| Author | Message | ||
     Kaudette |
Q. Installing an XB9 racing ECM - would this work on a 12? Wiring patter the same? Would this up the rev-limiter? Could the ECM compensate or would one have to do a PCIII map (as Nallins for the big bore kit)? I ask not to save a few buck but because I'm sure the 12 can run to 7500 (on occassion - not all the time) and I have an extra 9 ECM sitting in my desk. | ||
| Bads1 |
Kaudette I don't think it would work seeing the Fuel injection is larger. | ||
| Easyflier |
I would have to try it, I think it would work. | ||
| M1combat |
I don't see why it wouldn't work as long as you could get enough fuel. I would imagine that swapping to a different injector would work but I'm certainly not the most brilliant mind on this forum... Lets see what other people say. The main problem I see is the size of the valves once you make the ECM work and actually run it up in the RPM's. | ||
| Bads1 |
I was talking to Jens from Hillbilly motors and they put BMW injectors in the Xb's.I'd have to ask him from which model.He told me but it slips my mind.And as far as the ecm's.I guess my question would be why would buell even bother with two different ecm's if they would work in both bikes.Thats why they have the race ecm's.At a money stand point it wouldn't make sense for BUELL to have 4 ecm's if they would all work in there bikes. | ||
| M1combat |
Well, I think what he was asking was if the only difference in the ECM was the rev limit. I don't think that's the case. I think there is a difference in what it will ask the injector to do, there's no exhaust valve control on the 9ECM. Are there differences in the temperature sensors as well?? I can't see why trying it would hurt, but I think to actually make it work like a 12ECM with a high rev-limit you are looking at a few other mods beyond the ECM alone. If you get it done, let me know how. | ||
| Oconnor |
bmw 1150 injector | ||
| Bads1 |
That I remember Oconnor but what year is the right 1150 injectors from. | ||
| Oconnor |
I am willing to bet that all th1150 motors are damn near the same. But that is a good question. I tried searching on the net if there were different part numbers for different years but couldn't even get to square one. Does anyone know for sure. I keep forgetting to call a BMW dealership... I am going to throw a set on once I get my race ecm installed | ||
| Kaudette |
The way I understand it (rudimentary at best) is that the ECM can compensate for the AF mix to a certain extent - and this is based on the feedback from the cam sensor and the oxygen sensor (other inputs likely.?) My though was that if the big bore kits can run on the 9 ECM (1200 kit with bored throttle body), why not a stock 12 with the 9 ECM. I know that is pretty simplistic however it is a start. If anyone out there is comfortable in trying this out, I'm extremely interested to see if it works - I can't do too much "testing" of this type as the local shop is not all that focused on wrenching - more on chrome and tassles... Another thing I noticed in digging into 9 vs. 12 piece swaps is that apparently the header / muffler diameter is identical for the 9 and 12 headers. What's the point of larger headers if they are going to be constricted to 9 diameter where the pipe fits to the header? The good thing is at least I'mm be able to try the HSA pipe on the 12 and see how it works (worked really well past 4G on the 9) Thanks again for the input on the topic and thoughts & experiences! | ||
| Signguy |
Oconnor - All I know is that the "new" BMW 1150 engines use dual plug heads. I don't know if this info would help in figuring out if the injectors are different through the years. Just thought I'd throw in the little that I do know!  A call to a BMW dealer's tech might be the best route. The folks at www.r1150r.net might be helpful too. | ||
| Kaudette |
why would one need BMW injectors to feed a 12 if the current ones can do the job? What' the connection with the 9 ECM that makes this necessary? | ||
| Trojan |
When we swapped our XB9 engine over for a 12, we were told by the factory race shop that under NO circumstances should we run the ECM from the 9 on the 12 motor. Without knowing the full ins and outs of it, I assume that there is a lot more to it than mere rev limits. | ||
| Kaudette |
