| Author | Message | ||
     Classax |
No, I'm speaking specifically of the 2 hour 170 mile test ride I did on the MV F3 800. I learned years ago not to put too much stock in the ramblings of professional critiques and draw my opinions from direct experience when possible and to be open minded about it when not. All bikes drop in value quite bit the moment its rolled off the showroom floor. They may recover some of that due to demand rarity but they drop. Heck they often drop over time when still brand new. If someone wants to sport the same paint as their favorite racer, more power to them. That should not be confused with thinking said replica can match or is correlative to the degree of disparity of performance to the machines on the track. Ride what you like, to do that you have to understand why you like it. (Message edited by classax on May 11, 2014) | ||
| Trojan |
I'm waiting for Court to put a positive spin on todays events, and tell us that everyone at EBR is still ecstatically happy with WSB progress ? I've been around racers all my life, and have never met one that would be anything but livid after another shambles like today  Anyone on the team who is happy with the reults so far should be out of a job. | ||
| Sparky |
May finished R2 but seemed to deliberately slow to let the leaders go by near the last turn of the last lap - nice sportsmanship gesture. | ||
| Firstbuell |
Geoff's 18th place in R2 is EBR's SBK hi-water mark, correct? | ||
| Neutrum |
... (Message edited by Neutrum on May 11, 2014) | ||
| Jaimec |
With the recent surge from Honda in both MotoGP AND WSBK, the European motorcycle scene is REALLY beginning to SUCK BIG time for me. And DMG isn't helping any with their abbreviated calendar either... | ||
| Crusty |
Matt, you're right. EBR should pull out of WSBK racing. The bikes are shit. The riders are shit. The team is shit. Everything they do is wrong and an embarrassment to the prestige of such a high class sporting event. (an event that's held in such high regard that my cable TV provider doesn't even offer the cable channel that shows it) All true EBR supporters should slink away in abject humiliation. In the meantime, I'm too stupid to quit pulling for them, and I will savor what successes I can find. Your constant whining does get on my nerves, though. | ||
| Court |
Whining doesn't bother me ...... I'm thrilled for the EBR folks. They are in the series. They have talented folks they've got great sponsors who are in it for the long haul. 4 years ago EBR and Motus were in pretty much tbe same place. Sure, Motus had more folks and an organized PR effort. Today EBR has nearly 200 folks,is making money on the way to a public offering and has a plan Shame to see the performance, in WSBK, to date. But I am not unaware that racing is bit one component and that EBR has the folks and resources to improve. Most of my personal successes have been preceded by some notable ass kickings ..... They slow me down, never stopped me. I remain, after 30 years, a firm and radiant supporter. And, Niall candor, if anything in my life cussed me to constant whine, bemoan and complain .... I'd reevaluate my hobbies. EBR is going to do great. Bank on it. (Message edited by Court on May 11, 2014) | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
No, I'm speaking specifically of the 2 hour 170 mile test ride I did on the MV F3 800. Seems obvious you believe the EBR to be a better bike. Please do tell us why. This should be good. I learned years ago not to put too much stock in the ramblings of professional critiques and draw my opinions from direct experience when possible and to be open minded about it when not. You describe and champion things which are not exclusive to you. Yet you state them as if you're better placed to form an opinion than others. It appears to be a habit of yours. I've ridden enough MV's and read MCN for 40 years, I believe I'm able to know when to trust what I read thank you. It's not like MV have ever built a bad bike is it. Not even an average one come to it. They build the best and are world renowned for it. Rocket in England | ||
| Splatter |
Court your optimism and positive attitude are refreshing and the perfect antidote to all the negativity in this thread. People who actually accomplish things are always the target of stone throwing by the naysayers but they accomplish more every day than the arm chair quarterbacks will accomplish in their life times. | ||
| Gregtonn |
"I'm waiting for Court to put a positive spin on todays events..." We surely didn't have to wait long for your negative sniping. It is becoming tiresome. If you have such a low opinion of EBR it seems you wouldn't bother coming here. Some of us have more realistic expectations of a motorcycle company that didn't even exist four years ago. G | ||
| Sparky |
Imagine, a relatively new company is developing a brand new street bike into a homologated world class superbike on the world's stage starting from ground zero with a fresh bike, fresh team and riders learning new tracks while compiling fresh data. Did you see the winner greet his wife and baby after the second race? EBR is like that baby. We are watching a future Olympian runner (EBR) like that baby learning to walk. Get up, fall down, get up again, take a step, fall down, get up again, take more steps. Personally, I think we are witnessing the start of one of the great stories in motorcycling. Court, have you started writing this chapter? | ||
