| Author | Message | ||
     Mjhzn6 |
I know the 1125 is going to be a great bike. I can see if being very competitive in the club level, racing Heavyweight and Unlimited classes. But beyond that, where will we see if racing. ASRA?? AMA??? Will it be eligible for Formula Extreme? Since its water cooled, the allowable cc's might be exceeded. It probably wont be competitive in the Superstock and Superbike classes. I haven't looked through the rule books to see. I guess I could go do some reading, but what fun is that. Im a picture kinda guy. Just curious. | ||
| Slaughter |
I think in 2009, AMA bumps the displacement in Superbike to 1200 for Twins. To my reading, it's just a proposed change right now. WSBK will be 1200 for twins It's the Club racing where that bike can shine since it'll be elegible for a few classes in most organizations - BUT generally won't be elegible for as many different classes as the air-cooled (XB) is elegible. | ||
| Slaughter |
Discussion on Roadracing World: http://www.roadracingworld.com/news/article/?artic le=29577 Proposed 2009 Rules - AMA (you can see WHY they're ending Superstock): http://www.amaproracing.com/rulebook/2009%20AMA%20 SB%20Proposed%20rules.pdf (Message edited by slaughter on October 16, 2007) | ||
| Vagelis46 |
Is there Superstock 1000 series in th US, like the World Superstock, so that the 1125R to enter ? In World Superstock the V-2 1099cc Ducati 1098, is competing against the IL4s. Actualy the 1098 won the title this year, its first time in competition. So...... | ||
| Elvis |
If I may attempt a ham-handed summary for those who don't know much about the classes (I'm no expert myself, so anyone who wants to jump in and correct me, please feel free): 2008 World Superbike will allow 1200cc twins in 2008. The 2007 rules allowed the 1000 cc twins greater modifications than inline 4's which allowed Ducati to be competitive. The new rules will restrict twin modifications but allow the higher displacement allowing Ducati to field bikes closer to stock. The 1125R could technically enter, but they wouldn't have a chance. They would need an homologated race-designed version of the 1125R to even begin to be competitive along with a large race budget. AMA Superbike will adopt similar rules to WSBK, but not until 2009. Again, Buell would likely need an homologated race version and a lot of money to compete at that level, but the level of competition is slightly lower than WSBK, and with more time, that may at least be vaguely possible (I'd put the chances at 10% for an effort like that). A privateer effort in 2009 AMA Superbike could be possible, but likely would have a hard time being truly competitive. MOTO ST would probably be the most likely (relatively high profile) venue. A de-tuned bike would have to be used to fit into the top class (SST) which requires HP in the 90-118 range. Since there are a few teams racing Buells very successfully in the GST class (and since Buell sponsers the SST class), we might have a good chance of seeing an 1125R in SST next year (or at least in 2009). As for CCS/ASRA/WERA, I don't know much about those classes, but I'm sure there are numerous opportunities, and I'd be willing to bet there are members of this board who will be racing 1125R's (though they may not want to give away their plans, and they may not know themselves what they'll be doing. Again, that's just a quick and dirty summary based on my limited knowledge and I welcome corrections. | ||
| Mjhzn6 |
True.... I thought the ducks made a lot more power than the 1125 but its not that much more, duck is at 160, 1125 at 150. My concern is this. I race a Yamaha YZF-R1 and have raced a hand full of AMA Superstock races. I still have a stock motor in the R1, only a pipe and power commander. It is making 174 hp at the wheel. I am sending the motor off this winter for a superstock build. My builder is confident he can get 190 - 195 out of it. Will the 1125 be capable of this? The only reason I am asking is because I just had my lightning on the track for the first time yesterday. What a great handling machine. I would seriously consider jumping ship if I could get a bike to handle like this and still have the power of the liter bikes. I dont think I could resist getting one. I guess we'll just have to wait and see when the R and D gets underway. | ||
| Bads1 |
The Duc you are referring to is the "R" model and thats going to be rear tire HP at 160. The Buell 150?? That crank and they are seeing mid 130's. The base 1098 though is at 128 at the tire. | ||
| Vagelis46 |
I have seen dyno runs for the base 1098, at 142Hp at the rear wheel. | ||
| Bads1 |
You have??? Buell has done them also on the base Duc 1098. They see 128 RWHP. Are you sure your not thinking of the "S" model?? | ||
| Steve_mackay |
Dyno to dyno #s can be drastically different. | ||
| Bads1 |
You got that right Steve. | ||
| Court |
>>>I have seen dyno runs for the base 1098, at 142Hp at the rear wheel. Excellent. Please let me know where. I've noticed, and I can't for the life of me understand why, that EVERY test in the magazines is of the 1098S . . . which, frankly, at $20,000 is in an entire different class. Let me know where that test is so I can purchase the mag. Thanks | ||
| Bads1 |
Court, Hell every test I've seen is the base 1098. | ||
| Sethbuchbinder |
