318 |
BTW, GUYS IM NOT SELLING ANYTHING.SO I DONT KNOW EXACT PRICES . IM JUST SHOWING THAT HIGH PERFORMANCE MODS CAN BE DONE WITHOUT SHORTENING ENGINE LIFE OR CREATING GRIEF . YOU JUST NEED THE PROPER INFORMATION/PLAN QUALITY COMPONENTS AND A SHOP EXPERIANCED IN PERFORMING HIGH PERFORMANCE ENGINE BUILDING . NOT= INSPECTIONS , BRAKE JOBS AND CUSTOM CHROME PART HANGERS. | ||
| California69gs |
Well I go to Hal's Harley where Buell did a ton of tunes and race bike work. Just the same having a 115 horses at the rear well for 3K sounds pretty promising. | ||
| Jake318 |
Sorry everyone , I have been ILL. No energy walk 50 ft and in exhausted . Took the bike out and put it through its paces best i could. The engine runs SO cool its amazing. 150 degree oil temps , head temps in the low 200s. The 20 to 80-100mph accelleration is faster than my 1198 Ducati even after I Installed billet aluminum pressure plate , flywheel and clutch basket( lighter parts quicker engine revving ) The Handling is superb as always when approching speeds say 70mph and above. That is when th Buell quick chassis shines next to the Ducati( and I do like my Ducati tremendosely) | ||
| California69gs |
Sorry to hear you haven't been feeling well. I'm sure the bike ride helped a little.  What have you all done to your bike so far Jake? | ||
| Jake318 |
California ... just got out of the hospital(heart) look at thread ... new performance upgrades that are now available ... EVERYTHING lol I just wish I could get the pics and dyno sheets up on this site if you look on HTTP://www.ducati-superbikes .com i have pics , dyno sheets ect and also you will see my stock ( relitively=slip on exhausts , cooling pressure plate aluminum flywheel and clutch basket ect ) DUCATI 1198 ran on same dyno for comparison The 1420cc Firebolt now is FASTER than my Ducati 1198 in MOST situations . The Ducati has 19 more HP but has 20 ft pounds LESS torque . Buell 135 hp /100 lbs toque VS 144? hp and 80lbs Torque . SO the 1420cc Firebolt is much quicker off the bottom end ( power is available at 2500/3000rpm) but on a LONG strait he Ducati will eventually pass the Buell. Basically the Buell handles better at high speeds and its advantages are much more usable . |
