| Author | Message | ||
     Ride365 |
Anyone have the Micron system on their xb12? I read the shootout and first off, MAJOR PROPS to American Sportbike, what an awesome job they did! The Micron is the most expensive as far as I can remember, however it did seem to have a very even power curve, and according to their test, it seemed easily mapped. They state that it has a nice low rumble at idle, and a I believe they put it as a "tearing" sound as the rpm's climb! I want a nice loud exhaust without sacrificing power, or at least not more than a couple hp/lbs of torque, and the Micron came out pretty nice. The D&D is nice lookin, and supposed to be nice and loud, but damn power loss on the xb12 (I didn't read the xb9 review or dynos) is ridiculous as far as I'm concerned... Sure would like to hear from someone who's heard both in person, if possible... Where's the DB's read on both? Anyone input would be great! Thanks folks! | ||
| Diablobrian |
If you want a good performing muffler with attention getting volume do yourself a favor and consider the Drummer (any variation), or the Jardine (any variation) They both perform well and are both a good deal less expensive than the Micron pipe. Of course you don't get the full system, but on the other hand you don't have to drop the motor to install either one of them. (Less down time) I have a Jardine on my bike right now and have no problem with people not hearing me coming. In fact I have the quiet insert for long trips to keep the noise down. It's a nice option if you'll be coming home late and don't want to wake up the neighborhood too. I have heard nothing but rave reviews for Kevin Drum's handiwork. www.kdfab.com If my Jardine dies I'm going to be giving Kevin a call myself. The D&D is a loud pipe, but I agree with you, just loud isn't enough, it has to perform or it's just a waste of time. Tim (No_Rice) had a D&D on his bike for about a week before taking it off to install a Drummer SS because the D&D had large holes in it's performance. 'nuf said.  | ||
| Bads1 |
They are all great pipes depending on what you want. I had the Drummer for sometime and it was great. Then I went to the D@D because i did want the volume the pipe comes on in the middle very heavy. Its the loudest of the bunch and I am starting to grow tired of the noise on longer rides. I also have the factory race pipe on a XB9S and it performs well and the noise level is a treat to me at times. Theres really know bad choice some are top end pipes some are mid range pipes some are doing well across the board. Where do you ride the most in the RPM's?? Many factors to look at. | ||
| Ride365 |
Bads1 - Is the loss of power low and high range rpm's incredibly noticeable, I mean does it give you that heart-sinking feeling that you get when you've mod'd something for looks/sound only to find that the power has been severely sacrificed? Just curious, thanks man! | ||
| Tbowdre |
you have to drop the motor to install the micron???? | ||
| Indy_bueller |
You have to partially drop it. This involves disconnecting the front of the motor from the frame and "rotating" it down until you can reach the rear header bolts. You can't get the rear header off/on without doing that. | ||
| Rr_eater |
I have/do own both the D&D and the Micron The D&D has the sound personality of a pissed off bulldog, loud and mean, no BS. The Micron has the character of civility, with brute power mentality. It is loud at full song, but very refined when cruising. It is hard to compare the two heads up, as they both have their place when tuned properly. Everyone downplays the "holes" in the D&D, but it is BS! If your package is tuned properly, like mine was, compliments of Chris Rivas (yes the Buell weilding drag racer), it has an excellent power curve through the midrange, with a slight sacrifice up top. The Micro, tuned compliments of Al at American Sport Bike, has all the pleasures and refinement you would expect of a product in it's catergory. Yes, it does require rotating the motor, though that is not as difficult as it sounds. Both are great, just each has its purpose and advantages. Bruce | ||
| Samiam |
Even though you have to drop the motor for the Micron install, it is pretty much straightforward. Instructions included are easily followed. Installation for me took 4-5 hours. Well worth the money and effort. Now I'm just waiting for the directlink to come in the mail so i can stop being so lean. Sam | ||
| Ride365 |
So it sounds like the D&D is loud even when cruising? And the Micron, now is it quiet when cruising, or just not quite as loud? The D&D just looked sort of lame for peak power on the American Sportbike Dyno runs, nearly 10hp less than the Micron, of course suffering equally in the torque category... I'm near deaf anyways so loud doesn't bother me one bit, the louder the better, but that loss in power sort of shot down my woody over the prospect of gettin the D&D... | ||
