| Author | Message | ||
     Clbofaz |
Fellow Buellers, I have a dilemma on my hands. I own a 05 Firebolt and I was able to talk myself into the below deal for a 08 1125r. It sounds like an awesome deal but would like to use my fellow riders as a soundboard. There is a time limit on my decision, 4pm TOMORROW (SUN)! 1125R base: $8,995.00 Freight: $897 Prep: $588 Tax (8.1%): 484.43 Doc: 399.95 Reg & Lic: $216.33 Total deal: $11,581.34 Trade in for 05 Firebolt: $4,500 Harley loan for difference: 36months @ 3.99% = $209.09 monthly payment. The base price was due to them honoring an incorrectly stated price online and the loan terms are legit as on Buells website. So, fellow riders, does all of this look good? Anything seem odd? | ||
| Cydejob |
I would shop around. I just bought a 09 for a few hundred more than you have listed and they threw in a helmet,shirts,$350 gift card. My apr was 4.99 @ 48months. just my 2 cents | ||
| Brapbrapbrap |
Sell you firebolt on Craigs list for a thousand more, and have the dealer adjust all those fees to $9,000 total plus tax. ___________________________________ Disclaimer; BrapBrapBrap does not currently own an 1125 but looks forward to getting a water cooled Buell. If your hatred toward Brapbrapbrap last more than four hours consult your physician. Warning most Customers will read on the internet to learn more about a product before making a major purchase.Brapbrapbrap comments are his own and in no way reflects the opinions of BMC or its affiliates. Brapbrapbrap, loves motorcycles and is not a troll. Brap believes in free speech to add and also is honest and sincere and does not like hyperbole | ||
| Christiankid3 |
+1 on shopping around. I got an 09 for about $750 less than that, plus they gave me $5000 for my 04 Firebolt. (Message edited by Christiankid3 on May 30, 2009) | ||
| Stevasaurus |
$400 for documentation fees?!? | ||
| Ekruizenga |
Don't do it, shop around. Sell your bike on Craigs list, or at least try that first. I just got an 09 for a little more than that, plus the first couple of service thrown in, plus gear. | ||
| Clbofaz |
I believed this was a good deal until I got so many mixed reviews (here and elsewhere). It seems that 3 of the above posters got '09's for 9K out the door? That's pretty sick awesome. Or did any of you mean the total deal of 11.5K? Because there are a quite a bit of fees on there (at least 2K) that can make a heck of a difference. Please clarify. I just don't want to think this is a good deal and end up seeing a better one in 2 weeks (or months) when I'm not even looking. Especially given the economy's state. Then again, the dealer sold about 4 bikes while I was waiting for them to run my info over 2-3hrs... Lastly, any one think a better deal could be gotten with cash/HD loan rather than a trade in? Figured they would be willing to give a better deal if they had cash as opposed to trying to flip my bike back onto the market... Thanks fellow riders. | ||
| Fierrosc |
Your not going to get it for 9K out the door as the new 2009's are going for about $9,995.00 so it looks like they are making up the difference in all those fees, should be like $500.00 for both freight and prep and $16.00 for docs and $70.00 for tags. I'm suprised they didn't make you buy an extended warranty and pre-paid maintenance for another couple grand. -Chris | ||
| Fierrosc |
Oh and have I seen this before . . . "The base price was due to them honoring an incorrectly stated price online" . . . that's like the oldest trick in the book, I'd call around, you don't have to go into the dealer to negotiate a deal. | ||
| Clbofaz |
Yeah, I thought that might be BS after I saw the same bike for the same base price at another dealer about 100 miles away. Apparently they have the same web dev, lol. To think I actually got pumped up over it. Too bad there's not a means for consumers to easily discern what are reasonable ranges for the various fees dealers can manipulate, not to mention for the bikes themselves! Thanks again fellow bueller's... | ||
| Redbuelljunkie |
Over $2,100 in fees is not a good deal- they're playing a game with you. Shipping should be $400-$500, prep $100-$200, Doc fees $100-$200, and registration $100. Using their numbers they've built about $1,100 profit into the deal disguised as "fees". It's dishonest, but common. If I were to do business with this dealer, and I'm not sure I would, I would sit down and go over the numbers in detail. Given the $8,995 asking price, I would not accept less than $5,000 for your trade- that leaves a $3,995 balance. You then add $1,000 in reasonable fee allowance and $400 in tax, and end up with $5,395 difference. Remember, when trading you are only taxed on the difference, and the tag transfer fee is much less than buying a new tag. If they give you a hassle over your trade and $5,395, or an out-the-door price of $10,500 with no trade- I would walk away. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
You are doing good with your trade in at $4,500--that's getting close to the retail value of the bike (unless it has extremely low miles or something non-stock that adds value.) You may be able to squeeze an extra grand out of it by selling privately--but it could take a while and Buell doesn't have a huge market of potential buyers. I do agree that some of the fees seem exorbitant--especially the shipping. Seems like they are offsetting the great retail price with higher add-on fees. | ||
