| Author | Message | ||
     M2typhoon |
Why would I buy a Bimota when it's just a redone BMW? | ||
| Ljm |
At the risk of being redundant (maybe this is number 11) Aaron said in an article that he had a two year contract, with the first in AMA, second in WSBK. He would have signed that in 2012 following the close of the 2012 season. So they knew they were headed toward WSBK then. Perhaps what they didn't know at that point when making that decision was that the AMA would last another year, i.e. they saw it as the only option to move to WSBK. They probably also didn't know that you could just enter without homologation like Bimota did. That certainly would have been the easiest course. They wouldn't have had to mess with that building motorcycles for sale, certifying them with the EPA, building a dealer network and parts chain, etc. One thing I have appreciated is that despite the other things going on, EBR actually calls or emails and talks about my bikes if questions come up. | ||
| Court |
>>>They wouldn't have had to mess with that building motorcycles for sale, certifying them with the EPA, building a dealer network and parts chain, etc. Point is . . . that's the very purpose. Folks, I fear, haven't a clue as to what the "EBR big picture" looks like. For 4 years, no one ask so much as asked . . . "hey, with 70 engineers in that building, some of the best talent in the world, working 6 long days a week . . . what's coming out". Predictably, and . . . . admittedly entertaining to some . . . folks have been standing before the shipping door expecting Erik to be struggling to "get back to where Buell was". Not even part of what's on the radar. EBR probably hired more folks the 1st quarter of 2014 than Bimota has . . . . Keep riding, keep watching. . . . this is gonna be good. In the meanwhile I'm going to continue to enjoy the dialogue of folks who think Erik Buell is a neophyte learning about motorcycle racing. | ||
| Trojan |
EBR is racing for a reason and it's not . . . as you suggest . . some hazily thrown together plan that grew out of a night in a pub. i didn't suggest it was, I suggested it could be an explanation for their current loack of pace. Nice try , . . . but Bimota are total and complete amateurs. With a race record that EBR can only dream of at the moment. Bimota have had hard times but they have made some very special bikes over the years. Erik Buell of all people should know what it is like to lose funding and be suddenly thrown into turmoil, which is what has happened at Bimota in the paast. They may not have homologated bikes in the US recently but you can order and buy from the factory in Italy if you want one here. | ||
| Court |
>>>>One thing I have appreciated is that despite the other things going on Wrong . . . . if you are an EBR customer you ARE "what's going on". You're satisfaction and delight comes ahead of racing and, frankly, anything else. That's the way it is. . . . it's a culture. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Folks, I fear, haven't a clue as to what the "EBR big picture" looks like. For 4 years, no one ask so much as asked . . . "hey, with 70 engineers in that building, some of the best talent in the world, working 6 long days a week . . . what's coming out". OK, I've definitely wondered, and I'm asking now....  Hmmm, maybe the 2nd part of my "2 possibilities" for the EBR WSBK teams post above is correct. Nobody ever said the RX or RS would be the ultimate top-of-the-line EBR motorcycle. Maybe ~10 of those 70 guys have been working on a 350 pound (in street trim), 250 HP (in street trim), inverted W-8 WSBK dominator bike. Aaron and Geoff may be just collecting data for the GPS enabled anti-wheelie/traction control/ABS system for next season...or not.  | ||
| Tpoppa |
This thread is absolutely hilarious! Some of the old timers here should try really hard to understand this (you know who you are): ob·jec·tive 1. (of a person or judgment) not influenced by personal feelings or opinions in considering and representing facts. | ||
| Crusty |
This thread is absolutely hilarious! Some of the old timers here should try really hard to understand this (you know who you are): ob·jec·tive 1. (of a person or judgment) not influenced by personal feelings or opinions in considering and representing facts. Why? Is this an impartial WSBK discussion forum (yeah, Right!) or is this a forum for Buell and EBR enthusiasts? I believe that 1)All motorcycles are emotionally charged, and racing is also highly emotional in nature. 