| Author | Message | ||
     Ralf |
I read this: "With a Buell you take all your gear to your bike, turn the key on. With the key in the on position, use your index finger, push the start button. STAY OFF THE THROTTLE. Put your gear on. After gear is on, ride away, for a couple of miles,at least, take it easy, then ride the stuffing out of it." NOT on MY bike: You take your hand off the bloody throttle and you will be restarting the bike for at least two or three minutes before it will idle on its own. When it will idle on its own it will die if you leave it idle long enough to put your gear on. Acts like my old cars with the idle mix a little too rich, trying to foul the plugs. Tells me idle is RICH. But the low rpm stutter and sneeze that I get once I'm riding seems like a LEAN condition. Just like the dreaded "Keihin Cough" on carbed Harleys. Are these the symptom of an incorrect TPS setting? Next question(s): I have read that the sag in power below 3000 with race kit is due to RICH condition but I haven't been able to find a good dyno run that shows whether the race kit is lean or rich. If its lean as I suspect I'd buy a Techlusion. If its rich would it help to open up the air box on my XB12 which I've seen highly recommended as a cure for the XB9 with race kit? I absolutely dread taking this thing to a dealer. The dealer that sold it new and installed the race kit for the previous owner told him this was normal when he had to take it in after he fouled the plugs. Is there any way I can check the TPS setting myself? Advice, comments, rude remarks all appreciated... Ralfy | ||
| Cataract2 |
Simple question, what does your bike idle at after warming up? It should idle at 1050-1150 rpm. That could cause your starting problem. This picture was ripped off Kevins site (hope your ok with this Kevin, best example of the race kit's power band I have on hand.)  This should give you a good example of the race kit's power band. (Message edited by cataract2 on November 25, 2005) | ||
| Ralf |
Thanks, Idle is only 1000. I haven't bought a manual yet to figure out how to raise the idle. Will try that ASAP. It starts fine, it just won't idle once it starts without continuous attention of the wrist for a couple minutes. Ralf | ||
| Fullpower |
set your idle at 1100. that should help. if the dealer were truly incompetent, they may have failed to reset the TPS value into the race ECM, you could easily re-install the stock ECM untill such time as you are able to find a capable party to properly set the race ECM. | ||
| Fullpower |
did you read the owners manual? you may find some helpul hints in there, regarding tire pressures, suspension settings, fluid capacities,and idle speed adjustment. | ||
| Pwnzor |
Ralf, in between the air scoop and the cylinder is a flexible shaft with a knob on the end, that is your idle adjustment. | ||
| Fullpower |
use a 3/16 allen wrench to turn the flexible adjuster cable. | ||
| Ralf |
Thanks guys. I've only had the bike a couple of weeks, and I don't have the owners manual. I will crank up the idle now that I know where to look. I really want to check the suspension settings too so a manual is a must do. I did the Mobil 1 filter and fluids change and found tire pressure data online. | ||
| Cataract2 |
Ralf, DO NOT, I REPEAT DO NOT ADJUST YOUR IDLE UNTIL YOU WARM THE BIKE UP!!! Otherwise you could set your idle to high and then we'll have another post about how your bike hangs before returning to idle. Ride your bike for about 10-15 minutes to warm it up good and then, while it's running, adjust your idle. While your adjusting it, blip the throttle a few times to recheck it. I set mine right around 1050-1100. | ||
| Daves |
Call me if you need help with the suspension settings. 1-866-757-1651 ask for Dave in the sales dept | ||
| Perry |
I have the same problem with idling cold after getting the race kit installed (just this week!). I had the stock setup for a year, and it NEVER had a problem idling no matter how cold it was when starting. I turned the idle up some, but then it does indeed idle a bit fast when warm and not want to come down quickly. So does everyone have this problem? I don't want to rev the engine too much when it's cold, but if I don't it will die every time. | ||
| Cataract2 |