| Cochise |
I am gonna tell you straight up..Buy the Micron, you won't be disappointed, I promise. I love mine. (Message edited by cochise on July 03, 2006) | ||
| Oilrigpilot |
Yes, ditto... Cochise is right. I bought and installed the Micron on my 12Scg. Look, this was a VERY big deal for me on a mechanical level. I have never even attempted anything like this before. But, Al @ American Sport Bike coaxed me into it. By explaining everything to me, before I bought it, he helped me and gave me the confidence I needed to "tear" into my BRAND NEW bike. It's not that hard at all, really! At the same time I had ordered the Airbox kit and "cheese-grater" elimn. kit from Al too. All done in one day. Oh, I forgot the barend mirrors, too. SO, I am totally happy with my bike. Sound, Performance. My buddy ordered a Buell pipe off of Ebay and we put his on a firebolt 9. Not as initimdating by any means, but still sounds good. But for all out performance send your ECM to Al @ American Sport Bike and have him remap (match) it to the Micron... the things a monster now. The growl is just darn worth the money!!!!! Express mail it - he'll have it back to you in short order. Thanks again Al. | ||
| Indy_bueller |
Can I get an AMEN from the congregation?  Al definately has the Direct Link figured out. He is "Das Mann". | ||
| No_rice |
if a chart of my bike still existed i could show you that the drummer when fully tuned is not much off of the micron 2-3 horse down, but is 2-3 horse above in torque. now i realize mine is a 9, but 92.8 and 72.4 on the same dyno that did the shootout testing aint to bad. and Al would have been able to tweek it alittle more had we not run out of time about 2 hours to early. i love my drummer. it sounds healthy, and the thing will pull 2 people in 5th gear from 1500 up to redline and not miss a beat. why do i even need a shifter, lol | ||
| Ride365 |
Hahaha! Nice No_Rice, nice! It's great to have choices sometimes but damnit it's freagin hard to decide! Al has answered a bunch of questions for me via email and he really likes the Micron too, puttin it on his bike... Now I guess you can argue 2-3hp but on somethin that's around 100hp thats around 2-3%, a big enough increase that some folks spend $$$ to get... I'm liking that Micron more and more the more I look at those those dyno's side by side, just a really overall good exhaust, almost a straight line diagonal across the page, torque doesn't drop much out of the mid-range too, just barely below 85lbs at it's worst spots... Guess the ol' saying you get what you pay for holds pretty true here... All seamingly marginal differences, but aren't most gains marginal? They all add up... | ||
| Mr_cuell |
Funny we're still having these threads after the shootout, but I'll chip in with another thumbs up for the Micron. I hadn't really ever worked on a Buell before but got the motor down, pipe wrapped and wired and back up in place in about 3 1/2 hours. I had some good music going and a few cold ones, but following the manual precisely made it a relatively uneventful experience. It costs a few bucks, but it really leaves nothing on the table. I felt like I could go part way with another brand, and get almost the same performance, or just do it once and be done with it. Sound is good enough to make people smile, but not so good it makes people frown. Not pissing others (neighbors) off is becoming more and more important these days I think (maybe I'm just getting older) And yes Al is The Man. He 'splained the whole "map" thing to me inside and out, on his dime. All I bought from him was the airbox kit and the key and he treated me like he was building me a race bike - | ||
| Pipefittermike |
I got my micron from Al as well, if possible do as I did and upgrade to the ceramic coated system. Al is the man, after a little time tuning he had mine screaming. Can't say enough good things about him. Most importantly, don't be intimidated by tilting the motor. It's not that big of a deal and doesn't take as long as it sounds. The manual makes it more complicated than it needs to be, I did mine with the 06 belt upgrade, and a few other items all in the same day. That included time to tune the ecm. | ||
| Jetbuilder |
I have the Micron and I sent my ECM to Al for a remap. This thing brings the term "Thunder Bike" to a reality no shit if i start my bike up at work everyone inside thinks it is about to rain outside. And boy does this thing pull! It takes off like a rocket from 3500 RPM on. However it does seem like the power is a bit more consistent now. this thing rocks! Red | ||
| Al_lighton |
