| Author | Message | ||
     Jleblanc26 |
heres an article on the the KTM superduke joining the field of daytona sportbike this weekend. http://www.amaproracing.com/rr/news/index.cfm?cid= 22830 | ||
| Fresnobuell |
the more the merrier. | ||
| Slaughter |
If AMA has approved it, then certainly IS possible. It'd fit right in. | ||
| Madav8tr |
Ehh, no big deal. The Super Duke isn't any competition for the Buell or the 600's in the class. | ||
| Freight_dog |
Actually, it could be competition if they get a good rider. It is a pretty serious bike and is more track oriented by design than the Buell. It has a similar real power output to the 1125R and according to the magazines, has even worse part throttle response. On track though, they say it is a scalpel. I am curious to see how it can do. | ||
| Krassh |
There has been a guy posting over on the ktmtalk forums about his racing a superduke in AFM. Has done well against some of the competition. http://ktmtalk.com/index.php?showtopic=340873 Might not be able to view this if not a member. | ||
| Krassh |
The guy in this write up goes by the handle Go Go on ktmtalk and will be racing the superduke in the Sportbike class at Laguna Seca this weekend. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
Actually, it could be competition if they get a good rider. It is a pretty serious bike and is more track oriented by design than the Buell. It has a similar real power output to the 1125R and according to the magazines, has even worse part throttle response. On track though, they say it is a scalpel. I am curious to see how it can do. Sounds like you are thinking RC-8, not the same as the Super Duke. I don't think the Buell has anything to worry about. | ||
| R2s |
Eric Gulbrason, sporting the #394 for Tri-City Moto will be riding it. | ||
| Jdugger |
The Duke more track oriented than the 1125r? What pipe are you smokin?  The Duke is an awesome motorcycle, probably the most fun of any motorcycle on the road for hooligan antics! But it's an upright naked with handlebars! It's more like a Touno than an RSVR, or Lightening vs Firebolt, to make the association. The Duke will not be competitive at high speeds just because without a fairing at all it's got real wind problems. | ||
| Ron_luning |
Yeah, why not the RC8 for racing? | ||
| Zac4mac |
I was talking to the owner of one of the dynos here that Loretta posted 128 HP on. He had another "shoot-out" that I missed b/c of work and an RC8 showed up. Box-stock it was around 140 HP. yikes. Z | ||
| Dobieg2002 |
The RC8 is an 1148cc 75 v-twin 151hp @ 10000 rpm, looks like their drive train doesn't loose as much HP. 405lbs dry MSRP $19,743. The RC8R is 1195cc 75 v-twin 170hp @ 10,250 rpm 401lbs dry Don't know the MSRP. For the Price I think the 1125r (146hp @ 9800 rpm. 375lbs dry MSRP $11,995) is a great deal. I think it could hold it's own vs. the RC8, especially if I could take the extra $8k and go chain drive, full fairing, race ecm and exhaust. http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2008/03/27/buell -1125r-takes-2nd-and-5th-in-first-race/ I don't think the SuperDuke (118.00 HP @ 9000 RPM 410lbs dry MSRP $15,598) stands much of a chance. (Message edited by dobieg2002 on July 01, 2009) | ||
| Reepicheep |
Geesh, the RC8 is really pushing $20k? What a shame. So it's an exotic like the 1098 then... then, not really a "normal motorcycle"... I've been wishing the KTM's would be mixing it up in the new AMA classes. It'd be fun to see them in there with the rest. | ||
| Elvis |
I think the interesting thing about the Sportbike class is it gives KTM, Aprilia (and BMW though they haven't taken advantage of it) the opportunity to race in the sport-bike class, develop teams, learn the tracks etc. without jumping into Superbike. If KTM is thinking about racing an RC8 in Superbike next year, it makes sense for them to get their feet wet here. As for how competitive it will be, like the 1125R, it has nearly twice the displacement of the 600's, so the people who feel the Buell has an unfair advantage should feel the same way about the KTM. Realistically, with a great team and a great rider I think it could be competitive. I don't know much about the rider or team, but I'd guess they'll have some learning to do before they're threatening for a podium. | ||
