| Author | Message | ||
     Grianp |
How many people are running this combo? I have the Drummer already, but haven't installed it on my XB12 and was curious to know how this is working out for people who have been running it. I have read that the addition of the EBR ECM is a big improvement on the stock ECM, but I just wanted to hear specifics from those who are running this setup and have been for a while now. Please share your thoughts and experiences with this. Lastly, I heard a while back that EBR was possibly making an ECM specifically made to run with the Drummer. Is their any truth to this or is the current EBR ECM the only solution other than a custom tune? I sent EBR an email back in December to clarify but never got an answer. Any insight is appreciated. Thanks, Brian | ||
| Grianp |
is this not the right place to post or does no one care to comment? | ||
| Firemanjim |
Brian,depending on how early your bike is some 08's were tuneable with ECM-Spy. Later ones need the Technoresearch key and software. But we just tested a new EBR ecm on an 09 with a Drummer and it was hands down better than the stock ecm.Cylinders were fueling more evenly(on stock ecm, rear cylinder was way different AFR than front and both cylinders were actually too rich up top) and fueled better up top.Made 3 more HP. | ||
| Froggy |
Not many, if any. EBR would be the best to answer your questions. You said you emailed them in December, they weren't even open for business back then. | ||
| Grianp |
@Firemanjim - I actually have an 09 as well. @Froggy - I checked my email, it was actually send in January. Maybe I will send another. | ||
| Padave |
I'm running the same configuration - been watching this thread closely to see what people had to say. I had talked to Kevin @ Drummer about this same issue - He said it won't make much difference except it adds more fuel in the top end, and that sticking with stock would be just fine. But being the ever skeptical person that I am, I'm always interested in input. | ||
| Grianp |
+1 to what Padave said. Whether the new EBR ECM is needed or not is irrelevant to me. I just want to go about doing things the right way and doing what is best to not harm the bike. I am only looking for more input and facts so I know which route to take. | ||
| Krueger08xb12s |
I have an 08xb12S and rode it with a stock ECM, Drummer, and K&N Airfilter for 2 years with no problems. I put the EBR Race ECM on about 2 months ago and it made a very nice change to the smoothness & power delivery. I did speak to EBR about the posibility of a Race ECM calibrated to the drummer and a few other items regarding the ECM. They were VERY helpful and responsive, even after they made the sale... that says alot about their cusomer service. Here's a clip from the email chain. Sorry it's rather lengthy, but it's all good info and I think it'll help you Grianp: Hello Kyle, What exhaust system are you running on the XB12? K&N filter? Just want to make sure we send the correct cal file in the ECU. The calibration was developed with the dual outlet P&A muffler and a K&N filter installed. It's a refined calibration and should wake up your bike. Thanks, Michael -------- Michael, Thanks for getting back with me. I have an 08xb12 with a Drummer Exhaust (standard single outlet) and a K&N airfilter. Besides those mods (and a breather reroute which probably doesn't come into play at all) I've made no other performance mods to the bike. I read on BadWeatherBikers that EBR was planning to develop an ECM specifically for the Drummer & K&N; are you implying that this calibration is complete and I can get this ECM? Thanks, Kyle -------- Michael, Thanks for getting back with me. I have an 08xb12 with a Drummer Exhaust (standard single outlet) and a K&N airfilter. Besides those mods (and a breather reroute which probably doesn't come into play at all) I've made no other performance mods to the bike. I read on BadWeatherBikers that EBR was planning to develop an ECM specifically for the Drummer & K&N; are you implying that this calibration is complete and I can get this ECM? Thanks, Kyle -------- Kyle, The calibration we'll send in the ECU was developed around the now not sold Buell dual outlet P&A muffler and K&N filter. It was known as the "XB race kit" The person who developed our calibration informs me it will work fine with a Drummer, and will learn it. The 02 sensors remain enabled, and it work with pump gas, or race gas. Specifically to answer your question, no work has been completed on a drummer specific calibration. Shall I proceed and ship the ECU? If you have any other questions don't hesitate to call or reply. Thanks, Michael -------- Michael, Great, that was my understanding (the ECU was developed for the Race Pipe but is compatible with a Drummer). Yes, please send this ECU; If EBR calibrates an ECU for a standard drummer, I'll contact you for my options of reflashing the unit. I'd just like to ask one more question if you wouldn't mind: What other changes have been made to this ECU vs my stock ECU? Is it simply Air & Fuel Values or has timing, Rev-Limitations, idle, etc been modified as well? Thanks again for your help and the purchase. Kyle -------- Kyle, Both fuel and timing have been adjusted, and a few things have been Turned off that could interfere with a race track duty cycle. Rev limits remain OE. Thanks, Michael -------- Michael, Thanks for checking in; my order came in ontime and I installed the ECU last night and rode it around in 30-degrees! Thanks again, I'll spread the good word about EBR's customer service. One quick question: I noticed the fan is running much different than stock - it's running while the bike's in motion and stopping when the bike comes to a stop AND when the bike's shut off. Is this normal? It seems like it's not performing it's intended duty of cooling the smothered rear cylinder when the air scoop can't. Thanks, Kyle -------- Hello Kyle, Below is the response from the lead calibration person on the fan control. "This is not unique to the race ECU. This is the revised fan strategy we released in response to customer complaints about the fan running too much. All of the latest production cals have this strategy in them too. His bike was probably built before we implemented this strategy." | ||
