| Author | Message | ||
     Xb9 |
When I'm really pushing my XB through the turns, leaning forward right on the air box, it feels like I'm right on top of the front wheel. When I first started riding the bike, it took some getting used to. The more I rode it and got comfortable with it, it became apparent that this contributes to giving you excellent feedback and sense to how the bike is steering. Look at the geometry of a 250 GP bike. That is what the XB geometry is. I've never ridden a bike with better "front end feedback"; you can feel exactly what the front wheel is doing, how the traction is. It does give a FEELING of heavy weight bias to the front, but I think it is an allusion due to the short trail and steep steering head angle. The rear has always stayed well planted. Under HEAVY braking is the only time I've had the rear wheel get unsettled - when it's coming off the damn ground! And even then it is predictable. You can analyze it all you want, but you have to ride it HARD in the corners to feel it at its best! | ||
| Ray_Maines |
FWIW:  | ||
| Spike |
What's the story on setup fees? Every dealer I've talked to about new Firebolts adds a setup fee and every one charges a different amount. Is the setup fee legit? If so, how much should it cost me? Thanks, Mike L. | ||
| Chainsaw |
Set up Fee: Freight / Set -Up $315.05 Prep Fee $189.95 Subtotal $10,500 (JUN 02) Sun Harley Davidson / Buell Thornton, Colorado | ||
| Blake |
That is how a dealer gets more of your money. | ||
| Paroyboy |
03 Firebolt Bike: 9,995 Prep: 250 freight 180 Total 10,425 Battlefield HD Gettysburg PA June 02 Alot better than my 02 Electra Glide Classic.. $240 for freight and $525 for dealer prep! Laugermans HD York Sept 01 | ||
| Blake |
I bought a DVD/CD player today. If the salesman had tried to tack on prep and freight above and beyond the list price, I'd have walked out the door. I suggest the same is due any motorcycle dealer trying to pull a similar scam. MSRP means "Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price". That suggested price includes provisions for freight and dealer prep. Many of the UJM's are manufactured in Japan. Imagine if they charged for that freight in addition to the MSRP.  | ||
| Rockbiter1 |
Ok, quick math lesson: Finding the CG (Center of Gravity) 1)weight bike at front axle = FAW (Front Axle Weight) 2)weight bike at rear axle = RAW (Rear Axle Weight) 3)measure from front end (forward edge of tire)to front axle = A1 (Arm of front axle) 4)measure from front end to rear axle= A2 (Arm of rear axle) now the math part: FAW * A1 = M1 RAW * A2 = M2 Add FAW + RAW to get GVW (Gross Vehicle Weight) FAW + RAW = GVW (M1 + M2)/GVW = CB in inches FFE(From Front End) So, for a hypothetical bike(LOOSELY based on the XB9, I do not have real measurements to work from), we get the following measurements: FAW= 250lbs RAW= 200lbs A1 (distance from front edge to center of front axle) = 18in A2 (distance from front edge to center of rear axle) = 70in step 1: 250 * 18 = M1(4500) step 2: 200 * 70 = M2(14000) setp 3: FAW(250) + RAW (200)= GVW(450lbs) step 4: M1(4500) + M2(14000)= M3(18500) step 5: M3(18500) / GVW (450) = CB 41(center of balance, in inches from front end) Measure 41 inches from front edge, and that is the center of balance. Of course, adding a rider would change the axle weights, so you would have to start all over again  | ||
| Mikep |
Try weighing your own: 1. Put the front wheel on your trusty bathroom scale, sit on the bike in a normal fashion, have spouse hold things vertical. Record front weight. 2. Put the rear wheel on same scale, sit on bike normally, have spouse keep you upright. Record rear weight. 3. The weight on the front is the weight on the front. The weight on the rear is the weight on the rear. The total is the total. Figure percentages from there. mikep | ||
| Anonymouse1940 |
My wife gets mad at me when I try to take the bike into the bathroom.  | ||
| Court |
>>>>My wife gets mad at me when I try to take the bike into the bathroom. But loves it when you ask her to hold your thing vertical? | ||
| Anonymouse1940 |
Oh I could answer that with one fine comeback, but this is not the R-17 section so I think I will go acquire some coffee and simply reminisce about the time I got the bike all the way into the bedroom. The bedroom did have an exterior door so it is not like I had to negotiate a hallway or anything. I did get a little oil on the sheets though, but they were ready for the laundry already. Those little XBs are kind of cute. | ||
| Fasteddieb |
Blake, re: "That suggested price includes provisions for freight and dealer prep." I used to think so too, and even argued with a Ford dealer about adding some "set-up" to an invoice, but various auto sites set me straight. You're probably right on the freight, though. From the Buell site, for instance: MANUFACTURER'S SUGGESTED RETAIL PRICING (U.S. ONLY) $9,995 is U.S. (except CA) price only Prices listed exclude set-up, taxes, title and licensing, and are subject to change. Dealer prices may vary. Additional California fees required. See your dealer for details. | ||
| Sparky |
