| Author | Message | ||
     Prozac235 |
Well the manual says that the bike has to be hot with the engine running. Well with the engine running and all the vibration how could you get an accurate level? I've been just checking it when it's hot and on a flat surface with the engine off. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
That is a typo in the manual. Check when turned off only. | ||
| Prozac235 |
That's what I was thinking lol | ||
| Newblaster |
Not even thinking about vibration, how are you going to get the oil level when most of it is in circulation? lol... | ||
| Dustyjacket |
Gearheaderiko - I don't want this to sound like an insult, but what basis do you use to say check the oil when the engine is off? (I know the service manual says OFF, but what if the Service Manual is wrong and the owner's manual is right?) Are people guessing? Has Buell issued a notice on this? | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
You'd have to try harder than that to insult me! Good question. I personally (& on a professional basis) have never run across an auto/mc engine where the oil is checked with the engine running . Given that and the discrepancy between the service and owners manual, I'm inclined to believe engine off. It also gets a little messy with the engine running.Many (including me) have tried both ways and have come to the same conclusion. I do not know if it has been addressed by Buell along with the seemingly endless misprints,typos,errors and misleadings in the service & owners manuals. | ||
| Dustyjacket |
Thanks. I have been doing it with the engine on and it is a pain. I'll try both and compare the results. Mine is leaking oil (probably rocker cover gasket) so I need to keep a close eye on this. | ||
| Naustin |
My Harley Shop Mechanic went over the bike with me when I bought it to point out things to check. Tire pressure, wear on the tires, battery, all the control locations, and so on. He was very specific on the procedure to check the oil. Engine HOT, but Off. He pulled the dip stick and showed me that when it's cold, it will be much lower on the level than when it is hot. He was pretty nervous about the oil level, and actually decided to add a little before I left with the bike (it was cold and just up to the bottom line.) He put it up to just over the bottom line, and warned me that much more than that, and it might overflow when it gets warmed up. SO. Engine Hot, and Off. (I check mine after every couple of rides when it's good and hot and make sure it is up to the top line.)  | ||
| Tnthumper |
anybody who has the smarts and abilities i want a combo dipstick oil temp guage for the Blast. if anyone can come up with it may be able to patent and sell to Buell. just an idea | ||
| Naustin |
Now there's a good idea. That would be handy so that you always check it when it is up to temp. (Message edited by naustin on August 25, 2005) | ||
| Rainman |
Hey folks, I'm still confused about this oil thing: I've had my Blast for two weeks and I checked the oil but had almost none on the dipstick. I could see oil in the frame, but none on the stick. Then I realized I had not ridden for 10 minutes, just down the street to do an interview (I ride to work and work to ride) so the oil wasn't hot. Is this a pain or what? Is there an easier way to make sure you have enough fluid? Any noises (other than crunch-boom) I should listen for that may indicate not enough oil? (My old Subaru would make this hideous ticking noise) Also, I have a small fluid leak around the clutch cable at the point where it enters the case. Not much, just enough to slime the cable and attract dirt. Is it worth fixing at the 1,000-mile check up? Thanks, | ||
| Buellistic |
Rainman: The BEST WAY is to check oil after a RIDE or if a very long RIDE, during the ride ... IMHO at the end of the days ride is good ... Oil should be between the low and full marks ... In BLASTing LaFayette | ||
| Ezblast |
Engine off! | ||
| Swampy |
Just get in the habit of checking the oil and if need be replentishing it at the end of each ride. If it was a short ride, it may not seem to have enough due to heat expansion, if you can see it in the frame, you are OK. I can't get my boys to figure it out, it must be rocket science to them. | ||
| Swampy |
And just for the sake of argument, I would say you could probably safely check your oil when the engine is running. It is a dry sump system so the oil that is splashing around would just settle to the bottom of the crankcase when it is shut off. My recommendation however is to SHUT THE ENGINE OFF WHEN CHECKING THE OIL. There is less chance for bad things to happen like the bike vibrating off its stand when you go to get the oil can or funnel thats at the other side of the garage! let the fun begin...again! | ||
