| Author | Message | ||
     Rocketman |
A) I need more top speed. Absolutely! Buells should've cracked 150MPH by now. After all in a world of IL 4's 'a ton fifty' is dog slow these days! Hell my sisters Merc is RESTRICTED to 155 and that's a tin box!!! B) I need more straight line acceleration. In a recent MCN road test the fugly bug Triumph and the Monster Thou made the Bolt look like it was ready for its pension. J) It's the only way I'll be able to keep up with the guys I ride with on the street. Well that's right as it 'appens. Us Brit's love to ride like irresponsible speed limit breaking hooligans, especially past infant schools and blind institutes. Rocket  | ||
| Buell_brener |
I like the quirky 45 deg V-Twin. It gets better milage than any of my friends bikes, it keeps up with them on US roads, and it looks cool in the frame. The only real engineering issue EB should have addressed earlier was heat dissapation in the tube frame models(and some frame stuff). As an interesting note there are two Honda VTR 1000s for sale at my local dealer. They have been there for two years and the price is 2000 below MSRP. I don't think HP alone sells bikes. I do think reliability can effect the consumer more. | ||
| Jim_witt |
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| S320002 |
Jim, What doesn't make sense about my list? I'd like to see more horsepower too. Hell I once rode from Rosemond,CA (Willow Springs) to Santa Clara,CA in just over four hours including gas stops. I had to be at work by noon. But that wasn't anywhere near as much fun as the twisty roads and race tracks I've been on. Yes, parts of the list were a little tongue-in-cheek but I'm truly curious what people think they would use that horsepower for. If your choices aren't on the list that's why I listed choice O). I do suspect that, for those who are honest with themselves, Bartimus' and Rocket's choices are true in more cases than not. That's why the the Yamaha VMax is still with us after all these years. I also suspect that, even if you had the means, owning one of those crates you pictured would be an exercise in frustration. Spending a quarter mill on race schools and racing seems like more fun to me. Greg | ||
| Snail |
Rocket! You old Druid. How you been old man? I recently bought an '03 Gix 1K to add to the stable, LOVE IT! Hauls ass big time, strait and around corners. Thrott. control is critical, I pulled a mondo 4th gear wheelie and scared the piss out of myself. I was cranking about 140 when I tried a 4th gear full power shift. Not recommened unless you're a Mladin or Yates. I still have the Buell, even rode it for an hour yesterday. Just to get my nostalgia fix. If you get a chance ride a Gix 1K, it will alter you forever. Paul | ||
| Rocketman |
Hey Snail it's nice to be on Badweb more. I've just moved into a place of my own after the 2 year split from the..........well you know the old chestnut don't ya. Anyways, got a nice little two up two down cottage to slump my arse down into and obviously over indulge myself in motorcycle bull shit all over again thanks to the friggin' internet!!!! How practical is that I ask? Mmmmm that wall could do with a lick of paint. Oh wait on, I've got a shed full of Buell posters. That oughta do it or should I hang something more appropriate like an old painting of you and a fishing boat? Yeah for sure, those Buell posters 'll fetch good coin on ebay.......... Listen up Snail Face, I rode a Busa back in 99 when you were still sewing nets and stitching cod ends. I gave Doug's Busa a one seventy thrashing in Colorado last year too and just a few weeks ago I 'borrowed' the new naked Z thou Kwak, and no it isn't as awesome in the power as that plastic missile you've got, but jeez I was mighty impressed by its handling and performance. Down the old country lanes it would have left my S1W for dead. Can you believe the Japanese could build a naked IL four with a 'diamond' steel frame handle this well, coz I tell ya it blew me away. Top speed over 150 with absolutely arm stretching acceleration and I could just about keep up with my mates on their Buells. Go figure???? Gixxer thous mate, shat 'em  Rocket | ||
| Elvis |