| Dobieg2002 |
I think the RC8 is a great bike, it looks great has really impressive technology... but it is probably too big for sportbike (bigger than 1125)and too small for superbike... I think the RC8R should be competitive in Superbike if they decide to go that way. It has been successful in the Int.German SBK. http://www.ktm.com/Standings.102152.0.html I honestly think Buell should make an 119X superbike to compete. | ||
| Freight_dog |
Actually, it could be competition if they get a good rider. It is a pretty serious bike and is more track oriented by design than the Buell. It has a similar real power output to the 1125R and according to the magazines, has even worse part throttle response. On track though, they say it is a scalpel. I am curious to see how it can do. Sounds like you are thinking RC-8, not the same as the Super Duke. I don't think the Buell has anything to worry about. No, I am indeed talking about the Super Duke R. About 120hp, similar to the latest flash Buells, and it is a very track oriented bike. Much like a Tuono is a straight up naked RSV-R. There is a reason they introduced the SD with a race series. KTM is not building roadsters here. On the other hand, the Buell is a street bike adapted for the track. Good riders have been lapping tracks in Supersport competitive times on Super Dukes. I see no reason for it to not be competitive. The naked bike argument doesn't hold water either. Isn't the stock 1125 only half faired? Yet they seemed to be fully faired on the track. How can this be?!?! I seriously don't think the coefficient of drag on a Buell is all that much better than a Super Duke, most fully faired bikes this side of a Streamliner are pretty aerodynamically dirty. | ||
| Dobieg2002 |
SuperDuke R is only 999cc and 120hp at the Crank not the wheel and it is heavy +25 lbs compared to the 1125. I think it will compete, but not very well (Aprilia RSV 1000). | ||
| Freight_dog |
No, they dyno 120 or better. For example, this is the very first one I looked up. http://www.superduke.net/forum/album_pic.php?pic_i d=1072 And the real world weight on these is about 435 wet IIRC, which isn't much lighter than a fueled 1125, but it is lighter. | ||
| Dobieg2002 |
I guess KTM's site is inaccurate then... Hope it is competitive. My calculation was off 97kw = 131hp but 410 lbs w/o fuel Regular duke is 88kw = 119hp 410 lbs w/o fuel http://www.ktm.com/990-Super-Duke-R.100777.20.html ?&detailview=2&cHash=da62385a81 | ||
| Bikejunky |
I wouldn't under estimate that LC8 Motor. I have seen that thing tuned to the nuts for hill climb bikes and trust me, there is a lot of potential in that power plant, just as much as there is in the Helicon. | ||
| Spike |
Unless you get the model that Motorcyclist did. Theirs only put down 103hp: http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/features/122_070 5_bmw_r1200r_ktm_990_superduke_comparison/index.ht ml Even their SuperDuke R only put down 118hp: http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/features/122_081 1_2008_harley_xr1200_vs_ktm_superduke_990_r/photo_ 17.html Or the Sport Rider version which put down 102.7hp: http://www.sportrider.com/performance_numbers/146_ sportbike_dyno_charts/photo_115.html Or the MCNews version, which put down 110hp: http://www.mcnews.com.au/Testing/KTM/2005_ktm_supe rduke_990/dyno.htm | ||
| Dobieg2002 |
I think it will be competitive as it is in the same class, but I don't think it will be able to threaten the 1125 or 600s. I'm not underestimating the LC8, but I think KTM does or there would'nt be a need for an RC8 with an 1148cc engine, they would have gone with the 999cc for the RC8 Also I am not knocking KTM I would love to have an RC8 parked next to my 1125r, but the price way over my head. (Message edited by dobieg2002 on July 02, 2009) | ||
| Mtmansl |
This bike led a Moto-St Race last year at Road America so it can't be too down on power. Matthew | ||