Trojan, Thanks for the heads up - I'm still wondering how the 1200 big bore people run a 9 ECM with a PCIII module with a 47mm throttle body and it seems to work.??? Does anyone know what the ECM uses to manage the fuel injection? If the throttle body is the Marelli or Delco one on the XB? As I understand it, the fuel management is not rocket science as the injection is managed with a few parameters. In addition, I'm talking about the 9 Race ECM which has more flexibility to self-adjust so perhaps this with a techlusion or PCIII box could compensate for the fuel delivery.? I understand that the ECM will also control the rest of the electricals on teh XB but these are pretty much the same as for the 9 - I can't really imagine what may have changed. Any thoughts out there from those running the big-bore 9 (either 1050 or 1200 bore) with the 9 ECM? | ||
| Kaudette |
I just heard that there is a HD dealer that has found a way to remap the XB ECM (even raising the rev limiter!!) I've sent off an email and will keep you posted. I'm still interested in the 9 Race ECM in the 12 - Ive looked at the wiring patterns in the 9 owners manual and don't see any reason why it "should" not work. We just got snow here so it may be a bit before I get to try it out. | ||
| Spiderman |
Hmmm 3.8 inch stroke + 7800 RPM red line = bad bad bad | ||
| Fullpower |
spidey cant say for sure about swapping xb ecm, but i run a sportster with 4-5/16" stroke. currently running dyna 2000i at 6500 rpm limit. bounce off it every day. have in past run points ignition, and have run it up to 7000 rpm many times. i would not run it there long, but it did not hurt anything. stroker has 22,000 miles on, and goes on 1200 mile weekend trips. cranking compression is 205 psi, same as when built. starting to get a little oil consumption. my point is i dont see a big problem with an occasional romp to 7500rpm with a short 3-13/16" stroke. would not run the highway at that rpm, but as a shift point when in a hurry, i think you are ok. | ||
| Spiderman |
Full how built is your motor though??? | ||
| Fullpower |
cams are andrews n6, so only .500 lift, 264degrees. lots of overlap though, helps bleed down some of that 11.5 :1 compression.S&S lower end, S1 lightning heads, S&S springs, keepers. S&S G carb with thunder jet. it breathes pretty well. still get45 mpg when i run with the pack. pretty thirsty when i twist its tail though. will wheelie 3rd gear, and will pull 6800 in 5th gear, but you do have to hold on. later, dean | ||
| Buckinfubba |
the ecm also runs the timing....different strokes for different folks(engines) not that i am a rocket scientist but....timing would be way goofy don't ya think. my remedy for ailing power is to move to a part of the country where the roads are so damn twisty that 99% of the time you can't get above 100 with out seriously endangering yourself... atleast thats what I did | ||
| Spiderman |
Bingo Dean! You enhaced your heads with stronger springs. Single wound, single spring wouldn't hold up to that but three times I bet. | ||
| Kaudette |
Thanks Bubba. Doesn't the ECM pick up timing from the cam sensor and then "re-feed" this info to the ignition? If this is the case, then we just need to know if the cam sensor is providing the same info to the ECM - then it should work. (Theoretically) What I'm worried about is running way too lean with the 9 ECM (among other things) As for moving to a part of the country where the roads are twisty - no problem there - I live in the French alps so all I see is turns - again, why I'm looking for the 7500 limiter it to get more over-run ability in 2nd and 3rd when needed. | ||
| Trojan |
The Nallin 'kitted' 1200 big bore XB9's can keep the original ECM simply because there is no change in stroke, just the bore is bigger. | ||
| Kaudette |
"i see" said the blind man. | ||
| Daves |
Check your email Kaudette! Ride to the edge! Dave Iowa HD/Buell (Buell Cycle Center) | ||
| Kaudette |
Daves, gotcha - I'll call in 5 | ||
| Buckinfubba |
Kaudette the french roads are great...I know what you mean about 2nd and 3rd. | ||
| Daves |
Thanks for the Biz Kaudette! Ride to the edge! Dave Iowa HD/Buell (Buell Cycle Center) | ||
| Kaudette |
Buckinfubba - the 2nd and 3rd reference is that on some of the better roads here there is enough room so that I find myself continually between 2nd and 3rd at high RPMs and the 12 does not like fast shifting (above 6000 rpm) - therefore I was looking for some overrun capability on the 12 to make the shift window a bit more "rider friendly". I guess that it could be seen as a gearing issue as well, so when we get the shorter gearing option for the 12 I will probably look into that. Daves - thanks for the support & keep up the good work! | ||
| Alex |
Hi there, why would a stroked engine need different ignition timing? |