| Ron_luning |
Just like when buying a car, don't ever go into a dealership and talk about any price other than "out the door". That out the door price includes absolutely everything including the vehicle, shipping, documentation, prep, the first tank of gas, and taxes. Of course comparing your out the door price to one that other people have paid depends on state sales tax. Some states have none, while others have over 8%. Having a trade in hurts you as the buyer because the dealership has that to hold over your head while working out a price. You would be better off just unloading the bike as fast as possible in the private market. Even if you get the same as what the dealership was going to give you for a trade in, you haven't lost anything right? Then you can remove that variable from the bargaining process. If you look around, and then talk to a dealer with the intent and ability to make a purchase, I'd be pretty sure you could find an 09 model for that same price. | ||
| Xnoahx |
Just adding more reinforcement to the deal. The base price is good but the fees are way too high. Freight from Buell is $255. Prep is a dealer price but IMHO $400 is the upper limit of that. The doc fees are retarded. Where I work we have a $55 doc fee. Things like tax and licensing are going to vary from state to state so when somoone on here says that licensing should only be $100 don't listen to them because they probably live in Florida and not AZ where you are. Seems like they are either trying to make up for the 'error' in the pricing or they just have high fees. Also, your tax number seems really low. It should be closer to $730 at 8.1%. The bike is pretty much at cost right now and they might want to move it but its up to them. Get about $1200 off those fees and you are looking at a very solid deal for your area. | ||
| Clbofaz |
For the most part I'm ok with the trade in value, given the hassle associate with selling the bike myself and the fact that its been in an accident and has 17K miles w/ a few extras, $4500 aint bad. However, I understand that you cant usually negotiate as well when you have a trade in as they have to try and flip your bike, so to speak. What irks me is the crazy fees added onto the deal. Understandably, it is a dealer, but these expenses are never seen in private party sales, and rightly so - I mean a grand for shipping? What are they doing, putting each bike on each 18 wheeler? And as others have pointed out prep/doc fees are BS, they should call them pure profit - just like that fancy pin stripping you get on a new car that always seems to cost several grand.... but can be removed at your request. Once again, thank for helping me decide fellow buellers... | ||
| Redbuelljunkie |
but these expenses are never seen in private party sales, and rightly so Correct, and you don't get charged freight and set-up when buying used from a dealer, either. By law, a dealer must collect tax and any fees associated with title/license. When buying from a private seller, the buyer is responsible for tax/title/license fees- these charges do not miraculously disappear in private deals. And as others have pointed out prep/doc fees are BS As has been correctly pointed out by those of us who have actually worked for dealerships, prep/set-up fees are absolutely real and should be added to the total cost of a new unit. The problem arises when this cost is "padded" above the actual cost in order to maximize profit- which is obviously the case here. Things like tax and licensing are going to vary from state to state so when somoone on here says that licensing should only be $100 don't listen to them because they probably live in Florida and not AZ where you are. The tax rate was listed as 8.1%, and licensing does vary from state to state, but $100 should not be too far off considering it's a transfer and not a new tag. Also, your tax number seems really low. It should be closer to $730 at 8.1%. The tax amount is low because it's the difference between the trade value and the selling price- another perk of trading a vehicle. | ||
| Bikejunky |
Redbuelljunkie +1 | ||
| Clbofaz |
Redbuelljunkie, good comments. You hit the nail in the head in those regards,specifically, the details. Ive seem to determined that the base bike price aint bad, but the fees are questionable. Its a matter of them being arbitrarily high (because of where I live or other dealers this one buys from) or if its padded - where the latter seems to be the likely case. Ad for the tags, the price was for new tags for 1 year - however, Arizona law required people to retain their plates and can transfer the unused registration to a new bike. So I don't understand why they are trying to give me new tags.... Regarding tax, 8.1% of the difference isn't $484 but $364, a difference of about $120. Wonder where that fuzzy math came from. | ||
| Blake |
Sounds like a fair deal, not anything you should be hesitant to walk away from. Don't bother about anything but the simple "out the door price" for any vehicle purchase. One should care little to nothing about how all the numbers are worked to get there. Call all the dealers in you area and tell them that you are shopping for a new 1125R, get their best price, and give the salesman your #, and ask him to give you a call if he can find a way to help you over the fence, or to pull the trigger so to speak. While you wait for a return call, contact the next dealer on your list. (Message edited by Blake on May 31, 2009) | ||
