| Author | Message | ||
     Sl33py |
First stator died at 10-12k, second in only 4-5k. Second was dead in a day from showing low voltage issue when hot (170-190 at gauge). Ordered the EBR modified charging system rotor. Plus new gasket (cause i'll need it if i don't order it), and rotor nut. having trouble finding the crankshaft locking tool - is there a HD equivalent i can get easier than the EBR (out of stock)? Or anyone in PNW/Seattle w/ one to borrow? Stuck in traffic i was surprised to see my bike still ran until it showed 9.8v and then finally died. Luckily rolled it into my work parking until i can charge battery and do a quick 14mi run home one evening (without traffic hopefully). I'm looking for the stator removal process - any page #'s you can point me at? Will grab a 32mm socket (guessing i need deep?) and have a 24" breaker bar. Mechanic buddy should have a nice torque wrench i hope to borrow, or HF it is. Mine goes to 150lbs. Anything i'm missing? Was looking for Baf or someone's PDF w/ a step by step, but didn't find it after searching. Watched the Twin Motorcycles videos on youtube already to get a gauge on the process. Thanks for any input/tip/tricks! | ||
| Sl33py |
Rewind vs Rick's hotshot stator? Also - anyone comment on USA hand wound vs regular? Looks like no more rewind option (or $160 price). At least from Rick's - any others i'm missing? I checked Cycle Electric and found the CE-6014 which says "Buel" (not a good first sign) - called and that's for the HD/sportster engine Buell's. Bummer. I will find the pages in my manual and get ready for this when parts arrive. Any crankshaft locking tool suggestions or loans in the area? Thanks guys! Rob | ||
| Hildstrom |
The stator removal procedure is in the service manual. The section might be called "ignition cover" under electrical, but I don't have it in front of me to double check. You'll need some high temperature red thread locker for the rotor nut and some RTV silicone to secure the stator leads to the case. Here's my page on DIY fixes. I used a 300ftlbs-max-rated impact wrench instead of the locking tool with a 300ftlbs torque wrench, which I discuss in the "Rotor Modification" section. http://hildstrom.com/projects/buellstator/index.ht ml Here's the thread on rewind options. The last time I contacted Cycle Electric they said they did not offer stators for the 1125. Their "Buel" stators are for the air-cooled motors. If you find another option, please update this thread. http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/290 431/684861.html Here's a link to Baf's pdf. https://baf.zone/projects/1125-charging-system/wri teup.pdf | ||
| Sl33py |
Thanks Hildstrom! I actually found your thread/site as my first search. I'll read the electrical section of the manual and look for ignition cover specifically. I need to call Rick's and see what they say the differences are between their standard and hand wound USA option. Hoping someone here has seen/used both and could comment. Yeah - Cycle electric was super friendly, but no offerings for the 1125's. Only the sportster engine stators. Thank you for the link to Baf's PDF! I kept seeing comments about it, but hadn't found it yet. Thanks! Rob | ||
| Sl33py |
Thanks! From the rewind thread i called customrewind.com and spoke with Kirk. Super cool guy to chat with. I think i'm going to go that route instead of the Rick's hotshot stator. Guesstimate of ~$150 (sight unseen), but the better/higher-temp 16 AWG wire, and they stand behind their stator for 1 yr (same as Rick's). Quick turnaround in a couple days... So going to give that a shot. Work blocked Baf's PDF, but got it on my phone (HA!!  IT Security!!). Now just need to find the locking tool. | ||
| Faceyman |
Not sure if it will help you any, but I have pics on my blog of when I did my stator/rotor upgrade. Go to http://www.faceyman.com and search 1125R Upgrade. The guys here at Bad Weather Bikers were a tremendous support! | ||
| Sl33py |
I will definitely check that out Facey. Much appreciated! Yeah - gotta love badweb and other Buellers. So much help and a community worth participating in. Nillaice has the tool and just depending on another badweb in CO who may need it before me, i think i've got it lined up. Two things (one question) called my local stealership and they were able to locate the B-48858-A Crankshaft Locking Tool, BUT wanted 99.99 PLUS s/h PLUS tax. Grr! I'd love to have my own in the toolbox and to loan out, but jeez that's ridiculous. Now The q: Loctite and Permatex? Loctite 648 for sprag (Permatex 64000?) - permatex an option instead? I know the Loctite 272 can be substituted w/ the Permatex 27200 (the Part #'s even line up oddly). | ||
