| Author | Message | ||
     Kev187 |
Reporting in! 7 Months old & 6400 miles on my 2008 Ulysses. It seems my bearings are totally shot & my front rotor is warped. I put her in the shop for a new rear tire & had them inspect the Bearings & Rotor Bearings were rusted out already, Dealer said they would "TRY" to fix them under warranty? Front Rotor is pulsing badly, so bad its scary. I tried the Lyndol Golds, that did not work. Dealer said their demo ULY did the same thing & its normal. I contested that no bike should pulse & shake under breaking, again, they said they would "try" ti fix it under warranty? ANYONE had issues getting a rotor or wheel bearings replaced under warranty, the bike is only 7 months old, should not be having problems like this on any bike??? Thanks in Advance!} | ||
| Jos51700 |
It's all warranty. Tell 'em to stop acting like they're doing you a favor. | ||
| J2blue |
Find a different dealer if you can. | ||
| Froggy |
The bearings are a common issue. Buell recently made a change to the bearing seal to prevent it. The rotor isn't warped, $20 says you hold the brake while at red lights, and that causes deposits to be left on the rotor. Use the rear brake instead. Both of these are covered by warranty. I had my rear bearings replaced at 15k, all I did was asked that the tech check them since it was getting a new tire anyway. He noticed that one side was failing, so he replaced both sides. For my rotor, it was starting to pulse before the 5k service, so I mentioned it to them, they did something that got it down about 80%. It started coming back so I mentioned it again at the 10k, they had threw a new rotor on. Haven't used the front brake since at lights, and haven't had any issues with pulsing, 20k miles since then. I run Lyndal pads now, but thats nothing to do with the pulsing. | ||
| Kev187 |
Thanks everyone! Yeah, I suspect once they call Buell tomorrow to determine if it falls under warranty, they will pay for it all. The Bearings looked awful, rusted & pitted. "The bearings are a common issue. Buell recently made a change to the bearing seal to prevent it." Do we know how recent Buell improved the bearings? Mine is a 2008, that I took Delivery of just this past March? I mean, they ones I had looked like the metal on my 7 year old BBQ pit out back! I cleaned the rotor, buffed it down, then put the Lyndol Gold pads on, no luck, the pulsing was improved, but not removed. I figure, once they put the new rotor on, ill swap the Lyndol pads back on before riding it. Rusted Bearings, crazy procedures to keep breaks from messsing up, use rear not front, grease outside of bearings? What the F, I paid $11K for this thing? } | ||
| Kev187 |
Question? Are there any improved after market bearings out there for the XB bikes, so I need not replace them every 7 months? | ||
| Hughlysses |
Kevin, Go to the "Big, Bad, and Dirty" forum here and search and you'll find all kinds of wheel bearing threads. The updated wheel bearings evidently came out sometime in August; even the early 2009 model bikes don't have them. The new bearings have black seals; the earlier ones have orange seals. People have tried several brands of aftermarket bearings including SKF and Koyo. While they do seem to hold up better than the original NTN bearings, there have been failures of both brands. OTOH some of the original NTN bearings on 2006 Ulys have gone over 30,000 miles without problems. There's been a lot of speculation about what's causing the problem with many different theories thrown out. The only thing we know for sure is the question was asked at Homecoming this summer and Abe Askanazi of Buell stated they had investigated the problem, determined water was getting past the seals, and the new bearings would have improved seals to correct the problem. I think it's a pretty good bet that the new factory bearings are the way to go. | ||
| Riding_tall |
The updated bearings came out last month, though I don't know when or if they started being used on the new bikes. The updated bearings have black seal instead of an orange one. I would ask the dealer for the new ones. I found this out when my rear bearings failed last month. The new ones had just started shipping and were on backorder so I got some after market ones. I replaced them my self and taking an idea from this board, drilled two small drain holes in the rear hub. Not sure if it will help but if any water does get in there it has a way out now. Both issues should defiantly be fixed by a dealer on an 08. When waiting at a light I always hold with the rear brake now. Holding the brakes when stopped is an issue with all disk brakes, It's just that the buell seems a little more susceptible to it. I had the brakes on my dodge truck do that at under 20,000 miles. The pulsing was so bad the wheels would start to hop under hard braking, not safe. It was not replaced under warranty and I had to get new pads and rotors. When I'm stopped with the truck I use just enough force to hold the truck in place. Here is a like that goes into great detail as to why this happens. http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_warped_braked isk.shtml (Message edited by riding_tall on November 02, 2008) | ||