Perry, does it hang at 1500-2000 rpm before coming down or is it just slow in coming down but doesn't hang? If it hangs that means your idle is set a tad bit to high and you'll have to adjust it. If not, your ok. | ||
| Opto |
Are these the symptoms of an incorrect TPS setting? Yes, I would take it to the same or a different dealer and get a TPS reset. Then go from there. Tell them what the bike's doing wrong so they understand why you want it done. It's apparently easy for some techs to get the TPS setting wrong, and it's a real critical setting to get right to let the bike run happy. | ||
| Neutron21 |
opto its not easy to get the TPS wrong its hard. with the dealer software its as easy as pie to get the TPS set right, its practically idiot proof. you are incorrect with your comment | ||
| Dana P. |
Is he??? Its happened plenty. | ||
| Neutron21 |
thats simple dana P they my friend are simply idiots! | ||
| Court |
>>>its practically idiot proof. I see you haven't met OUR idiots! | ||
| Rock |
interesting thread...my scooter (2000 X1 with race kit) has a slightly different starting drill--from cold, I crack the throttle, when engine starts, I hold RPM at 1100~1200 for 3 or 4 seconds, then put on the gear; never any problems using this technique--now, my bud in Oklahoma has a 2000 millenium with the race kit--no throttle required from cold; it doesn't stall. Both machines are set to 1100 RPM hot idle. No two bikes are exactly the same, I guess! | ||
| Ralf |
Update: It's cold out, maybe 34 degrees. But I tried it anyway. I had bumped the idle knob before reading the warning not to (thanks anyway Cataract) and it did seem to help, I had to blip it a couple of times but I actually went inside and put on a warmer shirt without it dying. Still only 1000 rpm, so I bumped it to about 1100 after a good 15 minute ride. Each time I bumped the idle I swear it ran better. It is touchy, as now the idle does take longer to come down, about 3 seconds from 2000 rpm, about 5 seconds from 3000. Thanks to all. I still get an occasional cough off idle, again similar to the Keihin problem so I will get the TPS set "professionally" next spring. I could have lived with it before, it is better now. Should be 45 or 50 degrees in another hour, I'm going to ride.  ralfy | ||
| Cmm213 |
Hey Ralf my bike does the same thing, sometimes it does it, sometimes it dont. I am going to find the problem before next season. Also my battery was not up to par. I am going to get the diagnostic program from american sport bike and really look into it this winter, plus new battery, magnecor wires and good plugs. I have heard of this happening a lot lately after installing the race ecm? Maybe I will put the stock back in and get the rapid bike program. | ||
| Cataract2 |
Ralf, does it continue to go down from 2K-3K or does it stop for a second before returning? | ||
| Ralf |
Hi, I got about 80 miles in today, just now thawing out. Cataract2, when it is sluggish to return to idle it doesn't pause, it is just slow. If it pauses what does that tell you? I experimented with the idle some more as I rode today. I was surprised by how sensitive it is to idle adjustment. There is a definite improvement in how it behaves lugging around at 2-2500 if the idle is stepped up (to about 1100) but the engine is slow to return to idle. It also seemed to lift the front end up a lot more with the idle up, but that may just be me getting used to how hard I can push it, or the cold air. I have it at a happy in between spot, where it runs OK and the idle comes down in a couple seconds. I'm guessing 1050, just above the thousand mark on the tach, but no daylight between the wide part of the needle and the mark. Cold start problems are apparently gone and I get good response all the time from 2500 up, not bad from 2000, so I think I have the original issue fixed. Thanks again. I'm ready to try the insulation blanket and open up the air box, my own version of the "poor man's FAST". Any concerns doing this with the race kit? Will it help? Hurt? Or not worth the trouble? Ralf | ||
| Rigga |
as for the poor mans fast kit.i did exactly the same with my bike,made my own up from opto's original posting,with all the changes i made it dyno'ed nice really for a 9.....www.freewebs.com/martin_brown | ||