| Fresnobuell |
This bike led a Moto-St Race last year at Road America so it can't be too down on power. Moto-ST has HP-limited classes. The 1125r has to actually be de-tuned to run in the premier Moto-ST class. All the bikes run roughly at the same HP. | ||
| Freight_dog |
Spike, the Motorcyclist bike and the others in the 103 hp range were SuperDukes, not the SuperDuke R. Different bike. Like the difference between a Ducati 1098 and a 1098R. 118 for a SuperDuke R. Yes, that is pretty close to 120. I've seen people on this forum dyno those same numbers with their 1125s. If you check out the SuperDuke forum, they have a whole photo gallery of dyno charts. I am sure no one intends to race a straight SuperDuke. (Message edited by freight_dog on July 02, 2009) (Message edited by freight_dog on July 02, 2009) | ||
| Coolice |
Moto GT-1 hp limit this year 130 hp. GT-2 95 hp. | ||
| Trojan |
The Super Duke isn't any competition for the Buell or the 600's in the class. Don't you believe it. If they come into it with a good rider and decent support package they will be competitive. (KTM don't race to lose). The Superduke and Superduke R are exactly the same in engine spec, with the only differences being chassis and brakes. I find it ridiculous that the AMA will allow the Superduke, a naked roadster, to race in sportbike but won't allow the RC8 into the same class. As the RC8 is far more similar in spec to the 1125 and RSVR1000 than the Superduke, maybe they are scared it will win The RC8R is the Superbike variant and differs a lot from the standard RC8 in much the same way the 1098R differs from the 'cooking' 1098S (larger capacity, more power 190bhp@10,500rpm etc) so the stock RC8 should be allowed into Sportbike surely? (Message edited by trojan on July 03, 2009) | ||
| Madav8tr |
"Don't you believe it." Damn straight I believe it. I have ridden both the "R" and the regular Superduke and comparing them to my 1125R tells me all I need to know. I actually decided on buying the 1125R AFTER test riding the Superduke R at Barbers last year. I wanted the SD so bad up until I actually rode one. The handling was fine but it was an absolute DOG in the power department. Not to mention lack of a fairing on a motorcycle that was going to see a lot of track time was factor also. "If they come into it with a good rider and decent support package they will be competitive. (KTM don't race to lose)." We aren't talking about GNCC racing, we are talking about a support class in a national roadrace series. Hell, other than the small 2 stroke GP bikes and the European KTM Specific race series, what roadracing success does KTM have at this point? Hell, Aprilia doesn't "race to lose" either but they are having trouble find the podium in the Sportbike class. Oddly though they actually field a competitive race bike in the WSBK series. Like I said before, IMO, the KTM isn't any competition for the Buell or the 600s in the Sportbike class. | ||
| Trojan |
Hell, other than the small 2 stroke GP bikes and the European KTM Specific race series, what roadracing success does KTM have at this point? KTM are active and at the top of the leaderboard in pretty much every off road discipline, including winning teh Paris Dakar rally more often than any other manufacturer. They are competing in roadracing in German Superbike, World Superstock, Italian Superstock, British KTM RC8 cup, South African Superbike and BoTT, French Supertwins, countless one make KTM superduke and RC8 series, MotoGP 125 and Red Bull Rookies series and now the AMA Daytona Sportbike series. Until they pulled out this year they were top GP250 class runners with numerous race wins to their credit. Not bad for a manufacturer that madeits first road bike less than 4 years ago! In other words, a lot more roadracing success than Buell have. I am sure that KTM will race the RC8R in World superbikes next year too, so don't write them off just yet or judge their performance on what a relatively small dealer team can put together to run in the weird and wonderful Daytona Sportbike class. (Message edited by trojan on July 03, 2009) |