| Kev187 |
Thanks again I am going to call the Dealer tomorrow, see what options there are to get the "new" bearings in place vs. the same OEM. Sounds like I am not going to get any headaches as far as warranty taking care of all this work :-) | ||
| Froggy |
Kev, if your dealer gets you nowhere and you want to look elsewhere, Frederick in Maryland is about an hour north of you, and they are an enthusiastic Buell dealer. Some of their employees post here too  | ||
| Kev187 |
Froggy Thanks, my Dealer actually is not bad, the girl who was running the finance department (she was awesome, even though I paid cash, she was a huge help) she now works in the service. She was more on the end of "I have not dealt with this before & will call Buell on Monday" than being overall negative. So shall see how it goes. But its nice that Frederick is an option, there are a lot of Buell dealers local to wash DC. Thanks again everyone, Ill post an update once I hear from the dealer tomorrow!~ | ||
| Glitch |
I don't know Froggy, if the bearing go out, that makes uneven load on the rotor, could cause the rotor to warp. If it was just another "warped" rotor thread, then I'd agree with ya. | ||
| Froggy |
Well he didn't specify if it was front/rear/both bearings that failed, I was assuming rear as thats what most of the failures are. | ||
| Kev187 |
The dealer is replacing both the front & rear, said while on the rack spinning the wheels, they were making a lot of noise & you could see the outer casing on both bearings full of pits & brown from rust, I shoudl have taken some pics, really bad looking. See what tomrrow brings? | ||
| U4euh |
Awww crap, you mean they are coming out with a new bearing that has a black seal, again? The 03's had the infamous black bearing failures. | ||
| Froggy |
U4, they did already. Its on most of the 09's. Bads1 bought a new blue rim, it came with a black seal so he posted about it. I said then and I will say again, why not make it green? Can't confuse that with orange or black | ||
| Bombardier |
Anyone tried the ceramic bearings? Supposedly lasts a hell of a lot longer according to the advertisement. | ||
| Kev187 |
"Anyone tried the ceramic bearings? Supposedly lasts a hell of a lot longer according to the advertisement" Ok, just curious? But why did my Triumph Tiger with 15000 miles on it have perfect wheel bearings on it & breaks, same riding conditions as my Ulysses? Also, I have a 1980 Vespa with 6000 miles on it, the last 2000 have been from the last year of riding, its wheel bearings are great, my two Honda Ruckus scooters both are kept out side & their wheel bearings are great. Yet my $11000 Uly... everyone is having these wheel bearing & break rotor issues? what Gives? (Message edited by kev187 on November 03, 2008) | ||
| Jos51700 |
what Gives? Everybody gets bad batches of parts, now and then. Remember the Goldwing frame recall from a few years ago, and Honda themselves were making those parts. It happens. Let's not forget, the Ruckii and the Vespa don't have near the weight of the Uly, nor the power (and subsequent high speeds and subsequent wheel and brake loading). | ||
| Jos51700 |
Why not green? Can't confuse that with orange or black Still a Harley-Davidson company. (Message edited by jos51700 on November 03, 2008) | ||
| Kev187 |
hat Gives? "Everybody gets bad batches of parts, now and then. Remember the Goldwing frame recall from a few years ago, and Honda themselves were making those parts. It happens. Let's not forget, the Ruckii and the Vespa don't have near the weight of the Uly, nor the power (and subsequent high speeds and subsequent wheel and brake loading)." I understand, but havent the XB bikes been around since 2003? I have been riding for 13 years & have owned Five Motorcycles & 3 scooters. My last bike, was a 500+lb triumph TIger + Luggage & Regular Passenger, no bearing problems, I had two other 400-500lb Honda prior to that, one being a 1986 VFR with 26,000 miles, no wheel Bearing Problems. Its been 5 years, why are my bearings rusting out? I know, I am Bitching, but seriously? Wheel Bearings taking 5-6 years to sort out after motorcycles have been using them for.. how long? I am anxious to get the bike back, but do not want to be claiming wheel bearing replacement under warranty every 7-8 months for the rest of my 5 year warranty. | ||
| Swordsman |
Wait, so the original black bearings were crap. Better orange bearings were supposed to fix it. Now the orange ones are leaking too? I'd better go take a look at mine....  ~SM | ||
| Etennuly |
