| Author | Message | ||
     Two_buells |
Hey Court, thanks for the heads up from CW! Great Job East Troy! I can't wait to have a Rotax Buell next to my Rotax Can-am ATV. As for the other posts..   | ||
| Snowscum |
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| Snowscum |
In 2006, G. Richard Wagoner raked in $10,191,153 in total compensation according to the SEC. Alan Mulally Chief Executive Officer Ford Motor Company In 2006, Alan Mulally raked in $28,183,476 in total compensation according to the SEC. Angelo R. Mozilo Chief Executive Officer Countrywide Financial Corporation In 2006, Angelo R. Mozilo raked in $48,133,155 in total compensation according to the SEC. | ||
| Ducxl |
And that's ONE freaking year! I could live very lavishly for life on what some make in one year! And how many tens of thousands can they spend A DAY for LIFE! It has to stop.Can you remember the story of what happened in 1917? Communism baby. OK..."In my opinion"..The domestic parts content is less than 70% on Buells(likely it's less than 30%).That's why they no longer wear "Made in USA" moniker. We're just importing Hyosungs in COSCO containers and assembling them. (Message edited by Ducxl on August 26, 2007) | ||
| Court |
>>>>That's why they no longer wear "Made in USA" moniker. I disagree and would welcome the source of your conclusive statement or perhaps you just want to append it with "in my opinion" | ||
| Ducxl |
There was a law enacted though by the Federal Trade Commission to prevent false claims of being "Made in America".It measures the domestic parts content.We now see it on every auto in every auto dealer. What's the % of domestic parts content on the 1125r? I apologise for my neverending rant on "Made in America". As a child i used to spend summers walking to lunch to meet my mom.She was a seamstress at a factory with three floors bustling with activity.It AND ALL other clothing factories have been shuttered.All in the name of progress? This is MY COUNTRY where we're closing down all of the manufacturing and moving it to China.What do we owe China anyway? (Message edited by Ducxl on August 26, 2007) | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
And that's ONE freaking year! I could live very lavishly for life on what some make in one year! And how many tens of thousands can they spend A DAY for LIFE! It has to stop.Can you remember the story of what happened in 1917? Communism baby. Who the hell are you to tell someone how much they can make? What do you think these people do with their money? I'll tell you since you lack the forethought as to potential outcomes of all this "ill gotten gain". First off they pay taxes. Lot's of em. They pay taxes at the federal, state, and local level. In fact the top 1% wage earners pay nearly 37% of the Federal taxes in this country with the top 5% paying over 57% of the taxes. http://www.ntu.org/main/page_printable.php?PageID= 6 Secondly, they spend their money. When they buy that 15th home, or hire that grounds keeper, or play that golf, or buy those steaks, or drink that California wine, they are employing the people who produce those goods. In fact, like taxes, your employment and the employment of others is MORE as a result of the expenditures of the wealthy. Third, they invest. They place their funds with venture capital firms and angel funds who then invest those dollars into companies who are looking for capital to grow, to increase capacities, to HIRE new employees, to create jobs. They buy stocks. The sale of stock provides the cash for companies to grow and expand, to HIRE new people, to create new jobs. They buy bonds. Bonds provide cash to allow companies to grow, to HIRE new people, to create new jobs. Lastly, they save some in the bank. The bank takes the assets held in the bank, reserves what the FED requires to meet the retention margin, and then lends the remainder out. When you go to the bank, you are borrowing money that was deposited by these folks you hate so much. If you have a mortgage, you owe it to folks like this making money. If they weren't there depositing funds, the money supply would tighten and interest rates would climb. You want to return to double digit interest rates from the 80's? So you think communism is a better system? Nice.  You're right, communism would limit earnings potential. It just starts at the bottom and rarely works it's way up. | ||
| Court |