| Hughlysses |
EBR posted to FB that they will take part in the official testing session tomorrow. Hopefully this will give them a chance to gain some ground. | ||
| Bob_thompson |
Sparky: "Imagine, a relatively new company is developing a brand new street bike into a homologated world class superbike on the world's stage starting from ground zero with a fresh bike, fresh team and riders learning new tracks while compiling fresh data." I strongly agree Darryl and will ad my take. In the second race EBR's Geoff May came in 18th ahead of Ducati's, BMW's, Kawasaki's, MV Agusta's and Bimota's mostly running in the EVO class. Now even though EBR chose not to run in that: From the WSB site: The aim of the new EVO rules is to reduce costs and ensure fairness for potential new teams and prevent the decline of the series. British Superbikes successfully made a similar change in 2010. The finalised regulations are to be confirmed but will involve limits on engine tuning and electronics and price caps on components. Con't: isn't that exactly what EBR is doing, running a showroom bike with no real race parts available to add, even though running with the very big, multi million dollar teams who have been racing a very long time and have deep pockets. I personally thing that is a pretty darn good improvement in a very short time. | ||
| Johnbranx1 |
Tough day at the office at Imola. To think that a company that did not even exist 4 years ago is in WSBK. I love EBR's for the unique design features and this is the first time they are being developed to compete at the world level. It will take time. Go EBR! | ||
| Rex |
sounds exciting....Hummmmm, EBR for a public offering.......that sounds good. would like to have a framed Stock of EBR on my wall...... | ||
| Crusty |
would like to have a framed Stock of EBR on my wall...... +1  | ||
| Hughlysses |
So, back to this weekend's results. Geoff had a DNS and a decent finish, and Aaron had two DNF's. Any idea what happened? Doesn't Geoff finally earn some points for a top-20 finish? (Message edited by Hughlysses on May 11, 2014) | ||
| Rsh |
I believe WSBK only scores to 15th place with the scoring listed as follows: Position/Points 1=25 2=20 3=16 4=13 5=11 6=10 7=9 8=8 9=7 10=6 11=5 12=4 13=3 14=2 15=1 | ||
| Classax |
Seems obvious you believe the EBR to be a better bike. Please do tell us why. This should be good. Be happy to discuss it in the appropriate thread, but in short my opinions are valid for me and may or may not be applicable or reflective of someone else's. Ride what you like, just know why you like it. Classax wrote "I learned years ago not to put too much stock in the ramblings of professional critiques and draw my opinions from direct experience when possible and to be open minded about it when not." You describe and champion things which are not exclusive to you.OK......  Should I take this to mean that I express similar thoughts and expressions to those who have similar experiences, training and knowledge? Thanks I guess. Yet you state them as if you're better placed to form an opinion than others. It appears to be a habit of yours. I'm only in a position to offer my own fallible opinion on my experience of the world which goes with out saying is only confined to my limited span of knowledge. Happy to share it, happy to learn from others, but everyone is different and one has to find one's own balance, particularly on matter of that are of a subjective nature. I've ridden enough MV's and read MCN for 40 years, I believe I'm able to know when to trust what I read thank you. Good then you'll have experienced what we all have from time to time. That professional critiques can be jaded from over exposure, driven by financial concerns, or simply do not have the same tastes or views as their audiences. Doesn't mean they are wrong or always right. We all take it with a grain of salt until we can personally if ever get first hand knowledge to make our own judgments. It's not like MV have ever built a bad bike is it. Not even an average one come to it. They build the best and are world renowned for it. MV build beautiful bikes. Works of Mechanical Art as the name implies. Have they had their struggles and niggles? YES! The F3 & F4 are nice, the F3 800 even nicer, all of which I rode before buying the EBR. I wouldn't mind owning any of them, I happen to prefer the EBR or an RSV4 over them. Some people may prefer the MV quirks- let's call them character traits, I didn't but that doesn't mean one is better than the other, one was better suited for and thus to, ME. Ride what you like. I really hope the team can get a good test in tomorrow. They really need to be able to demonstrate they can go race distances as the next step. After that making super pole and beyond that top 15s so they can score points. Long tough road ahead but I think they have the fortitude to get there. I don't think top 15's is too much to ask by the end of the season. Go EBR! | ||