| Cataract2 |
Ralf, returning slow to idle is normal. If it hangs before getting to idle that would mean you set it to high. I normally set mine at about 1050 (where the needle is just barely about the 1K line). BTW, lugging around 2K-2.5K is normal. Riding there is to low in the RPM range on these bikes for riding. If you ride in that range you'll notice some minor lugging. Try and ride around 2.5K-3K and you should notice a difference. | ||
| Opto |
Rigga, it wasn't me, but if it works well I'll take the credit! | ||
| Rigga |
Opto......... its been a while,so i might have got it mixed up  | ||
| Alcino |
Hello everyone, A little over a month ago I bought a 12s and the owner forgot to put back trans oil for my ride home. Long story short I now have a different 12 engine in my bike now. I seem to have a driveability issue now with the new engine. Idles rough and dies at times, at cruising speeds of less than 45mph it bucks, and it dies leaving stop lights unless I rev it up to 3000rpm. All of these symptoms didn't happen while I had the original engine. I've played with the idle screw, but didn't seem to help. Also gas mileage is around 43mph commuting. I thought I should get at least 50. From what I've been reading here on the boards do I need a TPS reset because it needs to recalibrate the ecu to the new engine/tps sensor? Thanks for any help, Alcino (Message edited by alcino on November 30, 2005) (Message edited by alcino on November 30, 2005) | ||
| Glitch |
But first check all the wires coming from the ECM for a bad ground. Sounds exactly what happened to mine when a ground wire came off at the ECM. Then if that ain't it a reset may help. | ||
| M1combat |
I'd get the TPS reset on that one Alcino. WRT to the low idle... Mine idles nice and happily at about 800RPM. I run it up to about 1050 in the winter. | ||
| Alcino |
Thanks, I figured that I needed a reset. Just called San Diego harley. They want $80 for it. Does that seem steep? I guess I need it. Alcino | ||
| Alcino |
Got back from Harley. Was the tps. Rides like a dream again. They had it for a full hour back there and took it for like a 15 minute test ride. is that really necessary? They said before reseting my tps was at 2.5 and should be in the range of 4.8-6.2 so they placed mine at 5.2. Are they talking about volts? Sorry for hijacking the thread. I do feel that it was irritating to take to harley for this, but the bike is running great. Alcino | ||
| Al_lighton |
Alcino, Too late now, but I would have done it for free for you up here at the shop in Vista. Not volts. More like degrees. It maxes out at 85 at WOT. Al | ||
| Alcino |
Darn, I didn't even think of you Al. I was reading all the threads that said only Dealers can do it. So are you a considered a HD dealer? It's OK... it's only money right?  Plus it was driving me nuts the way it rode. Next time I will call you first before going to the stealership. Alcino | ||
| Al_lighton |
I'm a technoresearch dealer. The Technoresearch VDSTS SW can do the TPS resets and more. I have it running here on both laptop and a PDA, TPS resets take about 5 minutes. $80 is highway robbery for the task, if you ask me. Al | ||
| Hippo888 |
Al_lighton, Can the Technoresearch tool change the AFR at all? Say, I want to run the bike a little richer than what the EPA has mandated? Not for performance, but for smoother throttle transitions/response and such. | ||
| Al_lighton |
Paul, It will let you rest the AFV to 100, but it doesn't let you change the mapping. The AFV will relearn itself over time, the rest is just the way to bring it back to the nominal value. But, stay tuned. I'll be on the dyno next week, qualifying the technoresearch product that DOES let you change the mapping. Al | ||
| Kowpow225 |
AL! Dangit I hate when you do this. *smacks wallet hand* | ||
| Hippo888 |
Al, What I want to do is to make the bike a little richer in the closed loop, "cruise" circuit and at partial throttle openings. Are you saying that the bike will reset any values that I input? TIA | ||
| Al_lighton |
With VDSTS, there really isn't any values to input, other than resetting the AFV to 100. However, the SW that is coming will let you change the actual tables in the ECM, so it should be able to do what you want. I'll know more next week. Al |