When I first got my Firebolt all I thought it needed was taller bars and lowered footpegs since I'm more into the Sport Touring thing than Pure Sport. Well, I've got the Lightning footpegs, saddle, tank & tail bags, ASB's 4" taller windscreen & my eye on their Ventura luggage system. All that is missing is... taller bars. I'm kinda disappointed that nobody's making them yet. I've waited for ASB's riser adapters but still I can't buy them. How hard would it be to make something simple like "Z-bars", custom handlebars that fit the stock location but raise the controls a couple of inches? Maybe they wouldn't look too cool, but hey, I put the funky Blast/S3T handlebar on my S3 and it works just fine for Sport Touring. Anybody else got ideas for adapting taller handlebars? Heli-bars? ZX-6 clip ons? Sparky | ||
| Captainplanet |
Sparky, This was in a posting from Tat on October 14. As for the handle bar risers, at this point in time, there seems to be too many costly challenges to overcome. We have, however, found one way-and that would be to complete an entire top triple tree. If you own a Firebolt and need handle bar risers and would be interested in a new triple tree set up, please contact us. Doesn't sound to me like the riser on the ASB web page is going to happen. I would really like a bit of rise, just enough so I could sit up straight with one hand on the bar at stop lights. | ||
| Psychobueller |
I don't see why someone couldn't design a handlebar tube that bends upward coming out of the triple clamp. It looks like the tube portion of the bars just screw into the triple clamp. Then again, I need directions on how to pound nails, so don't take my word for it. | ||
| Henrik |
I've looked at these Clip-on Risers for the SV650. Haven't tried them, or heard any feedback either so, Buyer Beware. It should be possible to just get the stubby piece of bar and the riser itself and then use the stock bars. That's what I'm looking to do for the SV - I've got Woodcraft clip-ons. Henrik | ||
| Blake |
Rockbiter, Great math.  Though eighteen inches seems awfully large for the radius of the front tire. That would put the diameter at three feet. Here's another way... Measure from front axle instead of from front of front tire. You can actually sum moments about any point; summing about one of the axles makes the moment arm zero and so eliminates one of the calculations needed. Finding the CM (Center of Mass) Given: XB9R gross vehicle weight (GVW) is 455 LB with a weight bias of 52%/48% (front/rear) and wheelbase (WB) of 52" Find Front and Rear Axle Weights (FAW and RAW) FAW = 0.52*GVW = 0.52*455 LB = 236.6 LB RAW = 0.48*GVW = 0.48*455 LB = 218.4 LB Calculate moment (M) about front axle M = RAW * WB = 218.4 LB * 52" = 11,357 LB-IN CM = M/GVW = 11,357 LB-IN / 455 LB = 25.0" aft of front axle. Of course, knowing the weight bias, there is a much easier way... CM = 48% * 52" = 25.0" If you want to use actual weights, be sure to elevate the wheel not being weighed to match the height of the one that is being weighed. | ||
| Ray_Maines |
 In the same December 2002, Cycle World that Don Canet wrote such a glowing article about the new Buell XB9S Lightning is a most interesting article by none other than Steve Anderson entitled VINCENT REBORN. May I quote a few lines from that article. “Bernard Li, … aims to build his first Vincent around Honda’s most advanced Superbike engine, and to house it in a sophisticated chassis that harks back to the real-world functionality of the original Black Shadow. “Two prototype Vincents tell where Li has come from, and where he hopes to go. The first built was a machine that uses an updated version of the original Vincent V-Twin in a modern chassis. … the new/old engine displaces 1200cc’s, … and represents a slight modernization of Phil Irving’s archtypical 50-degree V-Twin. The bike looks great, but according to Li, it wasn’t capable of competing in today’s world. This is the interesting part… “ ‘The engine was just too old a design to give the level of performance today’s rider expects. It’s like a ’57 Chevrolet BelAir. The BelAir looks cool but when you go to drive one… … they drive like crap by today’s standards,’ ” The engine is too old a design to give today’s rider the level of performance he expects Li says. It’s like a ’57 Chev, looks cool but drives like crap he says. He’s telling you an air cooled, 1200 cc, push rod V-Twin doesn’t perform to the standard current customers expect. I suppose it depends which side of the Buell fence you fall on but he just may be right. The brand new super refined and highly developed V-Twin in the XB bikes is about as good as such an engine is going to get and yet I’d say a majority of the BadWeB thinks the Firebolt is underpowered. | ||
| Rockbiter1 |
Blake I DID put in a disclaimer about measurements I used the method the US Air Force uses to find the CB of all rolling stock (anything with wheels). For shipping things in aircraft (something the Air Force does quite a bit), the correct center of balance is critical for proper placement in the cargo bay. Measuring from the front end is the simplist way (remember, this IS the military we are talking about here) to standardize measurements. Also, a bike with a rider on it will not have a true 52/48 split, so it is an unreliable way to figure the CB just my 1.9 cents | ||
| Blake |