| Rainman |
Thanks guys. I tend to drive a lot of short hops from work to interviews, 10 miles or less at a time so I think I may have to extend my drive time a bit before I check the oil, especially as it's been chilly around here lately (45 degrees). I've gone back in the posts and found some extensive commentary on the oil checking procedures and I think I'm pretty safe. I'll just try and get a good ride in to check it. It's an odd way to do things and goes against common practice for checking oil, but hey, it's a Buell and that's the whole idea. | ||
| Buellistic |
IMHO, Up Right, and "ENGINE ON" ... | ||
| Ezblast |
You will get a more accurate reading - engine off. GT - JBOTDS! EZ  | ||
| Buellistic |
What about drain back ??? | ||
| Ezblast |
Check as soon as you shut down - no vibration, and drain back takes a small bit of time to kick in - your reading is then very accurate - with no sloshing and vibration to give errors. Usually 1/2 hour riding is enough time to ensure a good reading. Carefull adding oil - there is only a few ounces between the bottom of the stick and the top mark. GT - JBOTDS! EZ | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
Engine off. 'Engine on' is a typo or proof reading mistake. But there is 100% concurrence that the most accurate way is that it should be checked immediately after a ride. Quick quiz:How many engines do you know of that the engine oil is checked with the engine running? (auto & motorcycle only). | ||
| Swampy |
HEY, WELCOME TO THE BOARD RAINMAN! I forgot that! The correct answer is......I dunno? Is there one? Ok, for the sake of argument, how much oil is drainback or thermal expansion/contraction? The oil would have to drainback through the oil pump gearrotors on the scavange side. Apparently there is a new style oil pump that has a larger scavange side gearrotor(Ask me how I know) for better scavanging of the oil sump at idle. One of you warm weather boys try this little experiment for the good of the Thumper Forum, a)engine hot, idle for say 5 minutes, shut it off, check the oil. -then- b)engine hot, run at a high RPM for a short while before shutting down, then check the oil. Just wondering if letting it idle before shutting it down would leave more oil in the sump resulting in a lower indicated oil level. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
Experience tells me the 5 minute run will come up short on oil, but I'll try the experiment the next race day-that should definitely show the 2 extremes! | ||
| Berkshire |
just to muddy the waters a little more...  To get the most accurate reading, I pull the dipstick out and wipe it off while the engine is still running after a good ride. Then I shut the engine down and immediately screw the dipstick back in and out again to check the level. That way, everything is nice and warm, there is no vibration, and no time for drainback. If the engine is cold and I'm running late and I have a long way to go, I just look to make sure that there is *some* oil on the dipstick, even if it's just at the bottom tip. When it warms up, it will at least be up to the bottom mark. I carry oil in 6 oz. medicine bottles, so I can check it properly at gas stops and add "one" when it gets down to the bottom mark. I used to very careful about checking the oil level and keeping it filled up exactly to the top mark. Then I realized something: this is a dry-sump system, and the space between the top and bottom marks on the dipstick only represents about 5% of the total system capacity (about 6 oz. from low mark to high, and 2.5 quart capacity). In other words, when the oil gets down to the bottom tip of the dipstick, you're NOT almost out of oil - you still have 95% - no reason to panic! As long as there is *some* oil way down at the bottom of the tank (about 6" below the dipstick!), the oil pump will get a steady supply, and the engine will get lubricated. In contrast: all of the cars I've ever driven have had wet-sump systems, and the difference between the top and bottom marks on the dipstick represents about 20% of the total system capacity (5-quart capacity, low mark says "add 1 quart"). In a wet-sump system, low oil level can uncover the oil pickup during hard cornering, and high oil level can cause the crankshaft to whip up the oil into a froth like a blender. This is not a problem with a dry-sump system, and since bikes lean into the corners, it wouldn't be a problem anyway (no "sideways" force on the fluids). Having said all that, I still would NOT ride with the oil level below the bottom of the stick (well, OK, I would ride up to the store to get more oil), because the oil doesn't just lubricate - it also helps cool the engine! The fuller the oil tank is, the longer the oil sits there before getting pumped back to the engine again. The longer the oil sits in the tank, the cooler it gets. So to properly cool those red-hot engine parts, the oil tank needs to be pretty much full... but there's no reason to freak out if it gets a little low, and no reason to worry too much about using the exact proper technique to check it. * This is just one guy's opinion - always follow manufacturers recommendations! | ||
