| Author | Message | ||
     Pwillikers |
Here's a pic (courtesy of the aprilia forum) of a $140. rewind that looks great, done by: Custom Rewind, http://www.customrewind.com 2014 Pratt Hwy Birmingham, AL, 35214 phone: 800-798-7282 <image>http://cyb.smugmug.com/photos/581370156_3wQux-XL-1 .jpg</image> And, another source for motorbike rewound stators. They don't make one for the 1125... yet. But, they have a very good collection of technical articles on motorcycle electrics.: http://www.electrosport.com/street/stators.php Tech article example on "how stators work": http://www.electrosport.com/technical-resources/li brary/articles/motorcycle-stators.php | ||
| Pdccd |
Nice job guys. I used electrosport info for my gs425 stator troubleshooting. Great resource. I tried to buy the super stator I used to fix the bike from them but they didn't have any in stock. I'm sure If any of these manufactures knew of the issue they'd be all over it and we'd have a cost effective solution to the problem. Indecently, the parts I ended up getting I sourced from a few different places and they all appeared to be identical, so I suspect one large manufacturer and several company's retailing them as theirs. | ||
| Pdccd |
Nice job guys. I used electrosport info for my gs425 stator troubleshooting. Great resource. I tried to buy the super stator I used to fix the bike from them but they didn't have any in stock. I'm sure If any of these manufactures knew of the issue they'd be all over it and we'd have a cost effective solution to the problem. Incidentally, the parts I ended up getting I sourced from a few different places and they all appeared to be identical, so I suspect one large manufacturer and several company's retailing them as theirs. | ||
| Jdugger |
> The harness is a HACK PATCH that doesn't fix the real issue of stator overheating You won't get an argument from me about that. I've got an 09, and I don't plan on doing it. Still, the evidence is overwhelming that a lot of problems on these bikes can be solved by riding the piss out of them. And, for the curious, I know for a fact on the '08 models the regulator does not just shunt to ground unused current. On early SV650s, one would blow up a regulator when they went to "race mode" -- removing all the lights, etc. The regulator would actually overheat. My 08 regulator stays cool to the touch now, with hardly any electrical accessory on the bike since I pulled all the lights and street equipment. | ||
| Pwillikers |
Where is the overwhelming evidence? Have all those that have experienced stator failures ridden them easily at low RPMs? This is clearly the assumption that HD is addressing with the harness hack but I've seen no data, other than Froggy's anecdotal assertions, that consistent low RPM operation is the predominant failure mode. Froggy, another poll question? "If you've experienced a stator failure, how would you characterize your riding style? 1. Babied (rarely operated above 5K RPM), 2. Easy, 3. Moderate, 4. Aggressive, 5. Race. | ||
| Freezerburn840 |
Hd claims 5,000 is the magic RPM number all I know is mine failed at 4,000 miles. Not all the time did I keep it above 5,000. Sometimes I was cruising at 75 in 6th. That is around 4500 rpm. I did that a lot but also was pushing it to 6,000 to 8,000 in the first 4 gears. I have done some canyon carving in the first 3 gears at various rpm ranges and speeds. I will admit most of my bike's life has been spent commuting. Its not a luxury for me thats for sure. There is one BadWebber that has had 4 stator failures in 24,000 miles his name is Naiguy. Actually I think he lives right around the corner from me. He has been doing a lot of canyon carving. He needs to jump in and explain more of his riding style. Because I am beginning to believe that 5,000 and above rpm range is a myth. Having said that. He is the exception and I pray to the motorcycle gods we don't have to encounter anything what he has been through. A lot of us have encountered only 1. I want to hear from people with multiple stator failures if any or at least riding styles so we can once and for all debunk this myth of (over 5,000 rpm). Do they see a lot of traffic (stop and go)? Are they on the freeway a lot doing more constant speeds? Are they doing canyon carving or track days? (Message edited by freezerburn840 on May 27, 2010) | ||
| Jdugger |