| Sputter |
God save you if you are at Chandler!!!! | ||
| Whynot |
"My" dealer charged a $200 documentation fee. Yours sounds pretty durned high. (Message edited by whynot on June 03, 2009) | ||
| Clbofaz |
First, I'd like to thank everyone that assisted me with this decision. I couldn't have don't it without the well informed readership on these (and other) forums. In the end, I got the bike as above. Some say it was a shite deal, others so-so, and yet others... great; but, after much research in a short time span, for my area, it was reasonable (dealer 100 miles away gave nearly the same deal - some across the country about a grand less, but then add shipping and hassle). However, I was able to negotiate a deal on service for the bike, which I really wanted anyways as who wants to pay for all those initial "new bike" services, especially with the 1125R and its valve adjustments. Ultimately, its was a good deal for an awesome bike at an earlier point than I ever thought and with, relatively, little research. A great deal, IMHO, would've been about a grand to grand five less w/o the service deal. But, that would've left little profit for them, and make me a hard arse. For those that are interested, the HD shop got me insurance through Dairyland for about $100/moth. FYI - I'm 26, ridden for 3 yrs and have had several tickets (speed) over the last 3 yrs (no criminal). If any of you want to ask about specific experience/tactics, I'm more than willing. Much Obliged, ~C | ||
| Redbuelljunkie |
Namby-Pamby!  | ||
| Brapbrapbrap |
Clbofaz Posted on Monday, June 01, 2009 - 09:51 pm: ......... U. But, that would've left little profit for them, and make me a hard arse. ................................................ Enjoy your new toy, that's all that matters is if your happy! Total deal: $11,581.34 for a 2008 carry-over. Believe me, these people LOVE you! | ||
| Ridenusa4l |
well that makes 5 1125r's in AZ that i know of including myself...but mines the ONLY white 08'  Jake | ||
| Whynot |
Congratulations -- decision made, relieved of old bike, got a low interest rate, new bike acquired, time to ride. | ||
| Dropnstyle |
There will be 6 within the next couple of days hopefully. Im working on one here in Tucson, i was riding my 06 12 s on monday and tranny went out nothing but grinding when in gear and can push bike around when in gear like it was in neutral. Good news i was still under warranty for next 2 months, bad news i dont really want them to tear into my bike and trust them to put it back together with basically no warranty left. And since i have a horrible interest rate on the 12s wife said go ahead on new one (got a good co signer this time) and everything is a go just have to wait for the dealership to take apart my 12s and make sure its going to be covered under warranty before we get final paperwork signed ( i am lookin at the 09 cr on the floor though- they still have a couple 08 r's...we will see what kinda deal difference it would be) Wish me luck | ||
| Ridenusa4l |
GOOD LUCK!!!!!!!! Jake | ||
| Jaab4 |
If I treated my customers to deals like this I would be run out of Ohio on a rail.(by the way it is illegal in Ohio to charge over $250.00 in doc fees.) Spent $2000 in advertising to sell my 2008 models for $8495.00 TOTAL.(took 3 months to sell 5) Sure wish I would run into more guys like you that even know they are getting taken but still do the deal. We are running full page ads in the cycle trader and cant seem to get a phone call even. Must just be the different parts of the country. Good luck with your 1125R you Will enjoy it. | ||
| Clbofaz |
Jaab4, I think where I'm at bikes are selling pretty hot. Whenever I go in there the bells ringing. Its not like they ever try, really hard anyways, to make sales. And competitive pricing in the state, and nearby states; CA, NM, etc. had them all chiming in at similar prices. On another, sadder, note, I was headed home when the instrument cluster was putting out a speed of 0 mph, while I was in 6th, lol. Tried the usual turn on/of and tinkering with whatever was exposed to see if there was a bad connection. Then I noticed the rear turn signals were out, or never on to begin with, as well as the FR turn signal. And they supposedly did a test drive before I came; sure. Managed to get 1 of the 3 working by tapping it. Speedo was good for a nightlight by that time. So, it was back to the shop for me. Turns out they need it until a new speedo and blinkers come in, 5-7 business days, plus install time. Tech though something might have gotten pinched during assembly (in clip ons) and caused it to ground out as it was popping fuses easily. Guess they were wrong, just bad OEM parts. Don't call me superstitious but this makes me nervous considering I've never had a vehicle (3 to date) that didn't give me some sort of major problem within a short period of time after getting it. At least I had the sense to get the 5 yr extended service contract which covers, among other things, a rental. It'll damn near pay for itself by the time this is said and done ($750 of the $999). Guess my past experience taught me something; to prepare! |