Thanks for the props, guys. But remember, the exhaust shootout wasn't just American Sport Bike, it was Kevin, Terry, Warren, Craig, Troy, Doug, and others. I wrote the test report, but lots of others worked hard and spent their money to make it happen. Everyone that has a remapped ECM from me for the XB12/micron, I have some small but good updates to the map. There are a few cells in the AFV learn mode that I've been able to tweak a little bit better now that I have the ability to read the AFV at the shop. The same day that we installed the Micron on Pipefittermike's XB9, one of our local customers with the Micron/map combo spent an hour with me fine tuning the Accel table a little as well. And I've adjusted the idle tables slightly. None of the updates were huge changes, just some drivability improvements. I was seeing the AFV sitting in the 94-97 range (I'm at sea level) typically, and now I've got it sitting right at 100 after several test rides across several RPMs. When we first did the map, during the winter months, it was also at 100 the few times I was able to check it, but it appears that the warmer weather pulls the AFV down a little. And while I didn't have any major problems with the old map, I did get the occasional cough during warmup that seems to be gone now. Contact me and we'll talk about how to get the improved map into your ECM. No charge, you've already paid for it, but if you only bought the key and not the SW, the only way to get the map in is to send me the ECM. It isn't an emergency fix or anything, so you could schedule it around a vacation or other time that you know the bike will be down. Pipefittermike, I'd sure like a chance to read your AFV a few more times. We didn't have a chance to re-do the circuit test as many times as I would have liked after those last inputs the day we tweaked it. I think your ECM is pretty darn close, but I'd sure like to verify it with a few circuits some saturday soon. What does the 15th look like for you? For the few of you that have the XB9 micron map, I'll be able to give you similar updates after I've done that verification with Mike. I could give it to you now, but it isn't 100% tested. Al (Message edited by al_lighton on July 04, 2006) | ||
| Ride365 |
ALL HAIL MASTER AL AND HIS MIGHTY STREETFIGHTER NINJA TUNING SKILLS!!!  | ||
| Buelldyno_guy |
My XB12X with a Micron and American Sport Bike Open Airbox still makes 100 RWHP, but I did "but have to lower the front of the motor to install" I can rotate the motor and change the header pipe in less than 30 min. If you want a full system get a full system, even at $800 the Micron still beats the Ti cost of $1300. If you want a slip on the Shoot-out shows how they all performed and as long as you are informed I don't see how you can make a bad decision. ... Terry | ||
| Al_lighton |
What Terry said... And lest anyone forget, all these maps are created by Terry (Buelldyno_guy), not me. I'm just fine tuning them now that we can read AFV. Terry and I have spent a lot of time together figuring out how this ECM does it's thing, and how to tune it with DL. We think we have it pretty well nailed, but with the new version of DL, I'm hoping that we can get the closed loop domain mapping even closer right off the dyno, prior to street tuning for drivability and minimal AFV skew. Al | ||
| Ride365 |
ALL HAIL MASTER TERRY AND HIS MIGHTY STREETFIGHTER NINJA TUNING SKILLS TOO!!!  | ||
| Hogs |
Buelldyno_guy I can rotate the motor and change the header pipe in less than 30 min.. You must be leaving something out of this statement , As I have done it a few times myself now...AND in NO way CAn I do it in 30 mins...or NOT even CLOSE to that..?? Whats up with that?? | ||
| Buelldyno_guy |
Between the race bike and all the Buell dyno work I do. I have it down to the muffler, eight airbox cover screws, three front support Allen screws, three tie bolts and the front mount bolt. I have a Snap-on 1/4 drive flex socket just for the rear header bolt. ... (No lines, no wires, no cables.) ... What I am getting at is that you do not have to "Drop The Motor." ... Terry | ||
| Diablobrian |
Sorry I mis-stated that, rotating the motor vs dropping the motor. What I meant was for the average Buell owner rotating the motor is a major ordeal and something that will take the average guy doing it the first time considerably more than 30 minutes. We had the motor completely out of the bike at daytona in less than 30 minutes, but that's a whole different deal. | ||
| Jmor03 |
About time somebody said it can be done without rotating the motor. I was told it can be done that way by someone who works on buell racebikes. That’s the way they do it also!I did it that way with no problems encountered other getting the O2 sensor tight was a little tricky. | ||
| Buelldyno_guy |
The flex socket is the answer, but race bikes do not use an 02 sensor, so I am not too sure you can do it with one installed. ... Terry |