Your study isn't likely to collect reliable data. What's your definition of canyon carving, for example? Just look at the tires threads: some guys get less than 1,000 out of the same rear tire others get 7,000 out of. Is there any chance both rider's perceptions of "taking it easy" are even in the same universe? Even when I ride in town, I keep the revs up. I have three of these bikes. An 08 with 40,000 miles which have been about 30k country roads and canyon carving, and 10k balls out track days. That motor is decidedly tired at this point, but there have been no stator or electrical issues. I did have to replace the front cyl intake cam and finger follower when the facing/plating wore off one. I have a second 08 with about 9k on it. All canyon carving and 2 or 3 track days. No issues other than the usual blinkers and mirrors and other minor niggles all well reported. I have an 09 with about 3k on it. Almost all track days with a 3-hour highway trip to break it in. None are having eletrical problems. All post 14+ volts when running, even at idle. It's an electrical fact a stator servicing equal current draws will see more load/heat at lower operating RPMs. If the stator wasn't tested for extended periods of high load at low RPMs, such as a commuter on cuty streets taking it easy with a short ride to work and back every day (always charging the battery from the draw of the motor start), yea, I can easily see where the low RPMs are an issue. | ||
| Freezerburn840 |
Sorry let me add. Which I did not specify. "09" owners need to chime in. The stator questions for 08 owners need not apply. Your 09 has got 3,000 miles with no problems thats awesome. Just let us know when it does fail. (Message edited by freezerburn840 on May 27, 2010) | ||
| Freezerburn840 |
About the electrical draw you are right. Its funny however that Froggy's bike failed at around 8,000 miles and he hypermills. Mine failed at 4,000 miles. With more aggressive riding. Maybe weather plays a part. He is in a colder climate. I'm in a warmer climate mine is going to see excessive heat. I dont know. The bottom line is his failed mine failed. Its a problem in the 09 models. Maybe the study won't solve things but at least HD realizes there is an issue and they put out a so called service bulletin upgrade B.S. that needs to be a recall plain and simple. If there wasnt an issue there would be no bulletin at all and just be ignored. (Message edited by freezerburn840 on May 27, 2010) (Message edited by freezerburn840 on May 27, 2010) | ||
| Duphuckincati |
I've only got 2500 miles on my 09 CR, stay out of town with it and usually run 4-8 grand most of the time. But I keep the high beam on all the time. Have not done harness yet. Confused as to doing the harness or not. Any opinions? | ||
| Freezerburn840 |
I say wait until it fails you may have existing damage already. Stator and harness done at the same time is better than taking it in and getting the harness done now and having the stator fail later which is what happened to Froggy and maybe some others. Also go to the May 24th archive in this thread I posted a link from Erik Buell Racing. | ||
| Jdugger |
I'm starting to wonder if buying an '08 regulator off someone's wad-up and putting it on the 09 might be a good idea... | ||
| Freezerburn840 |
I asked a similar question to Erik Buell Racing but it wasnt the regulator it was the Stator of an 08 model just dropping in they said "no remedy". 1. This issue will take R&D from Harley 2. Out of the R&D there needs to be an updated Stator. I do applaud the few gentlemen on here going to extra lengths on doing their own R&D and finding sources that do either rebuild or do in fact produce them from the ground up. That's exactly what is needed. A brand new redeveloped Stator that can handle different conditions. That won't fail so quickly. I understand a Stator is a mechanical item and mechanicl items fail. But not at this rate. Plain and simple not at this rate. | ||
| Jdugger |
Stator is different. What I'm thinking is present the stator a lower load outright -- specifically a different regulator that simply draws less current. | ||
| Freezerburn840 |
Got ya. Anything at this point would be great. The 08's have less current and they seem to be holding up fine. | ||
| Hildstrom |
The stator is oil cooled; right? If so, is that chamber full of oil or does it just splash around? It seems you could do something with oil flow to improve stator cooling. It could be as simple as changing the rotor shape with drilled holes or cut fins to circulate more oil. It also seems these bikes could benefit from a fan on the oil cooler when sitting in traffic. I know how ridiculously hot my bike gets as a result of the radiator layout and sitting still. My coolant temp got up to 205-210 the other day when it was 90 ambient and I was at a traffic light. I can only imagine what the oil temperature was. I think it would not take too many of these temperature spikes to cook a stator regardless of riding style. Also, in another thread, someone suggested changing regulators to draw less stator current: http://www.cycleelectricinc.com/RECTIFIER.html | ||
| Fast1075 |