2) I have a great amount of faith and enthusiasm for Erik Buell and all who are associated with him. Why shouldn't I be enthusiastic and positive? I personally have seen just how dedicated Erik and the Elves are, and what lengths they'll go to to do the Right Thing for their customers. In 1999, when my S3-T was dead on the side of the road, the head of Buell Customer Service (Bill Bailey)told me that I would be at Homecoming the following week if he had to come out to Massachusetts and bring me back himself. The next day, my bike was completely repaired. I don't know what strings he had to pull, or what it took to get a shop that was booked up solid for over a month to drop everything and fix my bike, but Buell earned my loyalty that day. I've never regretted that. So tell me why I'm supposed to be fickle in my loyalty and support of people who have shown me their dedication and support? I expect EBR to have a rough first year in SBK, but I'll support their effort 100% and I'll cheer them on when more "objective" people are willing to denigrate their efforts, and discount their achievements. | ||
| Tpoppa |
I posted the definition of the word objective...and then Court's post disappeared. It must be a coincidence. Please continue the hilarity. I'll try to check back in a few days. | ||
| Court |
Hahaha...... "Opinions"...... On an internet discussion forum???? What's the world come to??? I deleted the EBR v. Bimota wager ..... It's not fair to beat up on the underdog. | ||
| Tpoppa |
It's not fair to beat up on the underdog. That concern doesn't appear to be present in the WSBK paddock. | ||
| Court |
Like I said . . . let's look at the EBR and Bimota respective positions in a couple years and see how they play out. I may not be objective but I'm open minded as the dickens. I pretty much blew the entire "objective" thing (yeah, even I know the definition) back in 1989 when the tussle started over the blasphemy of making the RS1200 a single seat RSS1200 and giving up that valuable jacket trunk. You think after nearly 30 years I'd have learned my lesson . . . . . | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
Lest you forget, Bimota have already won several times in WSBK. Massimo Tamburini died a couple of weeks ago. I doubt there's no more than a handful of Americans know Tamburini is one third Bimota, or that he went on to design the worlds greatest bikes. The MV F4 and Ducati 916 to name but two. In the case of the 916, the first bike built as a race bike first, but road legal also. Something EBR pride themselves on now, some 25 years or so after the 916, with their own take on the race bike to road bike theme. As a motorcycle enthusiast, or whatever we call fan worship of two wheels, it's disgusting to hear the typically American put down of Bimota because they're beating EBR's on track currently. Show some fulking respect. Rocket in England | ||
| Court |
Who put Bimota down? I listened patiently to all that baseless (I agree with you on the historical stuff) crap about judging EBR's WSBK performance relative to Bimota. Then I was told they were similar because I can walk in and buy one . . . I can't. Then I spoke to the largest USA dealer who, like you and I had nothing but admiration and support for Tamburini and the Bimota of old, but expressed concern about the viability of the current crop trying to bring the firm out of bankruptcy. But . . . let's watch and see how time and tide treats the players. I consider it somewhat of a compliment that I'm as passionate about EBR as some of the the Europanese are about Bimota. I mean . . . . motorcycles without passion? No thanks . . .I'd walk. | ||
| Bads1 |
Why? Is this an impartial WSBK discussion forum (yeah, Right!) or is this a forum for Buell and EBR enthusiasts? I believe that This is a WSB thread in a Buell/EBR forum long before EBR existed. | ||
| Crusty |
Dana, are you saying that I should not be pulling for EBR? Badweb existed before there was a WSB thread. | ||
| Bads1 |
Not all John. We were talking WSB for a long time. We had are opinions on companies and there bikes. Now that EBR is there if your opinion isn't PRO EBR then it crucify at the stake kinda attitude is what I seem to be reading? Its racing and this shouldn't be like this here. | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
Court I was not referring to any one person. Merely asking that this doesn't turn into a put down of Bimota at the expense of understandable favouritism. Bimota have suffered massively through their checkered history. It's companies like Bimota, and EBR, that keep motorcycling more alive than the mundane offerings we'd have without forward thinking companies like these, willing to push two wheel design way past what's acceptably normal. What would be great is both EBR and Bimota fighting for the spoils someway not too close to the back. Given Bimota have the BMW engine, and Alstare running the team, beating the Bimotas at any position would be a pretty special feather in EBR's cap. Bimota should not be at all underestimated. Quite the opposite in fact. Let's hope EBR can measure up to them then, and take at least some glory from being able to do so. Rocket in England | ||
