| Author | Message | ||
     Cowboytutt |
If you live in CA and like having a loud Buell, better write Arnold soon! Its IMPORTANT!!!!! See the link on this page to help you email or call the Gov. http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/6/782/4/Motorcycle-B log-Post/California-Tries-to-Restrict-Aftermarket- Pipes.aspx Please feel free to remind him that CA is the LARGEST motorcycle market in the continental US and that he would be pissing off a lot of voters if he signed this into law and you hope he didn't have any more political aspirations. He would also most likely be driving aftermarket exhaust companies in CA out of the state, reducing the tax and job base. Thanks! -Tutt | ||
| Froggy |
What if I don't like hearing a loud Buell? | ||
| Cowboytutt |
Since you don't live in CA and live in New York according to your profile, Froggy, what's it to you??????  -Tutt | ||
| Froggy |
Legislation that starts in CA will end up in NY next. We got our own anti noise legislation we are dealing with here too. Also, it already is illegal to run an aftermarket pipe that exceeds DOT specs regardless of where you live. Last thing we need is more useless laws. | ||
| Jdugger |
NY has been cracking down a lot, too. It's all over the Ducati boards. While I'm generally against giving the police any more reasons to harass citizens who's worst lifetime offences will be something related to traffic, I'm somewhat sympathetic to the laws around vehicle noise pollution. Noise pollution in major cities is a real problem, and not just from motorcycles but from modified cars and in particular freight and commercial trucks, public transit buses, and other large vehicles which tend to be very loud even when perfectly legal. In dense neighborhoods, excessive vehicle noise really is a problem. | ||
| Cowboytutt |
I live in a rural part of CA, and deliberatly choose NOT to live in a major metro area. Please don't let your own living conditions in your own state infringe my personal liberties in CA as they do not apply to me. I would never presume to tell you what to do as you live over 3000 miles away from me. Please do the same for me and my motorcycle peers in CA. Your state has a right to do what they want. So do we here in CA. This post was directed to those who live in CA. Thanks! -Tutt | ||
| Jdugger |
I hear ya Cowboy, but actually the urban areas of California are your problem. The coast contains most of CA's population and voting block, and this looks like it's going to be a state decision, not a county-by-county one. As you said, I have no dog in this hunt -- just adding some commentary. I live in TX and we haven't seen any kind of wide-scale crackdown to date that I know about. Some of the race tracks in California even mandate stock exhausts! It's insane out there. | ||
| Cowboytutt |
I can see how living in a large metro area that noise would be a problem. CA is a little different than New York I think in that we are a huge state with BOTH rural and metro areas. It makes much more sense for noise regulations be created by cities and perhaps counties as they could be necessary in dense population areas. But making such regulations state-wide in CA, in areas where there is no such concern is unreasonable law! Los Angeles County already has their own gun laws. Let them have their own noise laws too if necessary. But to restrict everyone all over the state is unreasonable. Thanks for your understanding. -Tutt | ||
| Cowboytutt |
Thanks Dugger! We apparently were writing the same idea at the same time! -Tutt | ||
| Boogiman1981 |
how about the fact that they have never been legal since the epa introduced the first noise specs way back when. this is yet another layer of useless government. | ||
| Liquidcooled |
f-ing Dems. they wanna restrict and control everything. Hope they get their asses handed to them in Nov. I live in Cali, and they have bankrupted the state. Too bad the average Californian blindly follows this party. | ||
| Mountainstorm |
Last I checked the governor of Californica is a Republican, and I hope they get their asses handed to them. | ||
| Westmoorenerd |
Wow...that's pretty gay, I'm not looking forward to moving back to Lemoore in a year and a half then =/. | ||
| Redbuelljunkie |