| Hildstrom |
The Permatex part numbers you mention are for just one of the available sizes of each product. I'd say the Permatex High Temperature Sleeve Retainer (400F) product looks very similar to Loctite 648 in terms of temperature, stats, and composition from the TDS and MSDS. It has a higher temperature resistance than Loctite 290 / Permatex Penetrating Grade Threadlocker Green (300F) or Loctite 242 / Permatex Medium Strength Threadlocker Blue (300F). It should be a good fit for that application. | ||
| Sl33py |
Thanks Hildstrom! I ordered the permatex ones, and then found a reasonably inexpensive loctite 648 i ordered as well. Hard to have too much, and better to have it and not need it. | ||
| Sl33py |
Random Q time. Figured i'd muck up my own thread than post a new one... So i'm part way into this now. Parts arrived and trying to get it done. I want to check the oil screen (under engine). Removed the bolts, drained and see it, but it's not easily popping off. What's the trick? I want to check for chunks of my stator and just clean it out of any debris. Didn't want to force it, so being cautious. Similarly w/ the CKP sensor "engine harness support" - the plastic wire cover for the CKP. Trying not to force it/break-it, any trick to removal. Feel like a pansy, but just trying not to break anything while tearing into it. Once i get the CKP removed, i'm cracking the ignition cover/case and pulling the stator to send it for rewind. How long should it take to do this job (stator remove/replace) for a noob'ish mechanic? I'm expecting to go slow and make sure i'm doing it right. My only rush is to get the crank locking tool back to Nillaice so he can pass it along to the next needy Bueller. And of course i'm ready to go for a ride on the 25R as the weather gets nicer. The 06 electra glide does ok for commuting and cruising, but it's just not the same! thanks everyone! Rob | ||
| Dhays1775 |
For the screen, you should be able to pry it down a little to grab it. Once you have it moved a little, rotate the screen in a small circular motion while pulling down. That should allow the o-ring to unseat and pop out the screen. Don't spin it, since the o-ring in top of it will just spin. (I hope I'm not confusing you here.) Everything that was stopped by the screen should be laying in the cover. For the CPK cover, it's held by a couple T-30 screws up on the engine. All you need to do is pull it up enough to get an 8mm wrench on the bolt. For everything that you've stated you will be doing should only take about an hour to pop it all apart, even taking your time. Everything is pretty easy to do on these bikes, but sometimes you have to step back and think before you get mad. Just a little tip, when you go to route the wires up for the stator, tie a rope or something similar to them, then lubricate the cables with a little oil or silicone. It helps a lot! (Read that in the manual...) Best of luck!! | ||
| Sl33py |
You rock. Thanks. I re-read the manual today during lunch. Clear as mud.  So found a GREAT writeup by Ultimo_Justin: http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/290 431/592310.html?1283454984 Printed it so i can have it in the garage next to me, and hope to have some time tonight (if i ever get out of work). I'll just bend the CPK cover out of the way so i can unscrew/remove the CPK. Then I will get the filter screen popped off. I'll probably grab a small screwdriver or plastic pry tool (ones you use for cell phones/computers) to see if i can get it to let go. (wish i had a lift - laying on the floor sucks) Much appreciate the quick response to my random issues! | ||
| Brokengq |