| Blake |
May went from 26th to 18th in race 2 after having missed most of race 1? On account of everyone else crashed or broke. Three DNFs and one last place. I agrees with Matt. If any on the team are happy with such results, they need fired. But this is hopefully a straw man. No one on the team is happy to be failing so massively. That doesn't mean they should keep their job. Failure, repeated patterns of failure, warrant consequence. I also agree with Court. Expect to see EBR do great. The two observations are not mutually exclusive. | ||
| Trojan |
Matt, you're right. EBR should pull out of WSBK racing. The bikes are shit. The riders are shit. The team is shit. Everything they do is wrong and an embarrassment to the prestige of such a high class sporting event. (an event that's held in such high regard that my cable TV provider doesn't even offer the cable channel that shows it) All true EBR supporters should slink away in abject humiliation. In the meantime, I'm too stupid to quit pulling for them, and I will savor what successes I can find. Your constant whining does get on my nerves, though. Do yo know what. I give up. This is WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP racing, not testing or club racing. If you are happy with the emperors new clothes then fine. I like to see a team in WSb that can actually at least compete witht eh other teams present. By the way, do you think that any other manufacturer team would be happy with the peformances so far? No, they would be sacking team personnel and making drastic changes, not just fannying around with a few new parts. Being happy about finishing 18th and a lap behind as a high point for the weekend is not a result I'd be celebrating. MV haven't had a great start either and had a couple of DNF's, but at least they were running mid pack when they crashed out, and turn up at every round with some major upgrades. I'd rather see EBR sit out a few rounds and concentrate on gettting the bike sorted and competitive than continue to embarrass themselves each weekend. | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
This is WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP racing, not testing or club racing. Exactly - Its prestige should not be diminished by teams that can't run at world championship pace. Rocket in England | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
Good then you'll have experienced what we all have from time to time. That professional critiques can be jaded from over exposure, driven by financial concerns, or simply do not have the same tastes or views as their audiences. Doesn't mean they are wrong or always right. We all take it with a grain of salt until we can personally if ever get first hand knowledge to make our own judgments. You do know how many people buy bikes based on road test reviews, having never ridden them themselves? So you test rode the MV's and the RSV4, and you bought an EBR. I'm curious. Did you test the EBR before you bought it? Rocket in England | ||
| Hughlysses |
Mentioned earlier, but to repeat for those that may have missed it:  This can't hurt their effort any. | ||
| Trojan |
press release issued by Team HERO EBR: Team Hero EBR continue to work on setup in Imola A packed Imola circuit in Northern Italy played host to the fourth round of this year’s World Superbike championship with Team Hero EBR riders Geoff May and Aaron Yates in action once again. Race 1, held at 1030 local time was a disappointment for the team, after the positives taken during the weekend as both riders failed to finish. Geoff was unable to start after a small problem during warm up couldn’t be fixed and Aaron retired mid race after another great start had seen move forward a couple of places. Race 2 was held in similar warm conditions and both riders were able to participate. Unfortunately Aaron was unable tocomplete the race because of a technical problem but Geoff salvaged an 18th position finish after another weekend of hard work and determination from the whole team. Aaron Yates: “I really enjoyed racing here and Imola is definitely now one of my favorite race tracks. Unfortunately we had some troubles today and I am sorry that we can’t finish the races. Anyway, we made some progress during the weekend and I am sure we will soon be more competitive.” Geoff May: ”I am sorry I didn’t the chance to ride in Race 1 because my intent is collect much data as possible in order to develop the bike alongside my mechanics. In race 2 we completed the race and I improved the feeling with the bike. Now I want focus on the next race in Donington, where I’m sure we will continue to make some further improvements.” Giulio Bardi – Team Manager: “Obviously I would like a better result, but from our side what really matters is constantly improving throughout the season. Every race is like a test for us and after each race we become stronger than before. I know our team is doing its best to improve the EBR 1190RX and I am sure we will soon get some good results.” | ||
| Trojan |