The charging system is a fixed field system. (read that as the magnetic field is supplied by permanent magnets that never vary in field intensity). With a fixed field system there are only three things that affect current output. A: engine RPM...B: Loads (ignition system, lighting, acessories)...and C: The ability of the "voltage regulator" to shunt excess current to ground through heat sinked resistors....the regulator cannot "make" the system produce more current, that is a function of engine speed and the soundness of the charging system. I haven't seen a failed stator myself, but one possibility that seems to be overlooked is stator hum which can cause the insulation to fail...maybe that's part of the problem....another thing is if there are problems with electrical connections, the result will be over heating at the connection. (like the ever infamous "77" connector in xb's.) Just sayin' | ||
| Cmmfiremedic |
All of yall are really worrying me about my bike. I have a 2009 that has 11,300 miles on it and most of my riding has been under 5000 rpms. I am going on a several thousand mile trip in 2 weeks. I hope it holds together. | ||
| Freezerburn840 |
Me too. | ||
| Kevin_stevens |
"It also seems these bikes could benefit from a fan on the oil cooler when sitting in traffic. I know how ridiculously hot my bike gets as a result of the radiator layout and sitting still. My coolant temp got up to 205-210 the other day when it was 90 ambient and I was at a traffic light. I can only imagine what the oil temperature was. I think it would not take too many of these temperature spikes to cook a stator regardless of riding style. " But those temperatures are absolutely typical of liquid-cooled sport bikes. Every 2000-up one I've had ran 170-180 on the highway, 210-215 in traffic, and started panicking at ~240 (none of mine actually got to that point). So this has been the industry norm for a decade, designers and suppliers should be calibrated to it. KeS | ||
| Freezerburn840 |
Kevin is right I had an 08 Fz1. I saw 215 in stop n go traffic. Normal running temps was around 180 to 200. Actually the Buell runs a tad bit cooler. I've never seen mine go above 205. | ||
| Jdugger |
That and in the summer, I regularly have mine so hot the temp light comes on during sessions. And, session after session, weekend after weekend, I run the bike to the point it's so hot it noticeably loses power. We are talking 240+ hot here. | ||
| Freezerburn840 |
240. holy crap!! That's Xb style temps. Was that the original flash on the 08's? I heard they had cooling issues in the very beginning? Or is that the 09? (Message edited by freezerburn840 on May 27, 2010) | ||
| Jdugger |
Take your pick, I can make any of the bikes do it. When it's 100F outside and you ride WFO for 30 minutes, the thing gets hot. Runs cooler with water instead of glycol as coolant and with the race ECM, but the thing still gets hot. | ||
| Freezerburn840 |
Wow! yep you are taking the bike to its limits. | ||
| Xbud |
I had a Ducati ST4 that consistently ran from 195 to 225 no matter what the ambient temputure is. Never had any electrical problems. | ||
| Dipstick |
Checked my voltage at idle after a long canyon carving session, 13.2v. After 60 seconds it was down to 12.8v. No accessories on at any point in the ride. During the ride home at 75mph+ in 6th it showed 13.4v-13.2v. Have never used a battery tender. I live in south Texas and it's hot this time of year. 09R, 8000mi. Have had no harness up-grade yet. What do yall think, is mine about to die? Have never had any starting problems. | ||
| Tpoppa |
This looks to be a good site for stator repair: http://www.rmstator.com/ They list Aprilia, but not Buell. But they say they repair all makes and models and offer same day service for about $150. | ||
| Freight_dog |
I had the harness done after the bike died. I told Western Reserve that the stator was probably fried, which should have been obvious since I had to have the bike towed. They didn't tell me all that they did just "your bike is ready!". I don't think they did the stator. I have about 1,200 miles since the upgrade with no problems yet. However, it drops down into the mid 12V range during stop and go traffic in 85 degree heat. It goes back between 13.0 and 13.7 on the move occasionally going to 13.9 briefly. I am thinking the stators days may be numbered. I will be pissed if I get stranded far from home after I told them about it. Edited to add: most of my riding is below 5000 rpm in suburban hell with the occasional high speed freeway run. (Message edited by Freight_dog on May 27, 2010) | ||
| Puddlepirate |
After closely watching mine over the past week or so I have not seen anything lower than 13.7. Most of my riding is below 5K, probably 95% of it, including a lot of city stop and go riding. |