| Court |
>>>crucify at the stake kinda attitude is what I seem to be reading? You've waaaaaay misread it. Lots of folks have opinions . . . exchanging them is not "crucifixion". Matt, Rocket and I have differing opinions . . but given the cultural, geographic and background differences . . . . it'd surprise the hell outta me if we didn't. I disagree with them on some things but they are smart guys and I listen closely to their opinions. Anybody with skin too thin to handle two motorcyclist with differing opinions needs to beat feet for the knitting boards and argue wool vs. polyester skeins. | ||
| Reepicheep |
OK Court, you really did blow it that time. My wife has a friend who is a spinner, you *never* saw a flame war like a war over strings and fibers. (Don't call it yarn, they hate that for reasons that still weren't clear to me as I lost consciousness after repeated kicks to the head...) | ||
| Blake |
Acrylic! You idiots. | ||
| Trojan |
I think we all hope that EBR can have as much success on track (and be a long lasting) as Bimota have so far. However it is not wrong to compare the two bikes in WSb simply because they share the same grid and therefore have to race each other. I said before that EBR are not operating in a vacuum, so you HAVE to compare their performance against the only yardstick there is in racing....the opposition. At the moment the EBR race team (and I am making no criticism of the factory, Erik or the road bikes here) is coming up short of what is required in WSb for whatever reason. That is an entirely impartial objective view I'm afraid, and it may be proved wrong in future of course. As Rocket said, Bimota have a rich history in winning world class level races dating back to Jon Ekerold, Davide Tardozzi and even Aussie bad boy Anthony Gobert (in addition to many many national level Italian Supertwin races and supersport races). The late Massimo Tamburini was probably the best motorcycle engineer/designer the world has seen so far, and the motorcycle world would have been a lot poorer without him and without the stunning creations that have come from Bimota over the years. If you want to read a potted history of Bimota and exactly what they have achieved this is a good place to start.... http://www.fastbikesmag.com/files/2011/11/FBK251.fone_.pdf (Message edited by trojan on April 16, 2014) | ||
| Sparky |
Did any body catch this from the Cycle News link Hughlysses posted: "Both Hero EBR 1190 RX riders were present at Aragon for the second round and each had some new parts on their bikes - such as full racing front discs and other updates since the first round." Full racing front discs, huh? Like dual rim mounted or heavier duty single versions or, heaven forbid, Brembos? | ||
| Hughlysses |
^ Sparky- Judging from this photo of Aaron at Aragon from the Cycle News article, it's still a rim-mounted disk:  (Message edited by Hughlysses on April 16, 2014) | ||
| Classax |
I know its hard to believe but that single rim mounted rotor with 8 piston caliper actually stops very well. The cooling ducts actually work as well. | ||
| Bads1 |
They do but how well on the WSB tracks where the brakes may be more demanding. The put cooling duct on because they had warping issues in the past. | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
1998 S1W £8000 new (with race kit) Yamaha FZR1000 exup much cheaper. 1998 Bimota YB11 £22000 UK price.  It's easy to understand why when you look at it close up in detail. Exclusivity worth every penny. Rocket in England | ||
| Trojan |
Shorai batteries to sponsor EBr race team. No surprise really as they already supply EBR for road bike use. Here is the statement from the boss of Shorai regarding the deal..... “After solidifying our affiliation with EBR as the official OEM battery for the 1190RX Street bike, Shorai is very excited to announce a partnership with EBR’s World Superbike race team. Both Geoff and Aaron are incredibly talented riders who are expected to have great success throughout the entire 2014 Superbike season,” said Kevin Riley, Co-Founder and Executive Vice President of Sales and Marketing for Shorai. “We are confident that the EBR race bikes powered by Shorai batteries will be some of the fastest bikes on the track and we’re excited to see Geoff and Aaron compete for wins this season.” Now that guy haas had some PR training, but not watched any WSb races this season  | ||
| Jaimec |
Race bikes have batteries? | ||
| Trojan |
Modern fuel injected race bikes need to have some kind of battery to power systems, plus a lot of production based race bikes now keep the electric starter in order to restart the bike and also to meet weight limits. Not sure of EBR fits into that bracket but they would still need a small battery. |
