| Author | Message | ||
     Tigerbuell |
After extensive BadWeb research I've decided to wrap my headers with black DEI wrap. I will be rotating the engine and removing the headers so I can paint them with the HT silicon paint. Any last minute suggestions? I bought a service manual and I know it says you need to do more than is required but I wanted it mainly for torque specs. I really love this bike. With my flat black scheme those gold pipes aren't working so the black header wrap should blend nicely. Plus I like the race look of wrapped headers. | ||
| Hogs |
Ever thing I read about them is JUST to over lap 1/4 of an inch and for what its worth wrap so the wind say will go with the flow on the edges if ya know what I mean...Not sure this is a biggie but might as well do it while ur at it... | ||
| Tigerbuell |
I am still not sure about the wrap direction. Looks like I will start at the rear cylinder and go toward the collector. For the front pipe I will start at the collector and work toward the front cylinder. I just don't know what to do at the collector (cover with the front pipe's wrap or the rear pipe's wrap) | ||
| Tx05xb12s |
I wrapped mine with black DEI wrap too, but the heat has bleached the wrap white. Guess I got an inferior product. Or is that normal?  | ||
| Tigerbuell |
Did you paint them with the black high temp paint? I called DEI and they said it would frey and look bad on a motorcycle application if you don't paint over them. | ||
| Redponcho |
I used the DEI on mine and I love what it did for the heat on my leg. I wrapped the front one first and then did the rear. I used the rear one to cover the end of the front and continued down to the collector. I did mine on the bike and just covered the engine and parts with alluminum foil to paint it. | ||
| Treadmarks |
If your header does not have the ability to dissipate it's heat, it can fall apart. After 6 months of daily driving with my new stainless steel headers wrapped (on another bike) it crumbled like a baked potato. I had painted and sealed both the header and the wrap. I could not believe that after only 6 month of daily riding that the wrap was the only thing holding it together. Then I found this from centuryperformance.com: Many times I've been asked about, or have commented on the use of header wraps. This issue is a real pet peeve of mine. Good or bad about a product I'll give my opinion based upon direct use and fact. THE FACTS: Header wraps are designed to keep the heat in the header to improve scavenging of the cylinders. Keeping the heat in the header allows the exhaust speed to remain high. (the right idea) There are no header manufacturers that I know of that will warranty their headers if any header wraps are installed on their products. In most cases the header wrap damages the headers beyond repair. (I will explain below) If you run a lean mixture, you "may" see a slim performance gain using header wraps. A rich mixture may show slim to absolutely NO gain in performance. If you do not mind replacing your headers and header gaskets regularly, and you like that ugly look of a wrapped header, go ahead and use the heat wrap. BACKGROUND INFORMATION: In the past, almost all NASCAR and other racing engine builders used the header wraps for the added power gains. But, after having to replace the headers after each race due to the wrap being about the only thing holding the header together, they do not promote the practice any longer! They now utilize the thermal coatings that are chemically and electrically applied to the headers. Those include Airborn, Jet Hot, HPC, and others. Imagine having to replace a $1200.00 plus set of headers after each race weekend! Few but the most financially well-off race teams can afford to do this. But, it is also in the downtime for remaking a custom set of headers. Most custom header makers do not have copies readily available. I believe that the wraps are good to protect various items from heat, but not to hold the heat in the header. For example: you can use the wrapping for the protection of fuel and oil lines, wiring, etc. Cool air needs to be around the header, and insulating it with a wrap to hold exhaust heat in makes the header material temperatures near molten. When you wrap the header you trap the heat in the header, but also in the material that needs to breathe to dissipate heat for it's own survival. Engineers, Metallurgists, and other experts out there will state that there is no way that the material can fail because it can withstand, and it was designed to withstand, the internal temperatures of exhaust gases. TRUE! But, when the header is not allowed to cool so as to dissipate those extreme temperatures that the wrap is controlling, you