I use needle nose pliers to remove my screen. When you look at the screen you will see a round piece off to one side. There is a plastic spot there you can grab on to. I wouldn't force it though. I barely use any pressure and it comes right out every time. Using a pry tool may mar up the case, which will result in leaks. As far as the CKP cover, just bend that sucker. That thing is remarkably resilient. I just replaced my sprag clutch about 2 weeks ago, and that was the biggest pain of the whole job. Just bear with it. You'll get it. Just a side note about the screen, run some oil around the o-ring before you reinstall it. Putting it up there dry makes it harder I've found. I know, I know, it doesn't make much sense. There's already oil in there. Oil doesn't go around the o-ring however, it goes through it. And I really REALLY hate to mention it (someone is going to yell at me), but the Harley dealership down here (who has "Buell trained" techs on staff, and supposedly they sub in at the EBR dealership [probably not true]) actually puts the rotor nut on with an impact. I know firsthand. I towed my bike all the way to them just to get the nut torqued "properly" and watch him run loctite over my crank threads, hand tighten the nut, and drive it home. I made them sign a repair order saying they did it, but 150 miles later its still holding up. (Message edited by brokenGQ on June 24, 2014) | ||
| Sl33py |
Chris - lol! I won't yell. I've been removing bits off my bike and damned if those bastards didn't tighten down every flipping thing to 400lbs (i exaggerate of course). When you are a hammer mentality at it's best... So I gently popped the screen off last night - no problem with a bit of spin/wiggle. Clean w/ no debris - great peace of mind. Got the CPK out too - just bent the bastard out of the way and easy peasy. Case is off, stator in my hands! w00t! Any tips/tricks to removing the caulk/gunk they used to secure down the wires inside the case? I have the high temp RTV to re-secure when i reassemble it. Hope to ship Stator today at lunch to Custom Rewind in AL. It would be great to have a stator in hand to reassemble already, but the Rick's Hotshot new units (taiwan) are over 200 now, and his hand rewound ones are 300... i'm not usually cheap, but geez! Talking with Kirk @ Custom Rewind i just felt like it was a better (and much less $) option. Should be 150'ish, with a year warranty if any issues (same as Hotshot). Sprag Clutch and the crank locking tool remain. While my FMF exhaust is nicely out of the way of everything, it just barely is IN THE WAY of getting the crank locking tool all the way in. So tonight or tomorrow i'll pull the muffler and attached mid-header so i can get the sprag off and swap the EBR oil modified flywheel on. While i'm at it i may look at repacking the can... It's always something! No biggie though - getting the stator out and shipped was my real priority. I've done a bunch of other random crap while fiddling with this. Got the Shorai installed, pulled the footpeg brackets off finally, etc. Off to look at gas breather hose rerouting! Thanks!! Rob | ||
| Bubba_ |
this is a stupid question .. but regarding impact tools. (Never used them) since i've seen several talk of using them on the rotor nut.. how does it work? is the impact capable of torque adjustment? i've been considering getting a cheap impact tool... | ||
| Brokengq |
No. You cannot adjust torque on an impact. They have a max torque rating at a certain psi. Most mid grade impacts are around 300lb-ft@~75-100psi from my experience. If you lower the psi, you lower the torque output. However there is no proven "scale" of what psi produces what torque. The best you can do is guess using percentages or get a rough estimate using a torque gauge. (Torque gauges have almost gone away. I haven't seen one except the one in my shop in a long time. Even mine hasn't been calibrated in 5 years.) The way Harley did it was fairly accurate given the tools and circumstances. If you seat the rotor nut hand tight and tap it with an impact with a max torque of 300lb-ft until the nut stops turning, it should be within 20lb-ft of 300. Point is, there are much better ways to torque something. However, impacts are extremely handy for removing high torque nuts and bolts, such as the rotor nut. Its a very good addition to any shop. I personally have a Kobalt 300 max impact from Lowes. Never let me down. Paid $110 about 2 years ago. I have a IR in the shop and a Matco at work. | ||
| Sl33py |