FB: I agree. My wife is the CFO for a small investment firm. The 3 principles are all under 40 Billionaires. John, a hell of a nice guy who plays a James Goodall guitar, took home $50,000,000 last month. He started the firm when he refused to ride the "gravy train" of his fathers successful manufacturing business after he graduated from the University of Michigan. . . he wanted to do something on his own. He took lots of risks and invests in lots of things that make the wheels of commerce go round. Think he'd be a better person at minimum wage? Just curious . . . P.S. - he paid over $25,000,000 in taxes last month too . . . that's filling my potholes, maintain the national parks in the United States, buying fuel for F-18's and paying my police. . . .thank goodness. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Folks bemoan what these executives make, but it isn't much compared to the revenue the companies they manage are making. As an example, if you started a company that made $1M in revenue, you'd be pretty happy. If you paid yourself what the CEO of GM makes as a percentage of your revenue, the year you did $1M in revenue, you'd pay yourself $40.99. If that was all you made from $1M of effort, would you want to do it again next year? If you were offered the position at GM or Ford but only offered $1M per year to do it, would you take it or just stay where you are with a fraction of the pressure and headaches you would have at GM? | ||
| Crusty |
Dammit all, I looked at this thread to see what Cycle World has to say about the 1125R. I don't give two $h1t$ about political debate. That belongs on the Backfire Board. What did Kevin Cameron have to say about the engine? What did they like ? What didn't they like? My issue will probably arrive next month along with the latest Fuell, as I seem to have a Post Office that got caught in a discontinuity in the Time Stream. In the meantime, I'd enjoy getting more info about the bike, and how the rest of the world out there is reacting to it. | ||
| Concor |
" Who the hell are you to tell someone how much they should make?" And then you tell those of us in a union we make too much and have too many benefits. Dont group us all together as being overpayed union employess. I agree that the benefits for some are excessive. when pensions started people didnt live as long once they retired so now these companies are paying for 30 40 years sometimes after someone has left. My grandfather worked at miller brewery for 26 years and retired with an incredible benefit package. He lived for another 32 after retirement so obviously he collected benefits longer than he worked there, thats going to be happening more and more. My dads in the railroad union he gets paid six days of pay per week and usually works one day per week. They had to create this f@#ked up position so they had someone to come in for guys who were sick, had a family emergencys or when guys are on vacation. Sometimes he has to work a full week but its maybe 6 times a year, its a joke i tease him about it all the time.He sits in an office tower and directs trains as they come into the yard, watches tv takes naps and gets $31 bucks an hour, its crazy. Why the fu@k do i break my back in construction,he could get me a job there Cost of living also has some things to do with it. I live in Wisconsin which last time i checked was the 4th highest taxed state. Non union lower wages is fine in Mississippi where your property taxes are 800 bucks a year. I pay 4,000 a year for a condo, i dont even have my own yard its a "common area". Im not some rah rah union guy, ive never been to a meeting in 14 years or marched in our parade, i just fell into the line of work. I have wondered however what it would be like if our shop went non union, not saying it would be good or bad. I know there would be some people i work with no longer working there if there was no union. One of the downsides to are union is it protects people who should be fired. | ||
| Buellshyter |
I commend Buell for at least assembling their motorcycles in Wisconsin. They could just as well R&D in East Troy and assemble in some third world country. So you think communism is a better system? Nice Seeing as you're a huge free trade supporter, Ft_bstrd, I need not remind you that China is a communist country. The policy we have with China was started under Nixon and the esoteric thinking set forth by the policy wonks is very similar to the game plan for Iraq. The thinking goes like this - we can change China from within by exposing them to capitalist forces from without and over time this will bring China's political system into line. Iraq, on the other hand, was not invaded because it posed a threat but because their failure to live by the sanctions set forth in the U.N. gave the U.S. legitimacy in invading Iraq with the sole purpose of giving the U.S. a foothold in the area. The goal for China is to change their political system by using capitalism like a dealer entices kids with drugs. The goal for Iraq is to stabilize the Middle East by democratization. Both are nation building and highly risky ventures with dire and unforeseen consequences for failure. | ||
| Badlionsfan |
