| Author |
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Firemanjim
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2010 - 03:01 pm: | 
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I am betting not a TPS issue as new DDFI is not so dependant on it as older XB's, and they were really bad when it was not right.You have a crank sensor and IAC. And your AFV down to 85 indicates you have a pretty rich area somewhere in the "learned fuel" area and it pulls fuel by 15% to compensate--downside to that is it pulls fuel EVERYWHERE!! so you have some nice lean misfires I am betting. |
Firemanjim
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2010 - 03:07 pm: |
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And take a look at your cold start enrichment,after a 15 min ride it still shows 122%.Not sure if that is correct?? |
Ustorque
| | Posted on Saturday, August 14, 2010 - 07:46 am: |
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Thump, how goes the battle?
Last night I found and excercised the demons in my bike. All along in my case it was the intake seals! i tested and checked for leaks and found none, but decided to replace the seals anyways. Wouldn't ya know the old cityX is like new again. Today calls for a nice long ride to celebrate the rebirth of my baby. |
Thump4fun
| | Posted on Saturday, August 14, 2010 - 08:29 am: |
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Glad to hear it Ustorque! I'm just sitting here waiting for my sensors. I'm also ordering seals since it looks like changing the TPS requires removing the throttle body and replacing the intake seals.
How long did it take you to change the seals? |
Ustorque
| | Posted on Saturday, August 14, 2010 - 09:31 am: |
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It took me 4 hours total, to do the seals and that time included fabricating tools to actually get onto the throttle body bolts. If i had to do it again i'd just roll the motor....it would have been faster. there definately is not a lot of room in there! I couldn't find any actual bed areas of the old seals, but they were much harder and not as plyable as the new ones. |
Ustorque
| | Posted on Saturday, August 14, 2010 - 11:27 am: |
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Apparently i spoke too soon!!!
25 minutes into what i had hoped to be a great ride all symptoms returned. I guess back to the drawing board.....
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Iamarchangel
| | Posted on Saturday, August 14, 2010 - 04:56 pm: |
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Just read the whole thread. Sorry about your luck but it's not normal, so don't give up.
Me, I'd lean (oops) to an air leak on the front cylinder if you're similar to that first video. (Note the owner didn't let the engine light cycle through, bad.) Rear plug indicates okay. Also note plug reading is really based on last minutes of riding so it's hard to read from old plugs.
I'd accept the first start not catching as normal. Seems to be part of any bike I've owned. The second start should be good unless it is really cold out.
You've never said what your usual riding rpm is.
Somewhere in the archives will be a test for air leaks, I'd go that route.
Second guess would be the AIT but your idles are driving higher than that would take it if screwed up.
Third guess, call a priest, haha. |
Tepiddeath
| | Posted on Saturday, August 14, 2010 - 09:24 pm: |
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I have been having similar issues with my 09 xb 12 ss. The last time it was at the dealership (still under warranty) they reset the TPS, and adjusted the cable that controlls the flap in the muffler, oh yea, and they dropped it and dented my header! The new header is at the coater getting black ceramic coated inside and out. My bike was running better for a while, but everytime I ride her she seems to revert more and more to her old ways. I know the pucker factor that comes along with the momentary drop in RPM which is accompanied with the "cat sneeze", happened to me when I was leaving work yesterday. If I didn't love my bike so much I would have traded it long ago... Please keep us posted on what exactly fixes your issue! |
Thump4fun
| | Posted on Thursday, August 19, 2010 - 07:58 am: |
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I received notice that my sensors are on the way and should be here today. As a refresher, I already changed the O2 sensor with no results. I have these three sensors coming in:
- Air intake temp sensor
- Engine temp sensor
- Throttle position sensor
Of course they show up today, when I leave for an overnight ride tomorrow morning. So rather then tempting Murphy's Law and changing out the ETS or TPS, I'm only going to swap out the simple air intake sensor. I don't really anticipate this being my problem, although I did find one other person where this fixed their similar issue. But it was cheap insurance so I ordered it with the other two.
When I get back on Sunday I might find time to swap the ETS next, although it might not be until Monday or Tuesday.
I'll report back when I have any results.
. |
Iamarchangel
| | Posted on Thursday, August 19, 2010 - 08:58 pm: |
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Changing one at a time is the best plan. |
Piotr12
| | Posted on Saturday, August 28, 2010 - 10:36 am: |
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Any news? |
Thump4fun
| | Posted on Saturday, August 28, 2010 - 10:54 am: |
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Funny timing -- I was literally just minutes ago calling around to find a socket for removing/installing the engine temp sensor.
But can't find one from Auto Zone, NAPA or Harbor Freight.
Trying to figure out what to do about that at the moment.
I did swap out the air temp sensor before my ride last week, but that made no difference. Now the ETS as soon as I can figure out a way to do it.