Bubba - i'm pretty doubtful of their advertised torque... For something i don't want to dig into again anytime soon - i'd rather use a real torque wrench than expect an air impact to be accurate. A "cheap" example from HF is still $80-90 - which at that point i'd spend the same on their 300lb torque wrench. http://www.harborfreight.com/38-in-professional-ai r-impact-wrench-68425.html and while not apples to apples, here's a test video of their REALLY cheap 75lb/tq impact wrench i see on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EX-EmWAr-_w (spoiler alert - 75lbs rated and can't remove 50lbs torqued bolt). And finally from ingersollrand - about torque on their impact wrenches (light reading). http://www.ingersollrandproducts.com/am-en/solutio ns/garage-solutions/maximum-impact-enewsletter/fea ture-articles/impact-gun-torque-ratings-science-or -magic Again, for a critical part like this i'd borrow/rent, or perhaps buy a reliable and reasonably accurate torque wrench first. If i had the money for a high quality impact wrench i might use it with some of the torque limiters:  Problem is most seem to max out at reasonably reached torque settings - again the same issue finding one that goes to 300lbs. The ham fisted monkeys at my local dealership can suck eggs - every damn thing they could impact down to ridiculous torque was. A total PITA to get stuff un-stuck afterwards. bit of a rant... but at least in my own thread! Rob | ||
| Brokengq |
Rob, nice to hear you got the first chunk out of the way. I definitely want to point out that you should look at the sprag while you have the chance. If you haven't seen it yet or don't have the info for it, I'll put a little here. If you have, just skip this part. Those six hex head bolts inside your rotor/flywheel hold the sprag housing onto the back of the rotor. Those can be a pain to break loose while the rotor is off the bike. Do NOT put it in a vise. If anything, remount it to the bike and use the locking tool on the crank to hold it in place. Once you get the housing off the back of the rotor, the sprag "bearing" will just pop out with your fingers. Check for flat spots on the inside and outside, and check the spring around the circumference for stretching and breaks. Check the inner race for wear, and the outer hub of the starter gear for chips and grooves. If you need part numbers, more information (or pictures), or a resource to get the parts let me know. Good luck my friend. You're in the fun now. I forgot to mention last night to take pictures of everything. It really helps with reassembly. Make sure to take one of the CKP cover area with the cover moved aside. It will really help you reroute the stator wiring correctly. As far as getting the old gunk off, plastic razor blades. Dorman has a part number for them (22018) and you can get them at most parts stores. If they don't have them, shop around for gasket scrapers. Plastic is best, carbon (black colored blade) will work but may nick up the cover. | ||
| Dennis_c |
What I did I got a 250 lbs torque wrench then torque to 175 then 200 then 225 then 250 saw how much movement there was then gave a little more. Each time there was a little less movement. | ||
| Sl33py |
Thanks Chris! Yeah, i forgot to mention i was leaving the rotor/flywheel on until i can lock the crank - specifically so i can remove those 6 bolts for the sprag. I need to return just the flywheel to EBR for my deposit... so it's gonna happen for sure. Thanks for the recommendations on what to check when i pull it off. I'll check those over and shout if something looks like a problem. Stator is on it's way to AL! I did take some pictures last night, but didn't take any specifically of the CKP routing - if you have one to provide that'd be great. Is it a pain to re-wire correctly? | ||
| Sl33py |
Dennis - Great idea! I have an older craftsman that does 20-250. My only concern is i don't know when it was last calibrated. Got it from my buddy who was a master toyota mechanic. Before i got my digital 5-100lb. I guess i can check against the digital to see if it's close, but i know they get more inaccurate closer to the high end of their range... | ||
| Brokengq |
Actually its been generally accepted across the board to remove the rotor nut with a impact. Its putting it back on with one that has been debated hotly. So if you wish to take it off and knock more work out, you should be fine. The picture of the CKP area isn't necessary, but helpful. There is a little clip in there that likes to get tangled up in everything when you reroute the stator wiring (at least it did for me). The picture makes it easier to know which side to put the wiring on when you push it through the grommet. I can take one if you would like and PM it to you. (Message edited by brokenGQ on June 25, 2014) | ||
