| Author | Message | ||
     Coastrambler |
Am having a problem getting the bike started. When I hit the start switch I get solenoid click, maybe a motor burp and then starter motor whir. Release start switch, let starter motor stop and try again. This problem is worst for first start of the day. It's been cold here. Around high 40's F, (8-9C). I've been pulling the clutch lever as recommended in Service Manual. If I can eventually get it started it usually starts right up when warmed. Talked with local moto guru. Sounds like the friction clutch is the problem. It's $268 at the dealer. And putting it in is beyond my skill level. Am going to try changing oil & filter, go 200 miles and change again. This in hope of flushing problem. Anybody else have this happen? Ideas? | ||
| Cataract2 |
Are you certain it's not a weak battery? From the cold it could be the CCA of the battery is way down. | ||
| Nuts4mc |
friction clutch = SPRAG clutch...no friction plates but metal rollers and internal "ramps" that "lock" the clutch when turning it fast enough to send the rollers into those "ramps" 1) Like Cat2 sez - how old is the battery?...do you keep it on a Batt Tender? 2) have you checked the battery connections...tight and clean? 3) Check your grounds 4) Cold weather and heavy oil = slow turning motor...new oil = faster spin 5) your profile shows you've been thru the "Stator Wars"...did you have your rotor modified by EBR?...did the SPRAG clutch get replaced?..there was a recent post with an "extra" one for sale...( but I have to agree with Cat2...it's most likely your Battery)...hope this helps | ||
| Coastrambler |
OK, here goes; Battery is 2 years old, I keep bat tndr on it always at home. Open ckt voltage (tndr disconnected) is 13.2, starter switch closed it drops to 11.5. Connections are solid. I used jumper cables at one point, results the same. It is time to change the oil. Stator and rotor are stock. All my stator troubles were covered by Milwaukee. As an "Ongoing Issue" after initial warranty expired. So SPRAG clutch is probably original. Have not been able to get it started last few days, temps near freezing. Soon as I can get it started I'll change the oil. I have been pulling the clutch when trying to start it. Once it's warmed up the motor catches right off, so the SPRAG clutch doesn't need to hold on very long. Right now it's letting go too soon. Am told tiny bits of crap in the works can cause this. | ||
| Nuts4mc |
electricity is kinda like plumbing... a) Voltage is kinda like the rate at which water flows thru a pipe b) Current (Amps) is kinda like the pressure which the water flows c) Resistance is kinda like the obstructions ( pressure drop) bends/turns or reduction in pipe diameter....reduces flow and affects pressure. you need to measure the AMPS that the battery has ( which isn't easy to do without some special terminal adapters as current is measured "in line" with the circuit.) That's why Cat2 suggested pulling the battery and getting the CCA ( Cold Cranking Amps) tested...your battery may have enough "flow" to indicate voltage, but lacks the "pressure" to really spin the starter. the starter motor itself without any load requires some pressure (Amps),if the Amps aren't there, the voltage drops and starter motor won't spin with sufficient RPM to engage the rollers in the SPRAG clutch...to further drag things slower the transmission clutch plates have to slip (adding friction to the system) and requiring more Amps to spin the motor... get the battery tested for CCA/cranking capacity...if it checks out "OK" then you can attack/replace the SPRAG clutch... Note - a new battery is less costly than a new SPRAG clutch ( unless you can get HD to replace the SPRAG clutch)...if you do choose to get a new SPRAG clutch installed - it is an Ideal time to send the rotor off to EBR for the oil jet/stator cooling mod ( you own a 2009 bike with the higher current producing stator = more heat)...this path requires some coin so check out the costs before you get into the motor...again, I hope this helps. Note 2-if the battery is the original battery, it has survived (2) stators and (1) VR...I would "retire" it just out of respect...it served long enough (Message edited by nuts4mc on December 08, 2013) | ||
| Zac4mac |
Nuts - good analogy and explanation, but you mixed up volts/amps. Volts=pressure, amps=flow . Z | ||
| Nuts4mc |
Z, what can I say?...I live on the "left coast".... we see things differently out here! | ||
| Zac4mac |
it happens.. I just posted a cool pic of a rear brake disk... on a "front brake" thread. I learned electronics as an ETN in the Navy, early 80s, the plumbing analogy is perfect. Z | ||
| Coastrambler |
As is said, replacing the battery is easier, and cheaper. Am wanting more conclusive data. At this time Friction Clutch is still most likely. By count, I'm on my 4th stator and second rotor. It's at least the second battery. HD replaced with stator, sometimes the battery. Current battery is two years old. I got a chuckle out of the plumbing analogies. They work at an elementary level. At the level I worked, High Power RF, microwave transmitters & receivers and various items submerged in liquid helium, which has a temperature of 4.2K at standard pressure, room temp being 300K. Those analogies fall apart. Anyway. An electric motor has predictable load vs no load characteristics that give me to think the battery may still be good. Still want to change the oil and see what happens. Didn't mean to write a resume, kinda happened. I do like it here on the left coast. | ||
| Sir_wadsalot |
Put in some good 10/40 and see what you get. 25/50 Honda HP-4 doesn't want to start below 50F, on a perfect bike. I thought it was my battery and got a tender, it was just the oil. Cold viscosity was too high. | ||
| Zac4mac |
another way to "load test" your battery - Diagnostic Mode works in RUN with headlights and PARK with no lights. Lights use around 6-7Amps so you can compare discharge rates. Coastrambler - do you work on MRI equip? I did for a while, it was cool needing and using a full toolkit of Titanium tools(non-magnetic) when working in the magnet-bore. Z | ||
| Coastrambler |
Bike is parked out in the sun at this moment in hopes the oil will thin. Have kinda mostly decided to get a new battery Wed, $120+tax at HD. Not convinced, still am afeared it's the friction clutch. Am up for lighter oil. Any suggestions as to brand? No Medical stuff for me. I was satellite and fiber optic guy, almost exclusively DOD. When I was in superconducting magnetometers we used berillium copper tools. Don't even remember how to spell those words anymore. | ||
| Mhpalin |
Amsoil 10/40 Mike | ||
| Cataract2 |
Would have loaded tested the old battery at an auto parts store before buying a new one. That would have told you if it was good or not. Actually, I think you can buy a load tester and do it at home. Let us know what happens. http://www.harborfreight.com/100-amp-6-volt12-volt-battery-load-tester-69888-9191.html (Message edited by cataract2 on December 09, 2013) | ||
| Froggy |
My 09 CR does the same thing when it is below freezing, with Amsoil 10w/40. It is not the battery, it is the sprang clutch. Mine only started doing it after my rotor was replaced. Lighter oil and a new battery may help reduce the symptom, but they don't fix the issue. I end up rolling the bike into my building at work shortly before I go to leave, and it will fire up right on the first try. | ||
| Coastrambler |
OK, scratch the battery replacement idea. Wheeled the 1125 out into the sun this morning, moved it at times to keep it perpendicular to the sun. Temp got to low 60's. After 3 hours tried to start it, and it started. Took it for a little victory ride. Still need to change the oil & filter. When I rolled it out of my garage it's thermometer read 37F. |