have now developed a heat absorption that compares to thermal friction which will will continue to gain in temperature beyond the normal exhaust gas temperatures (EGT's). This is the same as with most any insulation. Try this experiment ... launder a load of bath towels and then dry them. Immediately pull them out of the dryer and just toss them in a snug pile on your bed. Now leave them there for a day and then open them. You will find that there is still a considerable amount of heat left in the center towels. This heat, even though the outer towels and bed are normal room temperature have been able to contain their heat. This is a simple thermal insulation test, but with your headers you have an internal heat supply coming from the engine. The heat on the outside portion of the header material is trapped between the warp and the header and will continue to fatigue the header. This build of heat is amplified by the wrap. Towels do not need to breathe, header material does. The EGTs stay the same but the properties of the header material changes in a way of amplifying the temperatures because of the insulation. This action goes against normal laws of thermal dynamics, but this effect is fact, and you have to pull the ears off most engineers before they believe you. This is the trouble with plenty of education, but NO "common sense"! | ||
| Tigerbuell |
Easy spider! It seems many on the board would disagree with your view. In my research, there are many BadWebbers who have had wrapped pipes for years with no ill-effects. | ||
| Liquorbox |
Spider's dead on! Did you know that ALL header manufacturers will void their Warrantee if you wrap them? Read this! http://www.jet-hot.com/?gclid=CO7Kn6bav4oCFRtuSgod KjZTiQ | ||
| Sleez |
what if you jet coat them then wrap them??? | ||
| Treadmarks |
Easy spider! It seems many on the board would disagree with your view. In my research, there are many BadWebbers who have had wrapped pipes for years with no ill-effects. Sorry. Didn't mean to diss anybody.  Just passin on what I learned the hard way, thought maybe it might save someone some grief.  What I meant to say was "Long live header wrap."  Wrap on, baby.  | ||
| Lost_in_ohio |
TX05 I painted mine too...... I have wrapped mine and have run it daily since May 06in all conditions and not experienced any ill effects. I wrapped mine to help get the heat off of me, plus I like the look. My advice....If wrapping or coating the header makes you froggy then have at it. Its your bike. (Message edited by lost_in_ohio on February 21, 2007) | ||
| Lonexb |
i have done both on the 12r. it is "jet hot" coated. been on there for 35k miles. no problems at all. looks as good as the day i got it done.  on the 9r. wrapped header. been on for 11k miles.(2 summers worth of riding.) no problem with the header getting soft.  i have always been warned about wrapping my header and figured i would try on the nine and see what happens. no problems yet.YMMV. brian (Message edited by lonexb on February 21, 2007) | ||
| Cmm213 |
Hey tiger if you are going to take the headers off just have them coated, looks better to me anyways. | ||
| Terribletim |
Ok, I need some info here, 'cause I am considering wrapping mine. I run a stockcar at the local short track here and we wrap our headers, not fully, but we do wrap 'em. As for the Nascar teams, it is not so much to keep the heat in them to maintain air flow but to keep the heat from burning the driver (me) and his feet. Trust me, that floorboard gets hot during a race! I have heard you cant coat a header that has been run, only brand new ones. Is that true? Also, where can you get the coating stuff if you can coat an old one? For those who are wrapping theirs, here's my tip to you. Soak the wrap in a bucket of water, keeps the dust down while wrapping it. The dilemma is that it smokes like crazy till it dries out. | ||
| Lonexb |
i had about 9k miles on the 12r before i had the header coated. brian | ||
| Wardog3187 |
Read this thread - http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/327 77/257917.html?1171536115 | ||
| Terribletim |
Hmm. . .still in doubt I guess. Here's my situation. I am putting the full body kit from Hal's on mine and am looking for a way to decrease any heat from inside there that I can. It seems to get hot on the inside of my thigh during summertime. I don't want to compound the problem with the body kit, plus I would like to decrease the heat on my leg. isn't the VHT paint just for looks? Does it reduce heat coming off the part? | ||
| Tx05xb12s |