Let me start by saying I’m in awe of what Buell has accomplished over the past 20 years. Every year, they offer better performing, higher quality, lower priced, completely innovative bikes. Would I like more power? Sure. Why? Because, to me, motorcycles should be responsive. They should accelerate, decelerate and turn quickly. They should be an extension of the rider. Buell makes a great bike, and the only thing missing in the current bikes is the power to accelerate with the other bikes in their weight class. Buell power now is fine. I’ll never go 150 mph and I rarely peg the tach, but, like money, we could always use more power. Do I want Buell to compete head to head with the Japanese repli-racers? NO WAY! The current trend toward higher and higher performance is, in my opinion, the worst thing that has happened to motorcycling in my lifetime. Twenty years ago, I could distinguish every street-bike at a glance. Now I have to be able to read the brand and/or displacement and/or model to tell what it is. In seeking nothing but ultimate performance, those repli-racers have blended into a boring, indistinguishable mass. How many people actually rev their hyper-bikes to redline? I’m betting very few. They’ve got great numbers on paper, but I’m betting 95% of repli-racers have never even experienced peak horsepower. And the worst part? You can never win that game. Who has the best 600 this year? I don’t know. Not interested. Can’t keep track. Let’s imagine (for the sake of discussion) Yamaha produces the highest performing 600 this year. What’ll it be next year? If you run out and buy a bike because it is the absolute best where does that leave you when it isn’t anymore? You’ve just wasted your money. You spent all that time, research and money making sure you had the fastest bike available, and now there’s something faster. Great job Erik! Keep doing what you’re doing, and if you can spare a bit more power, we’d be appreciative. (Message edited by elvis on May 27, 2003, %time) (Message edited by elvis on May 27, 2003, %time) | ||
| Aaron |
You can have your IL4's. Gimme a twin any day. | ||
| Choptop |
How about Buell being the company that produces the flavor-dejur bike that impresses the snot out of the magazines, makes the squids open up their wallets, makes all of us drool over it and puts a little fear of lost market share into the hearts of all other motorcycle manufacturers... JUST ONCE. So far, they havent done that. Buell has made some interesting bikes, even with the problems some of them had, but they have yet to really hit a home run in the general motorcycling markerplace. Will any bike that is the current HP king be dethroned? Yep. Will the best handling, way cool track monster be yesterdays news when something new comes out in another year? Yep. ITs the nature of the beast. BUT, to be that top dog, just once, means sales, and it means a putting out a good bike. Seriously, and I mean be truthfull, does the idea of a 1200 Firebolt REALLY light a fire under anyones wallet? Is this the new HAVE TO HAVE bike for next year? Or is it a little "ho-hum"? Answer how you like, but the real answer will be who comes back with one in thier garage. | ||
| Snail |
Aaron, why? Try to get a test ride on an '03 Gix 1K. Superb machine, best I have ever ridden. Paul | ||
| Benm2 |
LOTS of riders use that hp, not very well, but they do. I live a block off a "main drag", and I can hear them redlining in first at EVERY light for about a mile. They usually lose momentum about halfway through the run up second, I hear third, then I can't hear the pipes anymore when they back out of it. To those sorts of riders, there is NOTHING else but hp. The "chicken strips" are inches wide, but the tire's got NO tread in the middle. Such a shame. | ||
| Tripper |
Halfway through second would put a Gixer 1000 somewhere near the ton. I can appreciate why they have backed off. | ||
| Snail |
I can't remember how to post pics on badweb, but you won't see chicken stripes on my Gix. Gix corners like a bitin' sow. Thats why I bought it. Sneer all you llke, but my advice is to try one sometime. I ride a Buell too, so don't think I can't make an informed opinion. I enjoy my Buell, but I don't enjoy the fact that the stupid thing vibrates and shakes so badly that the plastic breaks at the fastening points. Most recently the front fender broke at the bolt holes. Now I wonder how it would be to have the front fender break loose and jam the front wheel? Paul | ||
| Choptop |
We all love our Buell's. Heck, I get a kick out of my S3T everytime I even get the NEAR the thing. BUT, that makes me a FORMER Buell buyer, and a Buell FAN. NOT future Buell customer. Buell needs more of the later. </ranting> going back to tinker with my <60HP race bikes that are loads faster than me. | ||
| Aaron |
Paul, it's the whole visceral experience to me. I like the growl. I like the grunt. I like the bike narrow with good weight distribution. I like it simple, with fewer moving parts and easier maintenance. But, I'm well aware of the fact that hyper-bike IL4's are much narrower than they were a few years ago (oddly they haven't done the same with naked bikes like the ZRX1200), have much better bottom-end, and they've also largely solved the forward weight bias issue. They've made a lot of progress. I'd still rather have a twin  | ||
| Aaron |