To finish off the list for Elvis, CCS and ASRA have a few classes suited for the 1125R. CCS super twins expert/amateur, CCS unlimited superbike EX/AM, CCS heavyweight Gran Prix EX/AM, CCS GTU EX/AM, ASRA super bike. WERA also has some twins classes which the 1125R fits, though im not aware of the specific details. Needless to say there’s plenty of racing to be done and its going to be a great race season.... If the bikes are ready in time.. Personally, id like to see Buell take their time over the winter to sort out the details and deliver a truly solid, sorted, and unstoppable machine. One which will begin this new chapter in Buell's and for that matter motorcyclings history in an exemplary fashion. I hope however that this process does not bleed too far in to next years race season. Were going to need some time to get a bike ready for racing.... From the one day I spent on the bike, they dont have much work left to do. lets slap a number plate on it and GOOOOOOOOOOOO.. http://dvkphoto.com/BUELL/070927/photodetail_advanced2_J.html I think Anthony(mutationracer) and the control rider who was folowing us would both agree with my above statement.. this thing is just awesome. coudnt pass on posting this one. wishI could get it to fit the format to avoid using the link. some help out there? http://dvkphoto.com/BUELL/070927/photodetail_advanced2_I.html See you all on the track Seth CCS/ASRA#148 (Message edited by seth.buchbinder on October 16, 2007) | ||
| Buellshyter |
The Ducati 1098 R isnt even available I do believe. | ||
| Court |
>>>>.Hell every test I've seen is the base 1098. Sure? I keep reading tests ( I think and could be wrong with my Courtsheimers) that talk about the 1098 and then say something about "but we had a 1098S delivered". If so cool. The 1125r and the 1098, I'd be willing to bet, we'll be seeing pitted head to head for the next couple years. I love it. | ||
| Bads1 |
The 1125r and the 1098, I'd be willing to bet, we'll be seeing pitted head to head for the next couple years. I love it. I was counting on that. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
The 1125r and the 1098, I'd be willing to bet, we'll be seeing pitted head to head for the next couple years. It will be exciting to say the least...BTW I pulled out a copy of the RRW mag and as I thought, it was a 1098S. | ||
| Indy_bueller |
Linky: http://www.ducatidesmosedicirr.net/forum/showthrea d.php?t=1508 According to the poster, a 1098 modified with pipe and ecm. | ||
| Indy_bueller |
Another.....very interesting the difference between the two. Suddenly the Duc doesn't seem to have such an advantage over the 1125R. But at least it's still sexy.  http://www.moto-one.com.au/performance/1098dptermihomo.html (Message edited by indy_bueller on October 16, 2007) Blake fix hyperlink  (Message edited by blake on October 17, 2007) | ||
| Indy_bueller |
Ya think Buell might have a 1098 squirreled away someplace for testing?  | ||
| Diablo1 |
Here's some more dyno charts on the 1098S with slipons compared to an Aprilia 1060cc big bore kitted motor. It's a much stingier dyno than dynojet - reads 15% lower, but the comparison is apples to apples. http://www.apriliaforum.com/forums/showthread.php? t=130089 | ||
| Court |
>>>>Ya think Buell might have a 1098 squirreled away someplace for testing? Buell has an entire fleet of a couple dozen "competitive products". Ducati has a handful of Buells. Honda has a handful of Buells. Few folks have been around Buell long enough to remember, but one of my best riding buddies was Honda's top R&S development engineer. We met when he bought his first Buell. He and I used to meet in remote locations, swap bikes and have a blast. He was one of the best known and most respected test riders in history. Joe and another Honda exec Dirk lost their lives in a freak accident at Willow Springs. He always had high praises for the Buell. I've got TONS of stories about him and some great pictures of him the year he showed up for one of my annual Southern California group rides on a prototype Blackbird with my name on it in chrome. . Buell knows as much as the Ducati as Ducati does. The corollary is true as well. | ||
| Reepicheep |
That first link dyno was high... read the rest of the thread. I suspect its hard enough to get different dynojet units to match, much less different brands. I noticed that same 1098 slight of hand as well. It started with rumors of a new $10,000 Ducati replacement for the 999, which sounded exciting. Then we saw some leaked photos, and a price of $12,000, which still looked pretty cool. Then we heard about the more expensive "S" package, at which point I started to loose the distinction between it and the 999. And then every magazine test I have seen is for a bike that has some other $3000 to $5000 collection of doo-dads on it. A great bike, no doubt, but an expensive one. And thats before you take into account the rest of the cost of ownership... | ||
| Paintballtommy |
i was under the impression that the 1098 and 1098s use the same drivetrain... only difference being paint bodywork and suspension? | ||
| Dave_bogue |
2007 Bikeland Dyno Shootout (includes 1098): http://www.bikeland.org/story.php?storyID=32404 | ||
| Fresnobuell |
What struck me as weird about the Bikeland Shootout was the fact that the 1098 had the ugliest torque curve of the 5 bikes tested. I know Anony has referred to this curve and its tendency to make the rider feel like the bike is faster than it really is (when it hits that second spike in the curve). | ||
| Reepicheep |
I didn't download the article... was that dyno plot with the $Tergomoni and custom ECM (that they referenced)? Or was that stock? | ||
| Fresnobuell |
I believe it was stock and the exhaust/ECM mods were possibly a suggestion to smooth out the torque curve | ||
| Trojan |
The 1125r and the 1098, I'd be willing to bet, we'll be seeing pitted head to head for the next couple years. Except by the time the 1125 hits the shops it will be pitted against the new 1098 1200cc WSB homologation model and not the current model. This will move the goal posts somewhat I think. Then there are the new BMW, KTM & Aprilia superbikes entering the frame as well. Unless Buell/Rotax are willing to invest a substantial amount of money in updating the engine to WSB specs and capacity it won't be anywhere near competitive at Superbike level competition. Buell would also have to run a fully factory backed and professional full time race team in order to run the bike at the top level. They could not do a XBRR and rely on privateers to run it on the World or AMA superbike stage. I doubt that H-D have the political will to do that simply because they would be scared of another VR1000 debacle. |