Well, since 1982 it's been against federal law for anyone to tamper with the EPA-certified exhaust on their motorcycle, or replace it with one that isn't EPA-compliant. I don't think the new California law is necessary- we should be enforcing the laws that have been in effect for over 28 years! You can run any damn exhaust you want on a public road, but you'll get no sympathy from me if you get ticketed, fined, or thrown in jail for doing it- it's the law for a reason. If an overly-loud exhaust didn't bother other people, the law would not exist. For those who claim they want to be left alone- that's exactly what the people your exhaust is aggravating are saying. If your noise only affected you- there'd be no issue. | ||
| Cowboytutt |
Junkie, thats just exactly what has been going on here in CA. Certain areas choose to enforce existing laws, some don't. We all here locally know where those areas are. Which brings us back to the idea of the LOCAL creation and enforcement of laws, and not a state-wide band. Thanks for your input. -Tutt | ||
| Liquidcooled |
Mountainstorm...The Governator is Republican by title only. He acts like your Dem party anyway. Well lets see how he votes,if it makes its way to his desk. we know he rides. even without an M1. | ||
| Jdugger |
> I don't think the new California law is necessary The irony of it all is that it legally should be a state or local level law and not a federal one. Arguably, the entire EPA is unconstitutional and this sort of regulation is explicitly a state's right. | ||
| Nattyx1 |
I wrote to the Governator about this last night. (I cribbed some of the language from the AMA boilerplate, but most of it's mine). Leaving aside the actual issue (whether you believe motorcyclists have a right to ride around making as much noise as they want), the key problem with the law is that it's discriminatory. Here's what I sent: Governor: I've lived in California since I was 8 years old. I've been a motorcyclist since I was 16. I've paid taxes and been a responsible citizen and motorist since then as well. I'm now past 50 and still ride every day...this is the first time I've felt compelled to contact the Governor's office. Prior to your political career, I saw you at the Rock Store many times over the years, sitting at your corner table with your fellow Sunday morning riders. I'm always hopeful that you'll be on our side whenever an anti-motorcycle bill comes up, because in fact, you're one of us. As a constituent and concerned responsible motorcyclist, I urge you to veto Senate Bill 435, introduced by state Senator Fran Pavley. I understand the American Motorcyclists Association (AMA) also urges you to veto this bill because it will require all motorcyclists operating within the state of California and manufactured on or after January 1, 2013, to be equipped with a federally-labeled conforming exhaust system. As you know, you have until September 30, 2010, to sign or veto proposed bills. As written, Senate Bill 435 is not practical in a real world traffic stop situation due to the inconsistent location of the federal label, making it difficult for law enforcement to locate. These labels can be positioned on different locations depending on the type of exhaust and/or style of the motorcycle. This will result in improper and unwarranted citations. Furthermore, after-market exhaust systems are not always louder than stock systems and can be installed for a variety of legitimate reasons. Stock exhaust can wear out over time, be damaged, unavailable or prohibitively expensive. If signed into law, motorcyclists, and motorcyclists alone, will be forced to purchase Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) parts, while automobile drivers will continue to be allowed to install exhaust components from non-OEM sources. Senator Pavley must enjoy the loud blaaaaaaaat of a 6" straight exhaust tube on the tuner Subaru... or the deafening pressure release of aftermarket big rig braking kits... or the window-rattling sound of an unmuffled Big Rig decelerating. I wrote her a letter about this, including mention of the smoke and racket of 2-stroke weed blowers operated by gardeners unwilling to use rakes. My argument was logical; it didn't deter her. This to me is the single most compelling legal reason to veto this bill -- it's discriminatory against motorcyclists. Sen. Pavley doesn't "get" motorcycling. You do. She sees us as a nuisance in general. You don't. We're a minority, and she doesn't like the way we sound. Can you imagine the hue and cry if someone were to try to pass a bill that made it specifically illegal (for example) to play hip-hop music on a car stereo that had been modified with aftermarket speakers and amplification? The discriminatory regulation would by omission still allow fans of Frank Sinatra or Jimmy Buffet or Marilyn Manson to crank up their songs on such equipment -- only the music deemed "annoying" by a Senator would be illegal. SB 435 is absolutely parallel to my apparently silly example, and that's why it baffles me that it passed the legislature. It's not a fair across-the-board law: it shouldn't have gotten to your desk. Save our state the court costs from the challenges that will come unless you veto this unfair bill. Again, please veto Senate Bill 435. Thank you for your time and consideration of this important request. | ||