Keep in mind that not all of us want a race rep. I really have no desire at all for one. I'm not a racer (I'm not even a particularly good rider), and it's not my aspiration to be a racer. If that's what I was interested in, I'd certainly buy one. But the world of motorcycling is made up of all kinds, everyone from trials riders to drag racers. What people want from their bikes is diverse as people themselves. I certainly can't tell you what you should or shouldn't like in a motorcycle any more than you can tell me. That's why discussions like these, and points like the one Chop keeps trying to make, just make no sense to me. Different people are looking for different things. Buell is not trying to play in that market, it's not the market they're after, even if it is a bigger market (and it may well be, I don't know). But hey, they've got some pretty smart business people there, my guess is they've done the analysis and decided to play in this market instead. I suspect they know a whole ton more about the motorcycle business to me and therefore I'm reluctant to second guess that decision. If they make bikes that appeal to me, I'll buy'em, if they don't, I won't, it's that simple. | ||
| Mikej |
I took a CBR900RR out for a spin yesterday afternoon. Didn't have my gear on, wasn't used to the bike, did manage to roll the throttle up to the mid-6,000 range in second gear. Nice bike, but not really for me. My life on the street is at less than 100mph. YMMV. | ||
| Aesquire |
Back in the late 70's-80's the joke was, "you CAN'T have the fastest bike", you'd order the Kawa-1100, and by the time it came in the Yama-1200 was on the cover of the magazines with the headline "Yama-1200 kicks Kawa-1100's BUTT!". If the dealer carried both you'd trade up without ever seeing (or riding) your K bike, and wait half a summer for the Y bike, which was uncrated as you read the headline "Suzi-1100 Katana eats Yama-1200's for Breakfast!!!!!" I quit paying attention after a while, Although I did buy a S bike that was 1983's fastest, later, and enjoyed it. Looks like Suzuki stopped that by trumping everyone w/the 'Busa. Now it's "you can't have the fastest 600 repliracer"???? lol nothing changes. (I'm keeping the M2) | ||
| Chauly |
All this talk about Buell reliability. I have a pic of the failed part inside the Harley-Davidson-supplied engine: www.rustlingleaves.com/crankpin.jpg I think a little quality control would be good... | ||
| Chucks1w |
I have to agree with Aaron, the point is kinda moot. Bikes are kinda like woman, you may not know exactly what it is that stirs your emotions, you just know you gotta have her. As far as the vibes and rattling, I kinda like that, it's raw and unrefined like a cammed up 60's muscle car. When me and the boys go into the city for a night of fun, the sport bikes might get there a minute or two ahead, but I guarentee my S1W and the Harleys in the group get all the attention. People don't really look at all the other bikes cause they all look the same, just another motorcycle. That's not really why I bought the bike but it's nice none the same. I bought it cause when I rode it for the first time it just made me smile. Different in every sense than any other bike I've had, it just feels right, and that's all that matters to me. | ||
| Dynarider |
All this talk about Buell reliability Never heard it from me  And never will. | ||
| Benm2 |
Paul: You'll get no sneering from me. Gixxer thou's are ridiculously fast, as are the 750 & 600, and I've seen them all at the racetracks without any chickenstrips. I haven't seen too many of them on the street that way, though. I have: 1. Been passed by lane-splitting-t-shirt-shorts-sneakers-helmet CBR954 (with pipe) in heavy traffic (stop & go, construction zone) while riding carefully in right lane. Followed pass with wheelie, and cut off cars to get to exit ramp, all at about 80mph. 2. Had Jr. Jerkster on a previously-wrecked GSXR600 (no bodywork) pull a u-turn DIRECTLY in front of me, on a two-lane road, in traffic, with no signal, to catch his buddies coming the other way. Fortunately, I saw THEM coming the other way (hard to miss, with their front wheels in the air & all) and was expecting it. 3. Had local paper shoved in my face by father-in-law showing article on 16-year old boy who died while top-speed testing his new R6 on Route 309 in Philadelphia (he was being followed by his brother, in a car, who was waiting for his turn). 4. Had fatality accident happen 1/2 mile from house, when I lived ACROSS THE STREET from said father in law, when I had commuted that day on my M2. I wish responsible riding were the norm, it doesn't seem to be with the sportbike crowd. Gixxer thou being life changing? Maybe, but I'll keep my Buell. I admire the man who made it. Who made your GSXR? | ||
| Eeeeek |
Umm...Couldn't Buell make both? What would be so wrong about adding to the lineup? A little credibility never hurt. BenM2, I've seen Buell owners do all those things, too. Vik | ||
| Snail |