I have a theory about this bearing problem. I have an '06 Uly that now has 34,000 miles on it. I have the original bearings. Every new rear tire, at 6,000 mile intervals, I re-grease the outer side of the bearing by picking out the seal and smearing some new in there, then press the seal back in. More importantly,IMHO, I coat the rear axle and the outer surface of the bearing and seal with anti-sieze. I truly believe that the water intrusion that causes the rust that leads to the bearing failures, is induced by what is the clearance between the inner bearing race and the axle tube itself. Every failure that I have seen has been initially caused by water intrusion. It either dilutes the grease and or causes rust on the bearing surfaces. I have had evidence of water in the spacer between the bearings in my bike at the first tire change. Slathering the axle with anti-sieze has sealed the water out since. I really think it is as simple as that, water gets in through the axle/inner race fittment. The axle is higher than the bottom of the bearing and inner seal, so water that gets in seeking the lowest point will set and soak at the bottom of the inside of the bearing. At 34,000 miles the bearings on my bike have been working well and I now have about 2,000 miles on one of those really tight new drive belts. Of course I could be wrong, but that has never happened before!  | ||
| Swordsman |
Okay, I checked my stock orange bearings. I have surface rust on the outer silver part on 3 of them. The one under the rear belt sprocket is coated in black grease... so much so you can't see the orange. Are the symptoms I should worry about, or just the common appearance for aging bearings (I've got ~14k on these factory originals). Thanks! ~SM | ||
| Jos51700 |
I know, I am Bitching, but seriously? Wheel Bearings taking 5-6 years to sort out after motorcycles have been using them for.. how long? That's my point. The original design wasn't built with the Uly in mind, and/or, they may have had a bad batch of parts. And, it's entirely possible that the bearings fail routinely after a certain number of years of use, or in certain climates or something. BMC cannot test every scenario to guarantee performance. However, BMC is one of the few companies that will take care of a problem like this with continual product updates. If, for example, '06 ZX6R's had wheel bearing issues, Kawasaki would not offer updated parts, bulletins, etc. They love you and leave you. | ||
| Etennuly |
Sword, That little bit of surface rust on the outer edges means nothing in itself. That is just the bare metal edge of the bearing races. Clean the outer surface then you can use a safety pin to pick out the seal to see if the grease is clean. It will look real clean and kind of clear with what ever color the grease is(mine was blue). You can do this best when you take the wheel off. If the grease looks dirty, milky, rusty, or gone it is time for bearings. I just wipe a small amount of hi speed wheel bearing grease into the outside of the bearing, but don't fill the little cavity, it needs air space. The seal will slip right back in with your fingers. I always put anti-sieze on the axle and have been putting a light coat of it on the outside of the seals and the point where the axle and bearing meet to seal water out. | ||
| Kev187 |
Dealer replaced the wheel bearings under warranty, but not sure if its new or old bearings, It sounds like its something they had in stock already? They had to order a new rotor, also covered under warranty. Hope to have the bike back next week :-D At the rate I put miles on her, by MAy, it will be back in the shop for new bearings again! | ||
| Hughlysses |
Dealer replaced the wheel bearings under warranty, but not sure if its new or old bearings, It sounds like its something they had in stock already? Look at the seals: orange = old bearings; black = updated bearings | ||
| Moosestang |
They had to order a new rotor, also covered under warranty. Hope to have the bike back next week :-D At the rate I put miles on her, by MAy, it will be back in the shop for new bearings again! Well in that case you will need new rims within 2 years because I read the rims are only good for 4 or 5 bearing changes. Does anyone have a picture of these rusted out bearings? I'm assuming you'd need to do a lot of riding in the rain. | ||
| Skinstains |
I blame the premature failure of the rear wheel bearings on the drive belt. I don't know for sure but would bet that a much greater percentage of failures are on the rear wheel. I don't think that the constant tension of the belt is good at all. Perhaps if the swingarm pivot and output shaft were on the same pivot ala Moto-Syss it could work with a spring loaded tensioner like the Free-Spirits one. I have chains on all of my bikes and have no bearing problems. Just be glad that the wheel bearing is the weakest link and not the output shaft bearing. As for the never-sieze, I use grease instead. Never-sieze has grit in it and has no business being applied to a bearing. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Dudes, if you want to discuss bearing failures, go to the "Big, Bad, and Dirty" forum. There are a gazillion posts and lots of theories for the cause. It's reported that Abe Askenazi (Buell engineer) stated at Homecoming this year that the bearing failures on Uly's were caused by water getting past the seals. They developed an improved bearing as a result. Anti-seize (which has powdered metal in it) applied to the axle is NOT intended to lubricate the bearing, only to keep the axle from sticking in the swing arm and the bearing inner races from sticking to the axle. Grease may do OK, but anti-seize will do a better job and is what the factory recommends. |