| Crazyhawk99 |
The problem with the law that CA is proposing is that it is specifically written requiring MOTORCYCLES to have OEM exhausts. Although I have no doubt that noise was behind the law, it clearly and unfairly (in my opinion) doesn't include other on-road motorized vehicles. It also does not allow for installing aftermarket exhausts that DO comply with EPA noise limits. As we all know, on most motorcycles, one of the components most often damaged in even a slow speed accident is the exhaust. Have you ever priced an OEM exhaust system? Aftermarket is almost always considerably cheaper. I say enforce EPA noise standards via standardized road-side test and/or write a law that covers ALL on-road vehicles. No, I don't live in CA (although I did for many years), but this will likely effect us all eventually. | ||
| Crazyhawk99 |
Natty, Well said! Good on you for taking the time to get involved. | ||
| Blake |
Great letter Steve! The points you made about trucks and leaf blowers are among my pet peeves. So to is truck tire noise. I can see the need for fed oversight concerning air and water pollution as those often crosses state boundaries. Noise? Not to a meaninful extent. The quiet of Tokyo, Japan is amazing. Whisper quiet trucks and busses. | ||
| Mountainstorm |
That is a well crafted letter. Let's hope letters still make a difference. | ||
| Maul |
A law like this is already in effect here in Maine. I heard the legislature wanted to completely ban all aftermarket exhausts, but they re-worded the law to say bikes can't have exhausts that are louder than stock. Which effectively bans ALL aftermarket exhausts. I am not sure how they are going to enforce it since the police here do not have decibel meters. | ||
| Cowboytutt |
Very good letter Natty! -Tutt | ||
| Froggy |
Very nice letter Nat! Tut, you misinterpreted my last post. I don't want to see see more useless and redundant laws come into effect. I personally don't care where you live what you do with your bike, as that is your choice. I just simply hate loud pipes, and so do many others. | ||
| Cowboytutt |
I'm sorry I misunderstood, Froggy. No hard feelings. I do understand how you feel some. Up until 3 years ago I lived in Hollister, CA, home of the Hollister 4th of July Biker Rally. The local residents HATED it, and I have to admit, the bikes were over the top loud, louder than all but MotoGP bikes. They would go by, and the windows of homes would shake. The word LOUD is a reletive term! However, the rest of the time Hollister was a peaceful place just like Ukiah, CA. I'm sure you have heard the talk about splitting CA into two states, North and South, because of the differences between the two. Its for this reason that this draconian law is too far over-reaching. Let local communities enforce the existing laws on the books as they see fit. I totally agree with your notion of "yet another useless law on the books". Thanks Froggy. -Tutt | ||
| Cowboytutt |
BTT just because its important to CA residents! -Tutt | ||
| Nattyx1 |
Thanks to all who wrote kind words about the letter I sent. Great thing about this country is we can go up against a Senator with a virtriolic letter and not end up in jail for it. Bad thing about this country is that we can write letters like that and 99.99999999999 percent of the time it's pissing in a well.  | ||
| Kirb |
Noise regs are only going to get tougher, just like DUI laws. They wouldn't get tougher if people were not complaining. Bikers are doing it to themselves by running straight pipe harleys or piped sport bikes without being resonable with how loud they are. Non-bikers don't want to hear your bike. Period. Just like they didn't like to hear a V-8 with a pair of glass-packs when I was a kid (they cracked down then, too). Daytona took action this year and were only ticketing people who were complete a-holes about how they were riding. Running wide open straight pipes at 2am down a 'burb is not how you make people like riders. | ||
| Crabby |
Tutt, but local businesses made BANK. 100k people decended on Hollister. Im over in Monterey... It was a huge boon for the local economy, and its one day a year. Too bad its been cancled for what? 2 years? |