I ride with full gear. Period. I have no argument against peoples choice of bikes. Thats what its all about, choice. But if you want to discuss build quality, design quality, and function, I'm here to tell you that the Gix 1K is head and shoulders above any Buell I have ridden or seen. And its cheap to buy. Sure, there well may be a faster bike out there next year, but thats what keeps the industry dynamic. Competition for excellence. And don't kid yourself, the Gix 1K is not a race replica, it is a race bike made legal for the street. The suspension, brakes, engine, clutch, and tranny are ready for the track, right out of the box. Check it out sometime, check the new fork tube coating, check the new brake caliper positioning, check the torque this thing makes. Its so easy to ride compared to a S-3 that its no comparison. I rode my S-3 for an hour the other day and had arm pump like I'd done three motos on the MX bike. And lastly, Aaron, you might fool the others, but I know you are a superb rider, and I suspect you would enjoy the '03 Gix like no other machine you have ridden. Its that good. Paul | ||
| Snail |
Ben, you should have bought aluminum siding for your house instead of a dangerous motorcycle. They're all dangerous, you know. Paul | ||
| Chauly |
www.rustlingleaves.com/crankpin.jpg | ||
| Chauly |
Chucks1W says: "As far as the vibes and rattling, I kinda like that..." www.rustlingleaves.com/deathrattle.wav | ||
| Grndskpr |
Ben Said: I wish responsible riding were the norm, it doesn't seem to be with the sportbike crowd. This is complete BS, sorry, as per Harley Davidson representation, the most accident prove cycle rider is the 40 something V-Twin rider, not the sport bike crowd, sorry, on a side note of this group 70% of the fatalities invole Drinking, look it up, dont blame sport bike riders for the problems of the cruiser crowd 1. Been passed by lane-splitting-t-shirt-shorts-sneakers-helmet CBR954 (with pipe) in heavy traffic (stop & go, construction zone) while riding carefully in right lane. Followed pass with wheelie, and cut off cars to get to exit ramp, all at about 80mph. Funny that same day how may HD riders in leather vests, and bandans passed you, with jeans on(about as goos as shorts), in my experience i see sport bike riders with gear because they expect something eventually will happen, the HD crowd, well nothing happens to an HD rider, yea right Roger | ||
| Benm2 |
Aluminum siding? That would cut into my money for climbing gear, race tires, and mountain bike parts. Adrenalin has its place, I'll produce my own when I'm in control. I don't need it produced for me by being stupid on the street. Try rock climbing, you'll learn about adrenaline. If you really want a rush try it without being in control or being responsible. You're a logger? What do you think when you see Joe homeowner chainsawing an overhead branch with a Sears special with the blade between his eyes? He, too, may receive an adrenaline rush. Roger, not blaming sportbike riders for the HD crowd issues. The fatality in the last of the four I listed was an HD type. Perhaps, then, I should rephrase the assesment that irresponsible riding in general shows a bad side of motorcycling? Drunk, slow & dead is just as bad as sober, fast & dead. I've never been passed by a lanesplitting, speeding HD. PA has a helmet law, so I don't see any bandanas. Those little frying pans they wear don't seem to be much an improvement, you're right. Those are my experiences, though. My street riding was 95% commuting, so I didn't see many drunk harley guys. The 5% sunday morning ride didn't produce many either. So, what I saw was associated with when I saw it. The statistics are different, as you point out. My bad, overgeneralization. | ||
| Aaron |
Well, Vik, I'm not an insider, so all I can do is speculate. My guess is they can't make a business case for it. They must figure the costs to engineer, tool up, and produce a race rep aren't going to be recovered (with a tidy profit left over) at any volume and price point they can come up with. I imagine they've factored in the boost in credibility and what that would do for street fighter sales, I'd be amazed if they haven't consider that. They must figure they can make more money by investing in the engineering and tooling to do something like the V-Rod. It's a for-profit public company after all. They have to invest their resources where they get the greatest return. You have to admit, on the balance sheet they've done a spectacular job, despite the fact that some of us are not getting exactly what we want. I'm not getting what I want, either, and what I want is something very different from what you want. My problem is that nobody makes what I really want, I have to go make it myself! Paul, believe me, I know superb riders, I've ridden with superb riders, I'm not a superb rider by any stretch of the imagination. Go riding with Griz sometime. |
