| Author | Message | ||
     BadS1 |
Norris there you go again.Your Wrong!!!!!Why does my D&D out perform my old Drummer and the race pipe by the seat of the pants??. It feels better then either of the two at any RPM.Thats odd hey???Have you ever personally tested anything other then your Drummer maybe you have but then again??But I know you haven't had any lengthly seat time on them.LOL | ||
| Norrisperformance |
Tomzweifel If you say 3700 rpm and below is idle and anything above 5800 rpm is red line. (Message edited by norrisperformance on April 30, 2005) | ||
| Norrisperformance |
Once again, if anybody cares to look. Here's the loud 12 Drummer dynos. www.norrishp.com/dynos.htm Remember Dana You had one of the first Drummers. And it was designed and tested for an xb9, not the xb12. Drummers have changed a lot, since you got yours. I think you said it was the second or third Drummer ever made. And you ain't got no dynos. And one day soon, we will have to meet, and I'll let you check my bike with your seat of the pants method. (Message edited by norrisperformance on April 30, 2005) | ||
| Wahoo |
Hey Big Easy... I sent you a PM, dont know if you got it or not. I will buy your race can, I dont want the loudest pipe out there, but I would like to add a lil sound to my mostly stock 04 12R. It has the K and N with the air box cut up.. stock other than that | ||
| Bigeasy |
Thanks for the offer but I'm gonna hang on to it for awhile wahoo. Will call on you if I change my mind. | ||
| Tomzweifel |
Norris, What I am saying is that the dyno chart you posted says that the D&D is better than stock. And the question was...? | ||
| Norrisperformance |
What I'm saying, with a Loud Drummer you get the same mids as the D&D and better performance at the bottom and top over the race can. If you took the best performance quality’s from the race can and the D&D and put them into a muffler. The loud Drummer would still out perform the hybrid pipe. Why not have your cake and eat it to. | ||
| Norrisperformance |
Tomzweifel Do you use your bike below 3700 rpm, I do I ride wheelies there. And you never turn more rpms 5800 I sure do. Wouldn't be a good performing bike in my book lol I like a smooth power curve I guess is not for everyone. (Message edited by norrisperformance on May 01, 2005) | ||
| BadS1 |
What your saying is Norris that your Drummer out performs the Becin when Terry and Jim of Hal's along with Buell them selves at one point have poored hundreds of hours into there bike for peak performance to have a couple guys cut open a stock can do some changes and badda bing out performs theres.Hmmmm you might want to tell Hals, and Buell for that matter that goods are right under there noses on the production based bikes. | ||
| Got1nut |
It ROCKS   | ||
| Kds1 |
Dana, It's funny that you just posted what you did...That's exactly what I'm trying to get across to the Buell owners...I stood in Tilley's dyno room with the race bike and was told right to my face that the stock header and Drummer would never work because it doesn't flow...it was baselined with the Rhinehart system, which after it was seen it got copied, I've seen the two side by side and is the same,and the drummer with the stock header for a 12 on the 1350 was ran with a baseline and there was no difference in the curve except the Drummer was 2hp higher across the board without it even being tuned for it after it was tuned for the other system.... Now, think about it...it is very true that what comes on your bike can be used to get the best performance out of your bike's, if you stop and think how to grasp it....my problem is since i don't blend in with the rest of society in thinking that you have to always have to have a formula or a drawing to make things work, I can build two before you can get one added up and be testing it and know why it doesn't work, and then change the config to make it better....I know it's hard to believe, but I guarantee that you if help me to be able to do this thing that you will get more back from me to the Buell owners than you will from most others..... www.kdfab.com Kevin | ||
| Norrisperformance |
BadS1 Tilley's proved it. Not me! And I’m told, a lot of the technology in you XB motor came from Tilley's race bikes. Head design and case design. lol | ||
| BadS1 |
I want to see those Dyno's please of their race bike with the Drummer.They have not been seen. | ||
| Kowpow225 |
Fellas, we go round and round on this everytime something like this is posted. EVERYTHING is a compromise when it comes to these bikes. Since both of you are adamant about your particular choice of noisemaker, maybe you two have something in common after all!  | ||
| Norrisperformance |
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| BadS1 |
Now how do we know they are of the Drummer??? | ||
| Norrisperformance |
I let Kevin answer that. | ||
| Kds1 |
Here's the pic if it makes it on here...sorry so big.. kevin www.kdfab.com | ||
| Kds1 |