| Krueger08xb12s |
Final verdict Grianp, Buy (install) the Drummer and install the EBR Race ECM if you want a little more push. You won't hurt anything either way. THE MOST IMPORTANT THING is that if you install a new ECM that you let the bike LEARN the RIGHT way. Some people have posted advice on "learning" your bike after new mods or severe weather changes and have instructed people to take their bike for a cruise for about 10 minutes holding steady between 3.5-5k RPMS.... WRONG!... you have to "load" or "roll" numerous times between this open-loop range so that all TPS/RPM values are touched. | ||
| Niceguyeddy |
Very nice, thank you Kyle.  | ||
| 2008xb12scg |
Krueger I have an 08 with a drummer, no other mods. I just insalled the pipe and that was about it. Runs good, but is there something i didn't do that i should? I've had the pipe on for months. I didnt understand the last part of your post, sorry im a little slow on this stuff | ||
| Boney95 |
I just put on an open airbox (with K&N), with a EBR ECM. Its kind of hard for me to notice a power difference since I haven't rode the bike for months due to winter. But she still runs like a raped ape. | ||
| Artic_12_r |
I am running the EBR ECM, KN filter and Drummer SS. Runs amazing. I would not change a thing. | ||
| Blackandchrome |
Krueger08xb12s: What's the proper break in? I just put a drummer (w/ single billet cap) on my 08 xb12R. I did the TPS reset and took a 15 minute ride keeping it steady at 3.5 - 4k rpms. | ||
| Grianp |
here is an additional update from EBR- There are no plans to create a specific ECM for a drummer, but is very close, perhaps the closest to the former P&A "pro series" race muffler in the aftermarket. Our calibrations were developed using the pro series muffler. If you purchase the race ECM and need it reflashed, I'll take care of that no charge once. Additional ECM reflashes at best will be a small nominal fee if its required perhaps $25 We hope to sell you an ECM one time, that it meets your needs from the start and doesn't need to be reflashed. Let me know if you have any other questions. For what it's worth we have negotiated an order with the supplier of the former pro series muffler and hope to have them available mid May. It's far and away the best replacement muffler for an XB, and will be priced competitively with the aftermarket offerings currently available. Followed up with this- The XB race muffler we're working on is the same as the previous one. Price will be up a bit. We simply can't buy them at the same volumes H-D P&A used too. Most likely priced similar to a Drummer. Our calibration techs tell me the Drummer is close to the old pro series muffler, but not quite as good. As aftermarket mufflers go it does work pretty well. The other exhaust kit worthy of note is Micron's full serpent system. We are working on a full system for the XB as well, but it will be quite loud and intended for track use only. It will be very similar to the AMA Pro Thunder exhaust system. | ||
| Krueger08xb12s |
@ Blackandchrome The proper break-in is NOT cruising steady between 3.5-5k RPM. This only lets the bike learn at those RPM/TPS values. I did this incorrect method for 2 years until Kevin from Drummer informed me the right way. (Kevin, correct me if this is wrong) 1 Ride bike to an open highway that's relatively uncongested. 2) Ride bike in 3rd/4th gear @ 3k RPM 3) Roll on the throttle taking approx 2-5 seconds to go from closed to wide open and repeat until you are above 5k RPM 4) Repeat this process a few time, the more you do it the more accurately tuned you ECM will be. This should be done after any performance mod or extreme weather/altitude change. I do it almost every time i ride. Post your findings. | ||
| Kds1 |
yeh, it works alot better doing it this way....the more times its done this way the quicker it learns...this is only my opinion of my procedure and findings...works for me.... Kevin www.kdfab.com | ||
| Krueger08xb12s |
Kevin , thanks again for the quick repair to my drummer... I was shocked to see that you not only fixed it quickly, but u went further to even give it a new paint & polish job too!! Two thumbs up I'll spread the good word about your drummers! -kyle | ||
| Grianp |
Kyle and/or Kevin- Is that procedure only necessary when using the stock ECM or do you need to follow it as well with installing the EBR ECM? What is the proper procedure after installing for both ECM options? | ||
| Id073897 |
1 Ride bike to an open highway that's relatively uncongested. 2) Ride bike in 3rd/4th gear @ 3k RPM 3) Roll on the throttle taking approx 2-5 seconds to go from closed to wide open and repeat until you are above 5k RPM 4) Repeat this process a few time, the more you do it the more accurately tuned you ECM will be. Could you send me the logs, please. | ||
| Glitch |
Is that procedure only necessary when using the stock ECM or do you need to follow it as well with installing the EBR ECM? All the ECMs work basically the same, they only have different maps/parameters. They learn in open loop the same. | ||
| Ebennett08 |
I have an 08 XB12 Ss with an original Drummer and a K&N air filter. I put my air box and breather hoses back to stock after a few thousand miles. Got tired of smelling oil. I added the Erik Buell Racing ECM for my setup this evening. The first 50 mile ride went very well. I'm very happy with the ECM. Well worth the $250. Used to sputter and nearly die when taking off in first. Now it powers right into motion. WOT hitting second and third will get a little air under the front wheel. Nice idle at 1000 RPM. Improved around town riding at 2-3000 RPM. 4-7000 RPM improved as well, more powerful, runs up the RPM range quicker. For guys that don't want to tinker and tweak their ECM, the "non-tunable" $250 race ECM is perfect. Michael at Erik Buell Racing was very helpful. Nice guy. |
