| Author | Message | ||
     Bobbyhead |
Matty, very nice combo. I like it better than the idea I had. Do you think the stretch in wheelbase, and taller tires, will slow the steering down much ? Did you have to modify the triple tree, to mate it to the Blast steering head ? Bobby | ||
| Naustin |
Grape Ape! Grape Ape!  I'm drooling here... | ||
| Slaughter |
Guys, There's talk about trying to get hybrid bikes (mixing motors and frames and front ends) - allowed to legally race in 550 Superbike class at Willow Springs. Don't know if the petition will be making the rounds until we talk to Larry Cochran but it would be really cool to have another class open up to the hybrid singles. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
Questions: Could a Blast engine even compete with 550 superbikes? If the tuber framed Blasts are running in the 0-500cc class with the stock framed Blasts, do they really need another (separate) class? Or would this (550 superbike) class be an additional class to race in or the only class hybrids could run in? My concern lies in starting another class where the Blasts get badly beaten thereby discouraging any possible further Blast (hybrid or otherwise)competitors and also thinning out the already thin Blast class. This is all coming from a guy (me) very new to the racing scene. The conspiracy theorist in me says its a way for the Japanese bikes to divide and conquer us and push us out of racing all together. Matty did beat the Hondas last month after all! | ||
| Naustin |
I, for one, believe there is a conspiracy behind almost everything. Most of them, however, go unnoticed and are just good capitalism. Its really rather amazing what is actually legal in this country. I got the Winfixer trojan this week. Not sure how I caught it, but it was a real pain in the ••• to get rid of. Basically this comapany created a virus which causes annoying pop-up ads that take you to their website, where they attempt to sell you a software program to remove the virus. (Which may stop some of the problems, but presumably creates even more and loads you up with more adware.) Its not illegal because their virus is disguised as a IE toolbar and since the laws are so vague, they get away with it -- or I assume so since I found out this Winfixer bull has been around for several years now. You'd think the government would shut them down. But, I guess they're just good capitalists.  | ||
| Sarodude |
I love the Blast & all... But I can't help but wonder if we're just a bit out of league with some of this stuff.... We can come up with bore / stroke combos to give us various displacements but how are we ever gonna get the revs outta these things? It would seem that, cube for cube, well developed competing motors would develop significantly more power just 'cause they can rev more. Then there's the weight issue.... I love the Blast. I love that there's guys prepping these things. I'd just hate to see a lot of time & effort put into preparing one of these for an inappropriate (though legal) class. -Saro | ||
| Mmelvis |
Saro I guess it comes down to, just cause you can. I am not saying that the Blast will tromp the competition , it is just the fact that we can try. In the Florida CCS division the classes have been combined so there is a wide range of bikes in the classes I ride:ULTRA-LIGHTWEIGHT SUPERBIKE and LIGHTWEIGHT FORMULA 40. Now granted I do not have the skill set of Matty but I can keep the group in sight. I have even been lucky enough where I get to mix it up with some of the other bikes. The look from a rider is so priceless to see when he finds out that a Blast was dogging him in the race is great. I guess that "it is just fun to do" is enough for me. I can not speak for the other folks, this just my view. Have a great day | ||
| Matty |
Catching up: From EZ: will he have to use an earlier tuber swing arm or does the X1 swing arm have enough clearance - or would an M2 swing arm work? )Either the Fe or Al swingarm can be used. The Al arm is the same on all tube models, so it doesn't matter what model it's from. A 23 tooth front sprocket helps keep the chain off the swingarm as does a rub block. (note: you'll have to raise the ride height a bit to bring the handling back - experience noted from others who did the larger wheel & chain conversion)  That is an inaccurate statement. Please explain your reasoning. James: The XB front end is close to a bolt on. The XB stem is about an inch too short, so a new one needs to be made. Rake is still at 24 degrees and the trail is slightly shorter at 3.33 inches. You're right on the money about the swingarm. Bobby: The XB and the Blast trees have different amounts of offset between the stem and the forks. That has more of an effect on the feel of the bike than anything. The taller tires are actually lighter than the Blast setup.  A majority of the chassis specs end up dead nuts the same as my tube frame race bike. Imagine that... Coincidence?  This thing is gonna haul some mail! | ||