| Ezblast |
2.0 qt capacity. GT - JBOTDS! EZ | ||
| Swampy |
Berkshire, 'SPLAINED it perfectly! I can't wait for the results Gearheaderiko! I guess the experiment needs two more checks done on the same sample bike after check a and b: c) Cold engine, unstarted. d) Cold engine, engine run for a short while with RPMs elevated(to scavange the sump) c and d would examine differences between drainback, thermal expansion and scavenging. | ||
| Berkshire |
2.0 qt capacity yep... I could swear I saw something somewhere about a bigger oil filter that would increase total capacity from 2.5 quarts to a full 3 quarts - I must be loosing my mind! | ||
| Buellistic |
With an aftermarket exhaust you probably could run a FORD Motorcraft FL-1A ??? | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
There is an oil line in the way. You'd never fit the wide FL-1A. A deeper/longer filter is the only way to go. Thats not to say you couldnt put an extra oil tank where the air box goes, but I thinks thats really overkill. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
The Oil Test Blast not started for 2 months/cold: frame in filler hole bone dry (no oil). 1 minute of cranking (no start): oil just above frame. 5 minutes fast idle: oil touches bottom of dipstick. 1 hour later (not running): oil still at bottom of dipstick. After 20 minutes running at high rpms: oil 1/3 between oil level lines. After sitting for 1 hour: oil at lower level line. Initial conclusions: That if the bike has sat and shows no oil, it may still be between the lines when hot. 5 minutes at fast idle isnt enough to bring the oil level up for an accurate check. The oil level will drop about 1/3 of the distance between the 2 oil level lines after sitting for an hour when hot. Given the changing nature of the oil level 'between the lines' is good enough when hot (whether you screw the dipstick in or not). All readings my readings are with the dipstick screwed in. Unfortunately, because of rapidly changing weather conditions, some tests were not performed, but it did yield some answers (or more questions). | ||
| 08uly |
With the Ulysses you learn there is a sweet spot where the oil level likes to be at. On my '08 it's about two X's above add. Much higher and it just gets puked and burnt. Does the same hold true for the Blast? My new '01 (used) Thumper only has about 1,300 miles on it and a hot check puts the oil just at the high mark. I'm noticing some smoke from the exhaust when it's run up to temp. The breather is still routed to the pro-series intake so I'm wondering if this is just an above sweet-spot condition and I'm seeing burnt oil vapor smoke? Seems hard to believe that valve guides or rings could be an issue at only 1,300 miles? Have you all found an oil level sweet-spot for the Blast in general? I'd imagine it's closer to the add mark if so. --- 08Uly Uly Data Page Blast Data Page  | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
Oil Level Sweet Spot? Thats a little too OCD, even for me LOL! Seriously though, given the great variance in oil level on the Blast, I think between the lines is good enough for most. If its really hot then the top line is full, but if its not then it can be anywhere from fill to full. Let the Blast sit for a month, check it cold and you'll be able to see the frame rail (empty), warm it up and it will be at the full line. An 01 at 1300 miles might have seen very poor warm up practices and I assume you changed the oil. The Blast doesnt like thin oil. | ||
| Reuel |
A few people here have found that if they go higher than halfway between low and full, it pukes oil. Mine doesn't seem to care either way. If it's that old with that few miles, the best thing is to make sure you have nice fresh natural oil, and go spank the hell out of it! It still needs some more breaking in. Once you get some more break-in time, change the paper rocker box gasket with the more modern gasket so it won't leak all over the place when it reaches 5000 miles or so. Not oil related side note: If (when?) a bolt breaks on the front of the head, make sure you change it with the exact bolt listed in the Blast parts manual. Any old Grade 8 or whatever will break again. | ||
| Swampy |
True about break-in period, you just need to get about 4,000 miles on it before you get to the "Sweet Spot" where everything comes together. Strange but True..... |