Can't get it to go, must be too big...if you want to see the bike e-mail me and I'll send it to ya... Kevin | ||
| Norrisperformance |
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| Blake |
"What I'm saying, with a Loud Drummer you get the same mids as the D&D and better performance at the bottom and top over the race can." Why do we have to keep having this same discussion? D&D offers optimum mid-range performance; the Drummer offers optimum low and top end. Choose your favorite flavor. Mike, you are not doing Kevin any favors here. I'll be perfectly frank about the issue, until a neutral party provides carefully controlled dyno testing of the pipes in question, the jury remains out. There simply is no single muffler that will do it all. There will always be a part of the rev range that is compromised in lieu of optimum performance elsewhere. | ||
| BadS1 |
Blake I am sorry trust me.This to me is not a shoot out to me to who's pipe is better.Its more how the sponsor is selling the product and portraying it.I hope you are not angry with me?? | ||
| Dcentric |
I would consider myself a neutral party in some fashion as I dont own a drummer or a D&D, I am in the process of trying to make a decision of ALL pipe options out there. What I can say is that Kevin is a heck of a nice guy and took the time to give me a straight opinion on the pipe and other issues. I am leaning towards the drummer because like "Daves", personal, honest attention is hard to find these days. I'm not sure what everyone is arguing about. It seems an apples/oranges debate and makes about as much sense as a Lightning/Firebolt debate. | ||
| Kds1 |
This is a great Buell site and if I pay to sponsor it I should be able to talk about my product....nobody else but Daves even sells my pipe and we are both sponsors....I can't help if the Drummer, D&D, Jardine, and all other manufacturer owners are happy about their products...It's always going to be up for debate...If the Drummer is not ok to be discussed on the badweb, please let me know and I'll go from there...It's no different than talking about who sets the fastest lap times in a race...there will always be a personal opinion for whatever reason, we're human and that's life.... Kevin www.kdfab.com | ||
| Stealthxb |
personal, honest attention is hard to find these days | ||
| Bigeasy |
Didnt mean to open such a can of worms guys. I'm getting used to the D&D now and learning where to shift. Love the sound and the back pops on decel! Norris has emailed me and wants to trade my D&D for a drummer so he can test it. I'm thinking about it. While I'm at it I could send him my Buell race can also. Wonder if you guys could make a Drummer out of it!? Art | ||
| Kds1 |
Bigeasy, I can fix your race can if you have a 12.... Kevin www.kdfab.com | ||
| BadS1 |
Kevin its not just talking about the Drummer its how its done and you of all people are not the person thats doing it.Take for instance "I bought a D&D and its doing this and that." The sponsor comes in and says well you should of bought the Drummer and you would have this or that problem.Tell your guy to present the product better and I wouldn't be quick to slam on him.Blake is right he's not doing you any favors Kevin. | ||
| Jerseyguy |
Dana - I speak to Kevin every day. I help him in any way I can with the engineering and production issues he has. We are pretty tight so I'm always going to be a bit biased in his favor even though I try to be as objective as possible. Mike has his own CNC shop and is a Badweb sponsor for his own engraved products. I got a points cover from him and he did a really nice job on it. You appear to think he is a sponsor for Drummers but he is not. He is obviously very enthusiastic about them, perhaps overly so at times. I think he believes in Kevin's work as do I. No one has sold Drummers on the Badweb except Bubba, Kevin & Dave to my knowledge. I bought a few cores on eBay, had them made into Drummers at my own expense and sold them on eBay - mostly overseas. If you have a personal beef with Mike's style, I think you both should keep it off of the Badweb. I say that because the casual reader might think you are berating Drummers and Kevin when I don't think that's your intent. Kevin is a paying sponsor and I think he has every right to promote his product here as long as he follows the rules and tells the truth. | ||
| BadS1 |
I never went after Kevin or you on this board have I??Mike is a paying sponsor???Why doesn't he put half of his enthusiasm into his cnc work that he definately puts into the Drummer???He also lists the Drummer on his sight.Your right Jersey I don't have anything against Kevin,you or the Drummer.You guys are a great duo.But Mike on the other hand is not doing any favors.I don't think I'm the only one that notices.Even your comment in you last post."He's obviously very enthusiastic about them,perhaps overly so at times"  Mike let people make up there own mind and let them decide whats right or wrong for them.Don't tell them what they shoulda coulda done. |