bla bla bla bla blaaaaaaa!!!!!!! when does the Cycle World hit the news stands. take all this other BS somewhere else, i come here to get away from the day to day crap that comes with being a grown up!!!! i wanna talk and read about bikes when i come here. if i want to hear about economics, i'll go to a economic forum. I'M NOT GONNA GO TO THE FRICKIN WALL STREET JOURNAL FORUMS AND TALK ABOUT THE 1125R ON THE COVER OF CYCLE WORLD!!! you A.D.D. sufferers need to get on some ritalin. | ||
| Ducxl |
  Who am i? An American citizen duped for years by voting the Republican slate.I've never voted for a Democrat.This next election cycle i'll vote for the people who'll protect American jobs.Who'll DEMAND the same access to the Chinese market as they have to ours.There's an enormous sucking sound with our money going overseas.I used to subscribe to "Trickle down economics".But now those greedy CEO types demand ever INCREASING profit MARGINS and that leads to using labor from countries where the citizenry are prevented from a better life.MY COUNTRY owes me the favor of FAIR TRADE.The rich are getting richer and the poor poorer.I make less money now than two years ago,and it's getting worse.School? I'm half way through my professional carreer.I like what i do but do not deserve an ever decreasing lifestyle. | ||
| Ducxl |
If you need it, let me know I have over 100 books on Labor Law in my library So do i. | ||
| Alchemy |
In my opinion, it is waste of time trying to justify these large salaries/bonuses/compensation packages. It would be an improvement if they were somehow linked to the performance of the company. They are weakly linked at best(in most companies). It is not uncommon for executive salaries to go up in times of poor performance. Justified as they are working harder in tough times (oh really) Maybe they are. But it is irrelevant in my opinion. By this logic I would expect executive compensation to go down as business improved... not likely. The perfect economic system has yet to be developed and capitalism has it's own share of warts. This is one of them it seems to me. Executive salaries are set by the executives themselves (in most cases a committee of executives set the salaries for executives in general) in conjunction with some consultants they use as justification (read cover). My problem is a moral one. What human being thinks they are so far superior to other that they earned such a salary. Where is the voice of moral outrage among these titans of business and industry? John Bogle is a man to listen to and he has a few books that touch the subject. Now where can I get the Oct Cycle World darn it. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Communism: It isn't hard to obtain compliance from the populace when they have nothing. You'll give the government total control if they promise to feed, house, and clothe you. Don't believe it? Ask Venezuela. Nixon was in China first in '72. Since then, wages have steadily increased for the average Chinese citizen. They are approaching the point of having something substantial. It will become more and more difficult for the Communist party to maintain control. It simply takes time. Communism in the Soviet Union took from 1917-1990 to implode. The discussions regarding compensation are merely class warfare rhetoric Lennin, Mao,and Pol Pot would recognize and embrace. I find it ironic that the same folks who decry the unfairness of Communist China are the very same ones who promote Communist compensation structures. I think you guys need to check your logic algorithms. | ||
| Snowscum |
It would be an improvement if they were somehow linked to the performance of the company. They are weakly linked at best(in most companies). It is not uncommon for executive salaries to go up in times of poor performance. Justified as they are working harder in tough times (oh really) Maybe they are. But it is irrelevant in my opinion. By this logic I would expect executive compensation to go down as business improved... not likely. Thats why I included Countrywide into that group. They had to borrow from 40 banks to stay afloat and this guy is taking home 48 million. Its all the same. Their overpaid in my opinion. And they wonder why jobs get moved overseas. Because of bloated upper managment pay and poor managment and still they bring home way to much. Spread it out to the employes so they can spend it and pay taxes instead. You don't think these guys know how to skate around taxes? Ha. Sorry for the rant. I agree with you FB but as time goes on the price of living goes up but my wages fall behind while these guys reap. Go Buell! Angelo R. Mozilo Chief Executive Officer Countrywide Financial Corporation In 2006, Angelo R. Mozilo raked in $48,133,155 in total compensation according to the SEC | ||
| Jimidan |
