| Author | Message | ||
     Arcticcr |
Easy, Since you’ve spend what is perhaps the most saddle time tuning our bikes, I was wondering if you could shed some insight on the linked post. http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/290 431/557250.html?1271711055 For me this is in no way a pissing match of Caps work. In fact, I applaud his creativity and effort. However, I would like to validate the mod by quantifiable means. Thanks, Jay | ||
| Freezerburn840 |
Try this out. www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/290431/523 795.html | ||
| Freezerburn840 |
Highscore touches base on the temp changes even though IAT sensor is not mentioned. Dec. 27th 2009 post 8:34am (Message edited by freezerburn840 on April 21, 2010) | ||
| Ratsmc |
Isn't Easyrider on a tour of the US right now? | ||
| Captain_america |
He Should be .... Ya i got the idea of moving the senor to get the reading correct from Highscore and this thread: http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/290 431/549073.html?1269321108 | ||
| Captain_america |
I would like to see it verified if possible too! | ||
| Ccryder |
Easyrider is still in NL till May 3rd or 4th. | ||
| Easyrider |
Arcticcr, I only would reccomand to do this when you are 100% sure, that you have a correct fuel map, based on these readings. When the IAT sensor is reading colder air temps, It will correct les, and is able to consume more fuel. More fuel i smore Power, so when you add fuel on the new location IAT reading you will have more power that is correct. Only when you do this on a stock 1125 with the stock fuel map, it is asking for more jurkey feeling, on some places very lean fuel conditions, and not a better riding bike. So for the people who would like to do this be aware of the problems and bad riding that can occure. --------------------------------------------- We all go back to the design of the first XB9 models with the hole in the frame for cold air. Is still the best frame for the bike... (Message edited by easyrider on April 22, 2010) | ||
| 1_mike |
Easyrider posts - ""We all go back to the design of the first XB9 models with the hole in the frame for cold air."" I agree. But most go and screw THAT up by drilling holes in the inner cover... to let engine heated air into the "little" throttle body! Just proves the...monkey see, monkey do...theory. Not meaning to be derogatory to anyone...but.... Mike | ||
| Mountainstorm |
Like my mama Rosanne Rosannadan used to say: "If it's not one thing it's another." I had to try this out and found that relocating to the airbox raised the reported temperature, not lowered it. If you want to "cheat" the ECU put the IAT sensor on the fairing where it reads right at ambient all the time. But when moving at 45mph or better the snorkel location is only reading 2-3F higher than ambient anyway. Hardly worth it IMO. | ||
| Captain_america |
Fingerless Captain Types! Mountain, you misunderstood the reason for me relocating the sensor it seems.... Kevin_Stevens said it correctly... I am NOT trying to fool the ECU, I am trying to make it accurately see the correct temp of the air being ingested into the motor. I think that the location at the snorkel reads too hot when not moving and too cool while moving. Air passes by the IAT sensor at the snorkel while moving but does NOT necessarily go into the intake or motor. Example: Stock... we know the radiators blow hot air towards the intake. This is reflected by the stock IAT location. With my mod this is not show by the IAT because the motor is not actually ingesting all of that hot air, some yes, all... no I think the air box in it entirety heats soaks slightly which is shown by my mod which shows what the motor is taking in. Whatever temp air happens to be by the stock location is show and is what the ECU thinks is going in but is not true. | ||
| Mountainstorm |
I understand what you want: a true reading of the air temp entering the throttle bodies. But a lower temp to the IAT is going to make better power in my opinion. I can understand wanting to avoid a false high temp from the radiators and so on at low speeds, but not at the cost of less fuel when underway (in comparison to the stock location). Not sure how much difference 10F really makes so it's probably not critical. | ||
| Lampo |
Moving the IAT will have -0- affect on the actual AF ratio that the bike runs at, as the narrowband O2 sensor feedback has the last say and ultimate control of A/F ratio in closed loop operation. Unless you are riding on a closed course or jammin on some mountain roads, you spend over 85% of your riding time in closed loop (typical). Running in open loop (above about 70 TPS 8-bit RAW) would be the only area you may see (not feel) an effect on the actual A/F ratio by moving the IAT sensor. Monitoring via the real time data capabilities of this ECM, you can watch the air temperature compensation changes while monitoring the A/F ratio with a wideband, and the swings in temperature(and the corresponding AT compensation) have absolutely no effect on the A/F Ratio, or how the bike runs in closed loop. Those O2 sensors are in control based on the ECM programming. Sorry guys, you're wasting your effort and drilling holes in good parts. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
Running in open loop (above about 70 TPS 8-bit RAW) would be the only area you may see (not feel) an effect on the actual A/F ratio by moving the IAT sensor. And moving at those speeds will surely have the snorkel sensor providing the lower of the two temps.--versus the airbox sensor location. | ||
| Kevin_stevens |
Tx Lampo that's very informative. :thumbsup So where can I relocate my IAT so it actually shows me somthing useful like how hot it is outside?  KeS (Message edited by kevin_stevens on April 22, 2010) | ||
| Gemini |
So where can I relocate my IAT so it actually shows me somthing useful like how hot it is outside? i prefer the ass crack method. if my ass crack is sweating, it's hot, if it is shivering, it's cold. (Message edited by gemini on April 22, 2010) (Message edited by gemini on April 22, 2010) | ||
| Ratsmc |
Lampo, if correct, that is useful info. That said, Even if I was running at the track and using way more throttle, my temp reading was still really high. and this fixed that problem. | ||
| Mountainstorm |
Awesome post Lampo. Where can the rest of us learn these dark arts of understanding the Buell ECM? | ||
| Mrbuell |
For what I know the buell never really goes into a closed loop. The single wire o2 sensors are just switching to a different map. This info was given to me by EBR. A true closed loop allows for complete fuell adjustment. So you would need to tune for an exhaust. Exaple is the BMW K 1200s. The PC V with auto tune is another example of making a closed loop. On hayabusa we move the IAT. To the ram air Tunis to read coer air and it does help in extreme heat like Arizona. I would lime to know if works on a 1125r | ||
| Dannybuell |
I missed again, the o2 sensors rule the roost. | ||
| Mountainstorm |
Yay more conflicting expert opinions.  | ||
| Gemini |
it does go into a closed loop mode. it doesn't go into "another map". it adjust afv up or down. the misunderstand comes in that the 1 afv shifts the fuel trim up or down across the whole map. modern cars use multiple cells across the fuel map to adjust smaller portions up or down. |