| Matty |
I dunno about the 550 class Steve. I haven't payed much attention to what runs in that class or what kind of times they are doing, but it may be worth looking into. I don't have any problems with beating up on the Fzr's! We already have Formula singles and Lightwieght twins, but another class would be fine by me. They'll need to give us a displcement allowance however, like they do in the twins class. Saro, Will has a Blast motor that will live with a redline of 8000 rpm... We might see it early next year. Money will tell! | ||
| Ezblast |
I read several different Blast owners comment that their handling slowed a lot when they went to the swingarm extension/chain conversion and larger wheel/tire combo and it was suggested that raising the height of the bike an inch or two would cure that. If I'm wrong - fine, however, I'm real curious as to how the bike will handle - keep us informed! GT - JBOTDS! EZ  | ||
| Slaughter |
550 Superbike would just be another class to get some points - NOT TO WIN - not against the SV650 or RS250 Aprilia - but place somewhere in the pack. I raced 550 SBK on the SV650 and there's a HUGE speed range from the podium to the back of the pack. I'd always race ALL the twins classes on the XB even though it was nowhere near competitive with the litre-twins like the 900-series Ducks or the RC51, it was still good enough for middle-of-the-pack. Next year we're going to be getting a TON more singles - from the new Blasts, some more motards to one or two GP-framed singles (Jean-Marc and Britt Arechiga's Honda single in the RS125 chassis for one) If you swap wheels, engines, front ends or chassis, that takes you out of any class but Formula Singles because 500 singles is a PRODUCTION class - no wheel changes, no fork changes (other than valves, oil, springs) no bore more than 1mm over - stuff like that. Superbike classes start as production too but we're talking petitioning to let Formula Singles race in 550 SBK since they're not a real threat to the SV or the faster Fizzers - there'll still be people to beat with a Blast! - even in 550 SBK If I EVER get the XB-Blast, it will ONLY be legal in Formula Singles. I'd like to race it in 550 Superbike - where production singles are legal to I think 660cc (I'm working from memory - the rules link doesn't work right now) - http://willowspringsraceway.com/clubs/wsmc/Forms/2005-WSMC-Rulebook.pdf Anyways, there may start to be protests in the coming season if the Blasts start cleaning up in the production-based classes. | ||
| Jprovo |
EZ, the different tree offset, and the lighter XB wheels probably offset the added gyroscopic force from the bigger tires. | ||
| Jprovo |
Here's my $.02 Please don't screw with the 500 singles class. It's a REAL cheap class to compete in, and Matty and Jim have proven that you can be competitive with a darn near stock Blast. The Blast 's competitiveness may change when more competitors on SR500's and Ascots show up, but a lot can be done to a Blast without violating the rules. Right now the rules allow for some pretty cost effective changes. Of course, I'd love to see a rule change that would allow swingarm modifications on the Blast to allow us to change gearing and get rid of that HUGE heavy rear sprocket. Right now, a re-framed 500 (like the XBlast) is only legal for F-Singles. I wouldn't mind seeing a modification to the rules that would allow 500 singles with fork or frame changes in 660 singles so that the XBlasts, the S1Blasts and other specials like Matty's bike have a home. (plus they'd be in the same wave with the 500's) Wheel changes are already allowed in 660 singles... Maybe they would even allow a 2mm overbore, which would let you put in a 515cc kit If that rule was allowed, you could also race 550SB, and Bott Lightweight with the frame modified bikes... If you choose to bump displacement to 600+cc, it really is a formula single bike. Since the current lap record for F-singles is 1:27, I could see allowing a bike that qalifies for F-Singles in Middleweight Twins which has a lap record of 1:25... James | ||