I must have missed the, "Paint the header wrap" portion of the instructions somewhere. I just wrapped them up and rode it. I was wondering why my wrap turned white and I've seen other bikes where it stayed black. I think it's more for looks than any real or effective power gains on our bikes. I didn't notice any mindboggling power gains. I just thought it added to the appeal of the bike. I would like to jethot the pipes, but haven't felt like tackling turning the engine to get the headers off. This was an easy compromise I was able to do with the headers mounted. I'm sure I'll get around to taking the headers off and having them coated eventually. Thanks for the string guys. I was wondering what everyone's experience had been with this too. | ||
| Hogs |
I have 18,000 miles now on wrapped headers on a 04 xb12R no plms.... MAybe on a " Drag Car steel HEaders " Maybe that will be another plm... | ||
| Jwhite601 |
I agree with Cmm213, the coating looks way cleaner. I've had the headers on my 5.0 wrapped for about 8 years now. I'll never wrap another set. The only real gain that i saw, was the ability to pull my plugs after each round and not get burned by the header.  It would guard against the dreaded melted leg syndrome that many Buellers suffer. I had always been told that they absorb water and will rust a cheap set, wasn't aware of the scientific implications indicated by above post  I got a feeling mine may crumble in my hands when i remove them. | ||
| Tx05xb12s |
On the water issue, I do crank my bike and run it for a few minutes to dry out the header wrap each time I wash it, and I don't put it away in the garage wet after riding in the rain (just in case). | ||
| Tigerbuell |
Lonexb, How did you wrap your pipes on the 9R. What direction did you go on each pipe? I like how you kept each pipe individually wrapped all the way down to the collector? Which pipe's wrap did you continue with over the collector area? Thanks | ||
| Thansesxb9rs |
I wrapped mine, had it on for two years. Took it off the bike and it was still a very solid unit. Only thing I had to maintain when they where wrapped was I had to respray them about every 3 months, but it is very easy to do even with the pipe on the bike. I have also heard that the wrap will damage you header but have not experianced it. Put close to 20k on the bike with wrapped headers without a problem, maybe the stainless helps the headers hold up better then just a thin steal header would like I think most car headers are. If you like the wrapped look just take your time and do it right, I never had a problem. | ||
| Thansesxb9rs |
Tx05 I can tell you didn't use the silicon spray just by looking at your headers, they look dry not like a cast. When you spray your wrap it turns into a cast like substance and is very hard but you have to keep up on it or it will fade and fall apart. Can't really tell when you look at my profile pic but that is after two years on the bike and I just resprayed every 3 or 4 months when they looked like they needed it. (Message edited by thansesxb9rs on February 21, 2007) | ||
| Glitch |
I wrapped my headers three years ago. I've had to re-wrap them yearly. No damage to the headers what so ever. This is riding in all weather conditions, minus ice, and snow, 'cause we ain't got none of that here. | ||
| Terribletim |
And you guys had to rotate the engine forward to get the header off right? How hard is it? Can it be done with my standard tools in my garage? Do I need any special pullers or anything? I gotta pull the thing apart to do the body kit, so now is the time. | ||
| Tigerbuell |
Terribletim, The engine rotation is easy. Just research BadWeb and you will see some decent write ups. You will have to fill in the blanks with some common sense. Basically, After the muffler is off 1. Remove the breather box top and bottom 2. Remove the 2 bolts from the coil (under the breather) but no need to remove the coil. It just needs to be free to move some as the engine goes down 3. Disconnect the lateral motor mount under the breather box on top of the motor 4. Remove the left and right air duct plastic 5. Loosen the rear axle (drive belt) and remove the idler pulley 6. Remove the rear lateral motor mount above the right foot peg 7. Remove the front engine cage (3 bolts) and the front lateral motor mount that connects the cage to the motor. 8. At this point you are ready to lower the engine so put a jack under the crankcase and lift up until the engine is supported. 9. Remove the 'jesus' bolt in the front of the motor under the steering head and lower the jack very slowly watching for anything pulling or binding. MAKE SURE THE CLUTCH CABLE IS PULLED TO THE SIDE SO IT DOES NOT GET PULLED AS THE ENGINE LOWERS! 10. You need to lower the motor about 6 inches to easily remove the header. Hope that helps. I may have left a couple steps out but just pay attention and you'll be fine. |