Communism in the Soviet Union took from 1917-1990 to implode. First, it wasn't "communism". There has never been a true communistic country. Second, the USSR didn't "implode"...it has simply been reorganizing. It was a prime example of what happens when fascist military industrial complex takes over a country. Perhaps the best analogy for what happened in the USSR is in our bankruptcy code, where Chapter 7 governs the process of liquidation under the bankruptcy laws of the United States. In contrast, Chapter 11 governs the process of reorganization of a debtor in bankruptcy. The USSR has been in Chapter 11. BTW, I can't wait to get my latest copy of Cycle World in the mail. I am glad that Kevin was assigned to do the article! The peanut gallery is alive and well on badweb. | ||
| Buellshyter |
I'M NOT GONNA GO TO THE FRICKIN WALL STREET JOURNAL FORUMS AND TALK ABOUT THE 1125R ON THE COVER OF CYCLE WORLD!! What BadWeb have you been reading. These threads ALWAYS land off topic. Besides, what more can one say about the 1125 on the Cycle World cover until we have a chance to read it. It will become more and more difficult for the Communist party to maintain control. It simply takes time. That's it in a nutshell. Does China become a democracy or does it become a 1.5 billion person uncontrollable colossus. It seems to me we have taken a huge risk and for what - so we can acquire and consume even more junk? Didn't we travel this road before in regards to Japan and look what it took to straighten out that mess - 60 million casualties and the dropping of two atomic bombs. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Jimidan, Then by your definition Communism doesn't exist in China either. | ||
| Unibear12r |
Interesting insight Jimidan. Yes FB, TRUE Communism does not exist in China. Same as TRUE capitalism doesn't exist here in the USA! THANK YOU Founding Fathers!!! You would hate true capitalism as much as true communism. True communism really did not exist anywhere except in a few people's minds. Definitions, however, does not make oppression any less oppressive, even here. Funny how those taking either side of this argument here refuse to allow the other side the same rights/place in our (almost) free market place and wish to oppress the other. Both the CEOs and the Unions are simply marketing what they have to sell. When they are over priced they fail, when not they are working. If a CEO or Union wins a contract then they were worth the cost. Period, facts end the argument. What I've been seeing is that mismanagement in business is slowly bringing back the Unions. | ||
| Alchemy |
"What I've been seeing is that mismanagement in business is slowly bringing back the Unions." Well, I think that unions are clearly on the way back. I don't know whether I would relate that to mis-management however. What we have is economic conditions that make unions an appealing idea. Hopefully they will be less corrupt and more efficient this time but either way they are coming back in some form largely because they offer a good value proposition. I have worked for 20+ years at the same company and I have absolutely no job security largely because of state law. My employer pays closely to the mid range of similar jobs and has been able to keep unions out but an attempt to unionize would get a LOT further today than it would have 20 years ago in my opinion. I can be fired at any time with no explanation or justification. I am at peace with that situation but it is hardly much of a motivation. It seems the "deck" is a little more favorable to management than to workers. It could change but I don't see that trend on the horizon. One of the things I find admirable in Erik is that he seems to have been genuinely interested in creating jobs and careers for workers. What a great idea. Makes me want to be part of such a good idea. | ||
| No_rice |
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| No_rice |
now back to the 1125R discussion, this is a slightly more naked version everyone has been wondering about  | ||
| Dbird29 |
I am appalled at the possibility that naked motorcycle could have been made in China. APPALLED! There is no way I could enjoy that know it wasn't 100% American made. BTW what size fasteners are used on that "naked bike"? Anything other than SAE and there will be appalling problems.  | ||
| Cataract2 |
I'd ride her, I mean, it. (Message edited by cataract2 on August 26, 2007) | ||
| Unibear12r |
Not naked enough! Not for a Bueller anyway. Too much fairing! | ||
| Djkaplan |
When I worked for the Bluebird Body Company (the world's largest manufacturer of schoolbuses) we had a unit called the "All American". I did some revisions to various assemblies for this product and noticed a lot of the sheetmetal was from Guatemala. When I questioned the engineering manager about this, he stated quite rightfully, "Guatamala is in America... the central part". It made me realize how ridiculous marketing and branding could be. Face it... the only thing made these days out of 100% American components is children of US citizens... and there's no telling where they might be from. | ||
| Midknyte |
 and what's with that undertail exhaust? |