| Matty |
EZ, On paper, it looks like it's gonna handle like something out of Tron. We'll see when we get to the track! If anything, it's going to be too quick on turn in. I'm guessing that the folks you are referring to used the Blast or a tube frame front end? There's a significant difference between those and the XB tree geometry. Then add the swingarm length and that hefty front wheel and you get something that feels heavy. I was going to use some GSXR trees and forks that I have lying around, but they wouldn't have given me the numbers I wanted when I was dreaming this thing up. The whole idea for this setup is to keep the thing looking and FEELING like a Blast. The XB rims give me a choice of rubber, which makes me happy because I don't want to go sliding off the track. The next big thing is the rear shock. I may have to get Works to build me $omething adju$table... I'm trying to avoid that. | ||
| Matty |
I'd like to change the rim restriction on the 500 class. It's too dangerous on those stock tires. Add to that the race compound tires for the Ascots, if you can get them, are now over $300 a set.  Larry Cochran, the WSMC race director, is pushing for the change too. Other than that, I'm in for the chain and swingarm allowances. This is club racing, so I don't think there's really going to be too many complaints about folks making changes to the bikes that make it more fun and safe. | ||
| Slaughter |
I'd like to see wheel changes allowed - looking at the Ascots or Tom Nichols on that SR500 and skinny-assed tires... but I also like the thought that the 500 singles can be as cheap as it gets in a racing class. I doubt anybody here would file a protest anyways. Yeah if Britt tried running her water-cooled Honda-motored RS125 racer in 500 Singles, you bet she'd get protested! (though it's a coooool bike!) Don't know if there's going to be much support in allowing formula-like changes into the 500 singles since that'd mean that Fabbro, Cochran and Nichols would likely have to change wheels too if they're wanting championship points. If you can get signatures from all the regulars and the podium guys, it can change the rules. Happened to us in BOTT Middleweight when Chris Kelly circulated a petition to allow dual ignition in the class - legalizing the MH900 Ducati for BOTT Middleweight. Since I'm (too slowly) putting together a formula-singles only bike, I'm in favor of having it allowed into 550 SBK but not into 500 singles. No way it'd be competitive in 550 SBK but it's another opportunity for some seat time in another race. As it is, assuming I ever get my a** back into the saddle in a timely manner - I'm able to run 4 classes on the XB (because I'm an old fart, I can run Formula 50) - even though the bike is elegible for 750 SBK, there's just no point running it there against the 750 gixxers but it was an option for me when there was talk about not allowing me to race "up" a displacement class. (too early in the morning to be typing away" | ||
| Jprovo |
Chris, I agree. A wheel change rule whould help greatly.... The problem becomes what are they going to allow us to change with the wheels?? Calipers? Front Forks?? It's going to be fun. I'd say that $300 a set is reason enough for a wheel change rule if most of these guys weren't getting more than half a season out of tires... I don't think that a $600 Tire budget for the year is a killer. We'll probably put more than that in tires on the Blast. RE the stock tires sizes: The Pirellis are still not adequate? That's a shame. I was hoping that the Pirelli's would make it acceptable. Of course, you were telling me that the Pirellis were getting overheated after 4 or five laps... James | ||
| Bobbyhead |
A new friend of mine Ralph, from the Yahoo Blast group. Told me that the 250 Ninja racers have been using very successfully, the dunlop GT501 front tire, in 120/80-16 on the rear of their ninja's , and claim it to be a whole lot better than the Pirelli MT75. Maybe you 500 singles racers should look into that tire option ? Bobby | ||
| Slaughter |
Hey James and Eric, You guys gonna do New Racer School this weekend? Sunny and I are standing by to help in the pits. Gonna be tons of fun. We're bringing the BBQ out so Sunday there'll be free burgers again - courtesy the Golden State BRAG and various anonymous donors. (Message edited by slaughter on November 15, 2005) | ||
| Matty |