Rbiter, I follow. For cargo loads, you want to know the distance of CB from frontmost point. Ray, "The brand new super refined and highly developed V-Twin in the XB bikes is about as good as such an engine is going to get..." How can you possibly say that? Every time Buell has come out with a new engine the HP/cc has climbed significantly. Your thinking seems pretty shortsighted based on recent history. Simply bump the XB up to 1.2L and you have a 90+ RWHP bike, closer to 100 RWHP with the race kit. Figure out how to quiet things down some, bump compression, tighten up tolerances and bump up materials quality... who knows what the limit might be. | ||
| Reepicheep |
I read the article about the Vincent. I think the reason they wanted a "class leading performance" engine was to try and stay true to the Vincent tradition. Basically, it looks like this thing is targeted as a competitor to the VRrod. Looks like there is a new emerging class of "power cruisers" (if they actually make it to production), that will be the VRod, the VMax (badly out of date but still a player), the Vincent, and the Suzuki B-King. Personally, I think Buell is not and has never been about "class leading engine performance". Maybe "class leading handling", though I think they ended up being that by accident on their quest towards their actual goal. I think Buell has been, and will continue to be, about "class leading fun" for a sporting bike for street use. That's why they choose a good overall torque curve over simply peak power. That's why they but big engines in narrow bikes with a short wheelbase and wide bars. That's why they have a snorting growling shaking delightfully musical aircooled pushrod twin. Thats why they perform REALLY WELL between 0 and 90 MPH. That's Buells legacy. Thats why I hope to never be without one. God bless the racers proving that Buells, a bike designed to be about maximum fun on the street, can be reconfigured and stretched to perform as competitive racers. I would love to watch them and root for them. But the next bike I buy (*cough*xb9s*cough*) will be like the last bike I bought, a bike designed to be as much fun as possible on the street. I don't have a lot of interest in a bike designed for racing that can be / has been adapted for fun street use. But why would I, buying a street bike, buy something that has been "compromised" to be a good track bike? I don't race. If I ever do a track day, it'll be about fun, not winning a race. Nothing wrong with race bikes adapted for the street, and nothing wrong with people that want them. But it ain't me, and LOTS of companies are building these types of bikes, and only one company is building the bikes I want. Hopefully people (*cough*Jose'*cough) won't turn Buell into yet another company adapting race bikes for street use. That would leave me buying a Honda, which are fine bikes and probably the second best choice for "bikes designed for the most fun street bikes", but they fail to move me emotionally, they seem overly homogonized and normalized and sanitized and killed by comittee. The Buells feel like a work of genius executed by a group with a vision. Something to get excited about. The Honda's feel like a great bike to ride when the Buell's broken, or while you are looking for the bike that you fall in love with (cough*Ferris*cough). Bill "seem to be coming down with a cold " | ||
| José_Quiñones |
 The new Vincent has a 62 inch wheelbase using the 90 degree RC51 V-Twin When I read the article I realized something. Notice where things are placed on this bike, Gas tank under the seat, air intake where the gas tank typically is, and they even managed to put the monoshock under the seat. Haven't we all seen a drawing of something very similar to this recently? How much shorter do you think this bike would be with a certain 60 degree engine in it instead? | ||
| Turnagain |
updated our XB9R Firebolt page last night with pictures taken by others & myself. Think you'll also see *cough*José*cough* astride one.  | ||
| José_Quiñones |
nice job Steve! | ||
| X1glider |
Who's that guy with the black and blue Vanson Buell jacket? Tell him to get on the balls of his feet before he snags his toes and wipes out! You guys have a nice site. JQ, are you relinquishing your power in the club since you bought an SV? Any tip to help us in Houston get started? The dealer is enthusiastic enough but just doesn't have his paperwork in to get the club started yet. | ||
| Spiderman |
If you need I can Fax you over a dealer application. Give me a call at the dealer if you need on 800-234-7285 Tony | ||
| Sparky |
I've seen Tat's handlebar risers & the prototypes are really nice billet machined pieces. Perhaps their producibility would be more feasible as an investment casting rather than billet machined. Opinions? Henrik, those Clip-on risers look promising. They'll give the 9R bars a lift with fore & aft adjustment but not back to stock position like with the SV650 clip-ons. Oh well, no biggie. If you get those, I'd like your opinion on them. Sparky | ||
| S320002 |
"How much shorter do you think this bike would be with a certain 60 degree engine in it instead?" If you measure the distance from the back of the back head to the front of the front head on both engines you might be surprised. Remember Honda uses the same engine in a sportbike which has a much shorter wheelbase. Greg | ||
| X1glider |
Thanx Spidy, the dealer has the app but I just don't know what the hold up is. I need to talk to Archer about it. There's a HOG meeting there Sunday we're supposed to attend and do some talking. Don't know if I'll be there tho. Got a track day to attend. |