| Bubba_ |
Thanks for the feedback on the impact tools guys. Very helpful. . As always  | ||
| Reepicheep |
I love the impact tools to remove stuck nuts. Not just ones that would be a vein buster to try and do by hand, but ones that want to strip. I have a nice little porter cable 12V LiIon impact driver for smaller nuts that pops them free nicely without stripping, then zips them right out. And the bigger pneumatic ingersol rand unit will often remove things like crank nuts from Japanese bikes without locking tools. I avoid ever using an impact tool to put a nut or bolt on though. Use a hand torque wrench for that. For big torques, I have a 2 foot long breaker bar, and I know how much I weigh. Calculate a proportion of your weight, center your foot accordingly "that far" out. So if I wanted 200 foot pounds of torque, and I weighed 200 lbs, I would center my foot 1 foot out on the breaker bar and gently stand on it. No bouncing. I expect that approach easily gets me within 5% precision. | ||
| Sl33py |
Reepicheep - I like the breaker bar method and knowing your own weight. I could easily grab a 25lb weight and do it easily at 1 foot (6'8" - 265). I also like using the Dennis method above - i think either would work. Or i may just grab the big HF torque wrench to add it to the toolbox (the bad reviews i've seen are mostly user error on reversing it). I will eventually have an air impact, but my little 18v dewalt works well for most stuck nuts - just not big torque... I just got off the phone with Gary @ Custom Rewind (great guy to talk to). Unfortunately they *do not* offer the 1 yr warranty on the Buell Stators (still too likely to fail as it's really a design flaw of the engine). I'm going to get it rewound by them anyway. I like to support local when i can, and know it's as good as the taiwan part, and half the cost of the USA Hotshot rewound from Rick's. I'll take pics when it arrives (likely beginning-mid of next week). And since i like pics of stuff, here's where i'm at currently (minus the stator which i've already pulled):  Appreciate all the help guys! rob | ||
| Stimbrell |
Isn't the reason you should not use an impact tool on the end of a crankshaft that there is a real danger it will knock the crank out of true, it will no longer be balanced? I am sure using an impact tool on a pressed assembly is a real, "do not do this" type of thing. | ||
| Brokengq |
Looks good! If you look at the balancer gear above the rotor there is a big washer on the shaft. As it sits right now, there's nothing holding it on. If you lose that you'll be kicking yourself. Its going to have to go come off when you pull your rotor out anyway. To reassemble the sprag clutch and housing to the bike you have to drop the starter gear (behind the rotor in your picture) into the sprag bearing. It is MUCH easier to do this off the bike. Once you pull the rotor nothing holds this gear in. Just slide it off. (Nothing holds that balancer gear in either, be careful. If you pull that out you will have to re time it with the engine). | ||
| Brokengq |
If you really hammered away at it I imagine it could knock it out of true. The crank being one piece I think it would be harder than you think to do. I saw a lifter valley explode on a 200ci aircraft motor once. Jammed the cam up and the pistons locked against the valves. Did a complete tear down and the crank was still true. Had a dent in it from the prop slamming the ground on the emergency "landing" (crashing). But still true. | ||
| Dhays1775 |
Sl33py, how come you didn"t pull the circlip and pull the hose? It's easier to do that than remove the fitting. All you have to do is pull the clip, pull the hose, put the clip back. Once you're done, push the hose back in and the clip locks it in place. (Just wondering...) | ||
| Sl33py |
Dhays - Good question. I didn't know it was that easy... so i just pulled the whole dealio. I think i saw it that way on one of the step-by-step instructions - so i did that. I follow directions well - especially if they are the wrong, or longer way to do something, directions! |