Hmm. We'll need to get some field operatives to measure up the rim spec on the 250 Kaw. If the hub width isn't too great we could use them on the stock Blast swingarm and use a tensioner setup for the chain. That would save some $$$. Just a thought for Erik and James to ponder. (hint, hint) | ||
| Jprovo |
I'll be going through NRS this weekend... Number 763. I'm getting anxious about it... I'll be at teh track friday night. Where should I set up pit?? Across the house of Charmin, or closer to the schoolhouse? James | ||
| Jprovo |
That is an intresting thought Matty... I wonder if it would be cheaper to make a 250 Kaw wheel work, or just make a sprocket adapter plate. James | ||
| Matty |
If the Kaw wheel is lighter than the Blast wheel (should be!) that'd be the ticket. The sprockets and brake disc would be straight forward bolt on stuff. The sprocket adapter for the Blast rim sounds like a pain in the booty. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
BMHD-Ralph is also the first person to jump up and down about NOT using a front tire on the rear!!! I'm all for an additional class for the hybrids/experimentals to run in. I'm against modifying the 500 singles rules to allow wheel & fork changes,etc. As the rules state its to keep the cost down and be accessible. I dont like to perpetuate the idea that to race a Blast, you buy one, then throw everything but the engine in the trash.I liked the idea of Jim last month throwing some pegs and bars on a stock Blast and being able to go racing.Once the tuber/XB Blasts become unbeatable, they'll need another class to race in. As of now,they dont seem to have an edge. As I read, changing wheels is not legal in the singles class. And as most who know me know, I'd rather stick with a belt than switch to a chain! I do wonder if widening a stock wheel would be legal? JProvo: I sure wished you'd sent me your new racer number. I would have left the 3 on the plate instead of the 0 !!! | ||
| Jprovo |
JProvo: I sure wished you'd sent me your new racer number. I would have left the 3 on the plate instead of the 0 !!! DOH!! I thought I did... James | ||
| Ezblast |
True Erik, but he's always been on the look out for better tire options and since the 250 runs the same size rims he's been checking out their various racing forums to see what they are running, and that is where he changed his mind - lol GT - JBOTDS! EZ | ||
| Ezblast |
True Kosman could do the wheel widening, there are other shops as well now that street fighters are getting popular - lol GT - JBOTDS! EZ | ||
| Matty |
I'm with you on making people aware that a stock Blast chassis is a great track tool. However, }I'm against modifying the 500 singles rules to allow wheel & fork changes,etc. As the rules state its to keep the cost down and be accessible. } That's exactly why Larry is pushing to change that rule. The cost of Ascot tires is going through the roof since availability is controlled by the folks in AHRMA. To sidestep this issue, he's proposing a rule change to 1. save money and 2. keep tires accessible. If you were to widen the stock rim, does that open the door to some better tire choices? If so, that'd be great if it's allowable by the rule. I'm thinking that it would be much cheaper however, to find a 16' rim in a salvage yard than to widen the stock rim. I went to the 17" because I had them. I also wanted to have a better choice of tires available at the track, and I'm familiar with the compounds. It would have cost me as much to buy the replacement blast forks and front wheel assembly as it did to buy the XB front end. I'm all about saving money! I'm sure the rule will change to allow other rims, so I'm just getting a head start to keep in front of him! | ||
| Naustin |
We were talking about front tires having to be reversed when used on the rear -- since they are built to withstand braking forces, and when put on the back, they experience acceleration forces in the opposite direction. Ralph says: I was just chatting with the Ninja 250 Racers using the Dunlop GT501 (front) on the rear. And they said they are NOT reversing the direction of the tire(arrow). They've been racing these tires that way since around yr 2000.... And they report No Problems ! (Tell That To GearheadErikO!) ~Ralph | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
As far as front tires on the rear, we did notice at Willow Springs that some bikes in some classes were running fronts on the rear. I'm not against it, but I'm not a big fan of Dunlops either! Gotta go now, got a race bike to finish prepping!!! Wish us luck! |