Imola World Superbike session one - conditions dry 1 65 J. REA GBR PATA Honda World Superbike Honda CBR1000RR 1'47.419 29 165,423 2 34 D. GIUGLIANO ITA Ducati Superbike Team Ducati 1199 Panigale R 1'47.589 0.170 0.170 31 165,162 3 22 A. LOWES GBR Voltcom Crescent Suzuki Suzuki GSX-R1000 1'47.628 0.209 0.039 31 165,102 4 33 M. MELANDRI ITA Aprilia Racing Team Aprilia RSV4 Factory 1'47.636 0.217 0.008 34 165,090 5 50 S. GUINTOLI FRA Aprilia Racing Team Aprilia RSV4 Factory 1'47.849 0.430 0.213 20 164,764 6 24 T. ELIAS ESP Red Devils Roma Aprilia RSV4 Factory 1'47.961 0.542 0.112 50 164,593 7 91 L. HASLAM GBR PATA Honda World Superbike Honda CBR1000RR 1'48.058 0.639 0.097 43 164,445 8 58 E. LAVERTY IRL Voltcom Crescent Suzuki Suzuki GSX-R1000 1'48.318 0.899 0.260 34 164,050 9 7 C. DAVIES GBR Ducati Superbike Team Ducati 1199 Panigale R 1'48.441 1.022 0.123 24 163,864 10 19 L. CAMIER GBR BMW Motorrad Italia SBK BMW S1000 RR EVO 1'48.755 1.336 0.314 39 163,391 11 59 N. CANEPA ITA Althea Racing Ducati 1199 Panigale R EVO 1'48.756 1.337 0.001 28 163,390 12 86 A. BADOVINI ITA Team Bimota Alstare Bimota BB3 EVO 1'49.440 2.021 0.684 25 162,368 13 132 L. SAVADORI ITA Team Pedercini Kawasaki ZX-10R 1'49.467 2.048 0.027 22 162,328 14 71 C. CORTI ITA MV Agusta RC-Yakhnich M. MV Agusta F4 RR 1'49.670 2.251 0.203 15 162,028 15 23 L. SCASSA ITA Team Pedercini Kawasaki ZX-10R EVO 1'49.948 2.529 0.278 45 161,618 16 2 C. IDDON GBR Team Bimota Alstare Bimota BB3 EVO 1'50.248 2.829 0.300 27 161,178 17 11 J. GUARNONI FRA MRS Kawasaki Kawasaki ZX-10R EVO 1'50.583 3.164 0.335 27 160,690 18 9 F. FORET FRA MAHI Racing Team India Kawasaki ZX-10R EVO 1'50.801 3.382 0.218 14 160,374 19 21 A. ANDREOZZI ITA Team Pedercini Kawasaki ZX-10R EVO 1'50.962 3.543 0.161 29 160,141 20 10 I. TOTH HUN BMW Team Toth BMW S1000 RR 1'51.086 3.667 0.124 36 159,963 21 99 G. MAY USA Team Hero EBR EBR 1190 RX 1'52.433 5.014 1.347 29 158,046 Those are the only results posted so far so I don't know if Aaron Yates is running in testing or not? No factory Kawasaki there either by the look of it. | ||
| Classax |
By the way, do you think that any other manufacturer team would be happy with the peformances so far? No, they would be sacking team personnel and making drastic changes, not just fannying around with a few new parts. Being happy about finishing 18th and a lap behind as a high point for the weekend is not a result I'd be celebrating. MV haven't had a great start either and had a couple of DNF's, but at least they were running mid pack when they crashed out, and turn up at every round with some major upgrades. I'd rather see EBR sit out a few rounds and concentrate on gettting the bike sorted and competitive than continue to embarrass themselves each weekend. I don't think any one at EBR is HAPPY about the performance they are achieving to date, but "you have to make the best of what you have until what you have is the best." From the beginning they have always said this will be a"learning year", though its clear they are not satisfied with their performance to date. Firing the techs, or riders, or team members that to date are your only source of experience, just for show(it would be for show because no one else has worked on the bikes and team so you start the learning curve all over) would be shooting themselves in the foot, at least so one would think. Bench racing and racing have almost always yield different results. If they have the cash and the fortitude to test/develop their machine in WSb, as long as they can make the grid and don't oil down the tracks, I say more power to them. Sometimes one has to endure what to others or even one's self, would seem embarrassing failures, until you finally hit upon that combination of luck, skill, knowledge, and experience that yields success. When the company racing is one founded by a guy who has twice had the rug pulled out from under him only to knuckle down and recover, words like "give up" or "quit" aren't likely to be in the lexicon or if they are, they're reserved for much more drastic situations. I wish them well. Go EBR! | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
Bench racing and racing have almost always yield different results. If they have the cash and the fortitude to test/develop their machine in WSb, as long as they can make the grid and don't oil down the tracks, I say more power to them. Sometimes one has to endure what to others or even one's self, would seem embarrassing failures, until you finally hit upon that combination of luck, skill, knowledge, and experience that yields success. When the company racing is one founded by a guy who has twice had the rug pulled out from under him only to knuckle down and recover, words like "give up" or "quit" aren't likely to be in the lexicon or if they are, they're reserved for much more drastic situations. I wish them well. Go EBR! There are perhaps more appropriate categories or championships than WSBK. British SBK would have been a more competitive series for EBR possibly, and a series where a good showing would have yielded EBR some great kudos on the international stage. Rocket in England | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
Rocket said, "so you test rode the MV's and the RSV4, and you bought an EBR." I ask again. Did you test the EBR before you bought it? Rocket in England |