A lot of posts about making your own with a cheap 1/2" deep well and a Dremmel to cut a portion of the side off...I may be stuck with borrowing a buddie's Dremmel later this morning. |
Thump4fun
| | Posted on Saturday, August 28, 2010 - 03:48 pm: |
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Looks like I'll either have to try cutting a 1/2" deep well socket that I bought -- or buying ready-made socket that I found from IronMachine.
http://www.ironmachine.com/product_info.php?cPath= 49&products_id=131
In the meantime I figured I would try swapping in the new TPS. I've been holding off on that one since the service manual has me removing the entire throttle body. I figured I'd try to just get it out without tearing everything apart and sure enough...I was able to just barely get the bottom screw undone without going through 4 hours of work!
But alas...it also doesn't seem to have solved the problem. Fired her up and she coughed and sputtered and stalled 3x before I held the throttle at 2k for a minute and the let it down slowly, after which she kept idling on her own. This is normal operating procedure for me late.
I realize I need to reset the TPS and ride it to let it re-learn, so I'll be doing that later this afternoon. Maybe the reset with the new TPS will actually solve it. I'm not holding my breath.
I'll swap out the engine temp sensor later this week once I get a socket.
To be continued... |
Fast1075
| | Posted on Saturday, August 28, 2010 - 08:59 pm: |
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I had the fan go out on mine, so while I had it apart, I replaced the oxygen sensor. I rechecked my timing.. It had been checked  during the 10k service according to my dealership check list.
Not...it was advanced...I set it to where it belongs...put bike together and went for a ride.
I now rate it as good....much better than before.... |
Thump4fun
| | Posted on Monday, August 30, 2010 - 08:21 am: |
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PARTIAL SUCCESS...??
Well, interestingly enough the new TPS seems to have made a significant difference. Not completely back to normal but a big difference.
After resetting the TPS and then heading out for a ride with the wife yesterday, it ran even worse then it's typical crappy self. Until about 12 miles and 20 minutes into the ride. Rolled up to a stop and I noticed she didn't stumble or lurch. By the time we stopped for lunch she was running better then usual.
After lunch she started right up and idled perfectly. And the ride home was relatively smooth, with no high idles, stumbling or heavy lurching. At first I also noticed that the throttle was a bit more sensitive to my touch...even a slight twist and it was almost like turning a switch from off to on. The bike would jump and want to just take off.
By the end of the ride the throttle jump was either back to normal or I had gotten used to the change...hard to tell. And the bike was running 80% better. I could still feel the stumbling, but only slightly compared to how it was.
Not wanting to hold my breath I figured this morning it would run like crap -- but nope. Turned her over only once and she purred right away, hovering perfectly at 1k RPM. Let her warm up and no whacky idle and no stalling. The ride to work was pleasant with much reduced stumbling/lurching.
Unlike when I swapped ECMs for a day and it ran absolutely perfectly before going completely south the following day, the TPS swap has made it run much better, although not perfect. But also unlike the ECM, the positive change so far is actually staying put.
I'm still withholding complete success, particularly since some of the stumbling is still there. I think there may actually be 2 issues at play here, with the TPS having been one of them, so we'll see what the next few days bring.
(Message edited by thump4fun on August 30, 2010) |
Ustorque
| | Posted on Monday, August 30, 2010 - 04:12 pm: |
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Thump, have you done the ETS yet? |
Thump4fun
| | Posted on Monday, August 30, 2010 - 04:39 pm: |
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No, I haven't yet replaced the ETS. I didn't have a slotted socket and so I did the TPS next instead.
Here's what I've replaced so far:
- O2 sensor (no change)
- IAT sensor (no change)
- TPS (big change so far)
I'm going to keep running as is to see how she continues to do until I get the slotted socket. Then I'll replace the ETS to see if that helps get rid of the remaining minor stumbling. |
Thump4fun
| | Posted on Monday, September 13, 2010 - 07:02 pm: |
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Final Solution
After 2 weeks it seems I have the final solution. Replace the TPS.
See my post three posts above for details on my TPS replacement. Simply replacing that one sensor made a world of difference. It's 2 weeks later and I have NOT stalled out a single time at any start-up, no matter the temp, humidity, cold-start, warm-start, whatever.
To recap, my issues were:
#1 - Sputtering, coughing and stalling out on more then 50% of my starts. See an example here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkh1Ttms7jU
#2 - Sputtering and lurching while riding. See the video above and think of that sputtering happening while riding, that's what it felt like. Even worse, almost dropped the bike on three separate days when leaving from a stop due to the stumbling and loss of power.
#3 - High-speed idling. Come to stop at traffic light, bike idles around 1,500-1,700 RPMs instead of 1,100.
All three of my issues have been resolved with a new TPS. There is still a slight feeling of the A/C coming on when riding once in a while, but nothing even close to how it used to be.
I did go ahead and replace the engine temp sensor (ETS) this past Saturday since I had already bought it. Like the other sensors, it made no difference. I also tried a buddies good IAC and ECM, riding with each for a couple of days. No changes with those either.
The TPS solved my problem.
Thanks all for bearing with me through this, and I hope it helps someone else out now or in the future! |
Ustorque
| | Posted on Sunday, September 19, 2010 - 09:20 am: |
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Yesterday i finally replaced me Engine Temp Sensor and after an hour plus ride all seems right in the world again! ill be taking an extended ride today, and my hopes are high that the problem was the ETS. |
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